79 replies to this topic

[Serapth]

I think the vast majority of people will agree that a premade group is a massive advantage, damned near an "I win" button. Now I know people like padding their K/D ratios and dont want things fixed, but this certainly isn't good for the life of the game over all. Newbies are going to rage quit fast in the face of repeated premade pummelings, while those of us that PUG because of lifestyle requirements (... like having kids), well let's just say running into 4x ECM raven premades over and over loses its charm quickly.


The most infuriating problem is, this could be fixed tomorrow with an obscenely small amount of work.

The ideal solution would be to have a PuG only queue, with no premades allowed. The obvious downside to this situation is the premade queues would take longer to start. It would get especially tricky when you have 3man premades for example... trying to find that 1man that wants to be in the premade queue would take a long time. So in the end, this doesn't really work for everyone ( but would make like massively nicer for PuGers ).


The compromise solution... put one premade on each side. DONE. Problem solved, major annoyances solved, people whining that it's all premades stomping them will go away because it would be balanced. It's not a perfect fix, but it's easy, its balanced and it wouldn't negatively impact the game in any way.


Finally, to make the newbie experience a little gentler, favour match making people getting the newbie bonus against each other. As they start gaining experience against other newbies, start putting them in the regular queue more often. This would also lesson the suicide charges later on, or hopefully it would.



What I dont see here is a downside to the compromise solution. Unless they are horrific coders, which I doubt they are, it shouldn't exactly be difficult putting a premade on each team. I think the majority of people would wait a few seconds longer for a match for a more balanced and enjoyable match. The only real downside I can see to this solution is the pugstompers might see their K/D ratios go down... something I couldn't give a damn about.


I know there is grand talk about improved match making down the road, that said, they could fix things so simply now, that they should slap on a bandaid fix... as I bet they are bleeding new users from the current experience. Then again, given the recent implementation of ECM... and worse, the complete lack of feedback on the subject, I have almost no expectations...

Edited by Serapth, 03 January 2013 - 01:16 PM.

[Wizard Steve]

The player base isn't big enough to split.

[Hotthedd]

There should be a Cadet-only queue, A PUG-only queue, a mixed queue, and a 8-player team queue.

Players could then play whatever they wanted (except Cadet, which you would have to have Cadet status)

Wizard Steve, on 03 January 2013 - 01:19 PM, said:

The player base isn't big enough to split.

Yes it is

[Pando]

NO,

NO,

NO....

WAIT - for ELO matchmaking system.

[madMAx666]

Wizard Steve, on 03 January 2013 - 01:19 PM, said:

The player base isn't big enough to split.

This:

Serapth, on 03 January 2013 - 01:14 PM, said:

The compromise solution... put one premade on each side. DONE. Problem solved, major annoyances solved, people whining that it's all premades stomping them will go away because it would be balanced. It's not a perfect fix, but it's easy, its balanced and it wouldn't negatively impact the game in any way.

You dont need to split anything.

[Hotthedd]

Pando, on 03 January 2013 - 01:21 PM, said:

NO,

NO,

NO....

WAIT - for ELO matchmaking system.

ELO will not help the newbies. Having one other newbie on the other team will not make that person learn faster.

[Serapth]

Pando, on 03 January 2013 - 01:21 PM, said:

NO,

NO,

NO....

WAIT - for ELO matchmaking system.

Why?

When there is a simple enough fix that it should take less work than say... adding bobbleheads, why shouldn't they put an in-term fix while waiting for ELO.

Or, communicate with us a hell of a lot better about when ELO is coming. If it's not next patch, that's too long.

[Bigchunk1]

They already laid out their plans to address this very issue. It takes place over multiple iterations and I think we are at stage 2. I'm too lazy to find it and link it.

[Broceratops]

the pugs must be stopped

[Serapth]

Wizard Steve, on 03 January 2013 - 01:19 PM, said:

The player base isn't big enough to split.

Im not proposing splitting, im proposing putting one premade on each side. Therefore the worst case degradation is waiting for a second premade queue to come along.

Broceratops, on 03 January 2013 - 01:25 PM, said:

the pugs must be stopped

Ahhh damnit. Can't edit title either.

I shall hang my head in shame.

[Oinkage]

From everything I've read in all the forums, and all of the pod casts I've listened to, there won't be a non-community warfare mode for players that just want to play lemming mode with no regard to teamwork or objectives.

Once community warfare is in the game, players will be herded towards fighting against other players. It is very likely that the 'other players' will be organized and on a voice com system.

You won't be segregated. You will be integrated. Resistance is futile.

[Broceratops]

honestly?

because it's maybe 5 minutes easier to throw players off the queue until there are 8 on both sides than it is to add a boolean variable and a index pointer to find the next premade in a queue. and pgi digs easy.

[Terran123rd]

Hotthedd, on 03 January 2013 - 01:23 PM, said:

ELO will not help the newbies. Having one other newbie on the other team will not make that person learn faster.

Yes it will, because it means that the entire other team will also be newbs of roughly the same skill level, not just one or two.

[Serapth]

Oinkage, on 03 January 2013 - 01:27 PM, said:

From everything I've read in all the forums, and all of the pod casts I've listened to, there won't be a non-community warfare mode for players that just want to play lemming mode with no regard to teamwork or objectives.

Once community warfare is in the game, players will be herded towards fighting against other players. It is very likely that the 'other players' will be organized and on a voice com system.

You won't be segregated. You will be integrated. Resistance is futile.

Considering the game doesn't even have pre/post match chatting... that day seems a long way away. Until then, apply the band-aid.

Also, if they game does in fact go clan only, it will die fast. I know there are certain players that would absolutely love a hardcore only game, but they will be the only ones playing. Now, if they start adding better social features, that make it easier for non-premade groups to communicate, or add better mechanics for making adhoc groups, I thoroughly support this. But we are a long way from there.

[Martini Henrie]

Oh god, this again? The big bad wolf scaring you unreasonably? Not every stomp involves a TS team on the other side. It happens all the time when I pug, it's just the pattern of the game. Unless you have capable players on both teams it will difficult to consistently get 8-7 games (it's great fun cheering for the last two to drag their scrap heaps into action).

The players in their first 25 drops could be put as a priority into games with other nubes, but there is no reason not to show them the jungle, and what custom mechs can do. There is nothing more enticing than seeing a big shiney and wanting to get a piece of it.

ELO is coming, be patient. There is a lot of development going on, and unlike some other games the patches aren't half arsed. If they are the problems get solved as quick as can be expected as well.

Patience, young Padawan.

[Pando]

Hotthedd, on 03 January 2013 - 01:23 PM, said:

ELO will not help the newbies. Having one other newbie on the other team will not make that person learn faster.

ELO will help newbies. It will pit them against other newbies so combat is more-less equal. If they want to learn, they should PM better players, watch videos on youtube or JOIN groups with good players and WATCH/LEARN.

Serapth, on 03 January 2013 - 01:24 PM, said:

Why?

When there is a simple enough fix that it should take less work than say... adding bobbleheads, why shouldn't they put an in-term fix while waiting for ELO.

Or, communicate with us a hell of a lot better about when ELO is coming. If it's not next patch, that's too long.

Seriously. That's the same thing as asking a career artist (with little/no scripting language) to script edit the functionality of said "game".

Edited by Pando, 03 January 2013 - 01:31 PM.

[Hotthedd]

Terran123rd, on 03 January 2013 - 01:30 PM, said:

Yes it will, because it means that the entire other team will also be newbs of roughly the same skill level, not just one or two.

Even if there are 5 sharks and 3 minnows on each team, the minnows still face an early death. Cadet status does not last forever. Eventually (after learning a bit it is hoped) they will have to swim with the bigger fish.

[Kaboodle]

Serapth, on 03 January 2013 - 01:27 PM, said:

Im not proposing splitting, im proposing putting one premade on each side. Therefore the worst case degradation is waiting for a second premade queue to come along.

You already stated the problem with this. Only one premade per team means sometimes teams will get a team of 2, and the other team will get one of 4. Problem still exists. Just as bad as it is now essentially. Honestly, in-game voice with an extremely easy "mute this player"(for the abusers and douchebags) button next to every name when you bring up the scoreboard, is the best bet to facilitate better communication and coordination, which will result in a smaller disparity between pugs and group drops. ECM balancing would help as well. I have no problems with the current implementation of ECM. But both teams need the same amount of it, for it to be fair. Or at least close. Pitting a team of 0 ECM against a team of 3+ almost always (unless they're terrible players) results in a win for the 3+. Even 2v4 ECM results in a win for the 4 fairly easily, since they can still shield their team, and counter the enemy team, simultaneously. Balance ECM equipped mechs per team too.

[PiemasterXL]

Broceratops, on 03 January 2013 - 01:25 PM, said:

the pugs must be stopped

[Davers]

Simple fix? Yes. Good solution? No.

Can we all just be patient a little while longer to see if ELO matchmaking works?