32 replies to this topic

[MustrumRidcully]

Some people just like to see the world burn. And if they can't have that, at least alpha strike like mad, no matter the consequences.

So, here's one variant that's actually almost workable:

These 2 are designed more or less for pin-point alpha damage - if you can manage to lag shoot and beat down convergence issues at least:

A cataphract 3D with 2 Gauss Rifles and 1 PPC:
CTF-3D - Alpha-Catastrophe

The build originaly stems from the time before the last projectile speed increase. Back then, combinging PPC and Gauss was optimal, since the yhad the same flight speed. Now I am not so sure.

The mech can be made worse, e,g. even more alpha, even less heat efficient, and also brittle like hell - an exemplary glass cannon:

CTF-3D - Omega-Catastrophe

I used this one a bit, PUGging. You die quickly, and I wouldn't say you get a lot of chances of killing something with it. But it maybe the biggest (long range) alpha you can get on a 70-ton mech currently (and not explode when shooting. You just explode quickly when you getting shot at.)



EDIT:

My current Stalker Build is more a short-range alpha build, and it's not optimized really for alphas, but also for a reasonable sustainability. It should be easy to make it much, much hotter and increase its alpha potential . It even has useless stuff like a Beagle Active Probe...
STK-3F - ArchChancellor-SRM1
The drawback is that you'll spread your damage more, and you have no range at all.


So, what crazy alpha strike builds did you make?
And what non-crazy builds did you make?

Edited by MustrumRidcully, 18 January 2013 - 02:43 AM.

[twibs]

2t ammo for 2 gauss. Not gonna happen. My 3D is much much more workable while losing next to nothing

3 PPC
1 gauss +2t ammo
12 DHS
280 XL
Max armor except legs 43.

[MustrumRidcully]

twibs, on 18 January 2013 - 02:59 AM, said:

2t ammo for 2 gauss. Not gonna happen. My 3D is much much more workable while losing next to nothing

3 PPC
1 gauss +2t ammo
12 DHS
280 XL
Max armor except legs 43.

My experience suggests that my build doesn't live long enough for firing all its Gauss Shots.
But it's a choice between 50 Alpha or a 45 Alpha that has even more heat issues.

Edited by MustrumRidcully, 18 January 2013 - 03:05 AM.

[Kiiyor]

Stalkers with masses SRMs are my fave so far. I ran an experiment recently. For 10 or so matches, I charged in a straight line at the first (non light) mech I saw, and mashed the fire button like fire button mashing was an Olympic event.

1 kill, every round, then a spectacular explosion. The candle that burns at both ends!

[Selfish]

I tend towards moderate burst builds, but I never really go for full burst or alpha within the same range. I like to keep my mechs from waiting for 10 seconds before they can fire again, and they work well enough in mixed range builds. My favorites are based around PPCs for skirmish and SRMs for close. After, or if the standoff never occurred, you can use the PPC's for burst damage to crit seek.


Stalker 3F - "Snollygoster"

2 PPC
4 SRM 6
4 MLas

80 burst, 100 alpha = Don't fire it all at once

Here's a video of my playstyle when I was still eliting out the variant. The PPCs blend with the Mlas at higher ranges, and then the MLas pair with the SRMs when they're in close. Simple and effective. Lots of people like to opt for the LL's and use the extra weight for whatever they want. Feel free to alter, but you'll lose the crit-seek of the PPCs.

Atlas D - "Thug"

2 PPC
2 SRM 4
AC/20
2 Mlas

60 Burst, 70 Alpha. This build really excels in the 200-270 range, where a lot of close range builds can't reliably hit back, but you can still hit them with everything right where you want it. It has a fairly big weakness up close. The Mlas are torso mounted. You'll lose a twisting battle against a smart brawler. Even though it has a bit less damage/burst/alpha than my other builds it's one of my favorites. If you check out the build, it's fully damage redundant. 10 Burst on each arm, 20 burst on each side torso, 10 sustained in the torso for zombie. It's a damn tank, and you shouldn't feel exceptionally afraid to shrug off limbs.

Edited by Selfish, 18 January 2013 - 04:16 AM.

[NRP]

Those are some interesting builds, selfish. I've been wanting to tweak my STK-5S, so I think I'll give your build a try.

I love alpha. I do it all the time, even when I shouldn't.

[MustrumRidcully]

Selfish, on 18 January 2013 - 04:14 AM, said:

I tend towards moderate burst builds, but I never really go for full burst or alpha within the same range. I like to keep my mechs from waiting for 10 seconds before they can fire again, and they work well enough in mixed range builds. My favorites are based around PPCs for skirmish and SRMs for close. After, or if the standoff never occurred, you can use the PPC's for burst damage to crit seek.


Stalker 3F - "Snollygoster"

2 PPC
4 SRM 6
4 MLas

80 burst, 100 alpha = Don't fire it all at once

Here's a video of my playstyle when I was still eliting out the variant. The PPCs blend with the Mlas at higher ranges, and then the MLas pair with the SRMs when they're in close. Simple and effective. Lots of people like to opt for the LL's and use the extra weight for whatever they want. Feel free to alter, but you'll lose the crit-seek of the PPCs.

Atlas D - "Thug"

2 PPC
2 SRM 4
AC/20
2 Mlas

60 Burst, 70 Alpha. This build really excels in the 200-270 range, where a lot of close range builds can't reliably hit back, but you can still hit them with everything right where you want it. It has a fairly big weakness up close. The Mlas are torso mounted. You'll lose a twisting battle against a smart brawler. Even though it has a bit less damage/burst/alpha than my other builds it's one of my favorites. If you check out the build, it's fully damage redundant. 10 Burst on each arm, 20 burst on each side torso, 10 sustained in the torso for zombie. It's a damn tank, and you shouldn't feel exceptionally afraid to shrug off limbs.

Interesting builds. Particularly interesting your choice of words - you may be the only person that uses crit-seeking in a manner that is actually consistent with how crits work in MW:O. Too many people talk about LBX-10 AC or MGs as "crit-seekers" without understanding that crits in MW:O are only worth something if you deal damage, because components have hit points, and that a lot of small damage packages means that you spread your damage around over multiple components, Weapons that deal 10 or more damage in one single package - AC/10, PPCs, Gauss Rifles, are the only real crit-seekers in MW:O.

[Monky]

In my experience, 20 shots for gauss is a little light. 30 is perfectly reasonable, more than that is easily in the safe zone. On your Alpha, I would swap the PPC for an ER Large, as heat isn't going to be an issue with that setup and a laser is better against lights. This frees up 2 tons for Gauss ammo.

Additionally, I'd move your Gauss ammo to your side and center torsos - you're running an XL engine and you want anything at all that you can cram into those spots to absorb crits instead of the engine. Particularly the side with the Gauss rifle as the same principle applies, each item in there has a chance to take a rolled critical hit, if you just have the Gauss and XL engine, and a critical hit happens, well, there goes one of those. I'd rather have a chance for a ton of ammo to go instead if possible. This is safe because Gauss ammo doesn't detonate when it is hit, it's just a bunch of nickel-iron footballs

Edited by Monky, 18 January 2013 - 02:52 PM.

[Silent Stryder]

MustrumRidcully, on 18 January 2013 - 12:32 PM, said:

Interesting builds. Particularly interesting your choice of words - you may be the only person that uses crit-seeking in a manner that is actually consistent with how crits work in MW:O. Too many people talk about LBX-10 AC or MGs as "crit-seekers" without understanding that crits in MW:O are only worth something if you deal damage, because components have hit points, and that a lot of small damage packages means that you spread your damage around over multiple components, Weapons that deal 10 or more damage in one single package - AC/10, PPCs, Gauss Rifles, are the only real crit-seekers in MW:O.

I think its a careover from Table Top thinking about crit seeking, where there was no skill about where or what to hit, only dice were involved, but yeah the AC20 is a wonderful component killer in MWO provided you dedicate enough tonnage to keep the gun loaded for the match.

Edited by Silent Stryder, 18 January 2013 - 02:15 PM.

[Indoorsman]

The Large Laserback:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...ed578546e3758ce

50/50 Tons
63 Firepower
0.79 Heat Efficiency
32/338 Standard Armor
Endo-Steel Structure
Double Heatsinks
11 Total DHS
Standard 155 Engine
7x Large Laser

video will finish uploading in about 30 min

[twibs]

MustrumRidcully, on 18 January 2013 - 03:05 AM, said:

My experience suggests that my build doesn't live long enough for firing all its Gauss Shots.
But it's a choice between 50 Alpha or a 45 Alpha that has even more heat issues.

Well with only 1 gauss I still get to shoot all my ammo most of the time. My build has almost max armor, which I think is the biggest why I will live longer. Also I can put safey two alphas and the cool, or squeeze in third and shutdown.

My ideology is to design a build so that I can fight to the very end.

[Narcissistic Martyr]

Does an AC20 raven count?

Raven 4x

XL175
ES
FF

1ML
AC20 w/3tons of ammo

[Selfish]

Monky, on 18 January 2013 - 01:53 PM, said:

In my experience, 20 shots for gauss is a little light. 30 is perfectly reasonable, more than that is easily in the safe zone. On your Alpha, I would swap the PPC for an ER Large, as heat isn't going to be an issue with that setup and a laser is better against lights. This frees up 2 tons for Gauss ammo.

Additionally, I'd move your Gauss ammo to your side and center torsos - you're running an XL engine and you want anything at all that you can cram into those spots to absorb crits instead of the engine. Particularly the side with the Gauss rifle as the same principle applies, each item in there has a chance to take a rolled critical hit, if you just have the Gauss and XL engine, and a critical hit happens, well, there goes one of those. I'd rather have a chance for a ton of ammo to go instead if possible. This is safe because Gauss ammo doesn't detonate when it is hit, it's just a bunch of nickel-iron footballs

Just a heads up, but a critically destroyed engine doesn't do anything to a mech. If you critically destroy an engine the mech keeps running with no ill effect. If you destroy a component that contains the engine, however, the mech will be destroyed. It's a subtle point, but it means you don't need to buffer an XL engine. The XL engine itself is free buffer.

[MustrumRidcully]

Narcissistic Martyr, on 18 January 2013 - 09:42 PM, said:

Does an AC20 raven count?

Raven 4x

XL175
ES
FF

1ML
AC20 w/3tons of ammo

Every weight class has its alphas...

Mustrum "OH, that sentence made me sad... Alphas is cancelled" Ridcully

[slash b slash]

Indoorsman, on 18 January 2013 - 03:39 PM, said:

The Large Laserback:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...ed578546e3758ce

50/50 Tons
63 Firepower
0.79 Heat Efficiency
32/338 Standard Armor
Endo-Steel Structure
Double Heatsinks
11 Total DHS
Standard 155 Engine
7x Large Laser

video will finish uploading in about 30 min

This mech is the cause for global warming.

[Stingz]

MustrumRidcully, on 18 January 2013 - 02:34 AM, said:

CTF-3D - Omega-Catastrophe

I used this one a bit, PUGging. You die quickly, and I wouldn't say you get a lot of chances of killing something with it. But it maybe the biggest (long range) alpha you can get on a 70-ton mech currently (and not explode when shooting. You just explode quickly when you getting shot at.)

Checked, and you have just enough slots for Endo-Steel, spend it on more armor.[Link]

Edited by Stingz, 19 January 2013 - 01:33 PM.

[MustrumRidcully]

Stingz, on 19 January 2013 - 01:31 PM, said:

Checked, and you have just enough slots for Endo-Steel, spend it on more armor.[Link]

Oh, good catch. I'd still take more armor off from the legs, though.

[MagicHamsta]

Ultimate Glass Cannon:
205 damage Alpha strike at the cost of everything else.
Tis good for ruining the match for 1-2 mechs or so.

http://mwomercs.com/...e-glass-cannon/

[Stingz]

MagicHamsta, on 20 January 2013 - 12:33 PM, said:

Ultimate Glass Cannon:
205 damage Alpha strike at the cost of everything else.
Tis good for ruining the match for 1-2 mechs or so.

http://mwomercs.com/...e-glass-cannon/

Really, really wrecked by a single ECM carrying mech. PPC/Gauss users will ruin your day easily.

[MagicHamsta]

Stingz, on 20 January 2013 - 01:04 PM, said:

Really, really wrecked by a single ECM carrying mech. PPC/Gauss users will ruin your day easily.

1) Luckily the rise of Stalkers has greatly diminished the threat of non light ECMs.
2) Many ECM lights run off from the main group which leaves me with quite a few easy to hit, slow moving targets when me solo pub drop.
3) Only if they know how to aim, luckily most don't & as me main close range Assault mechs, me has a relatively easy time maneuvering to avoid their fire. (Me will simply get within 200 meters to decrease the time they has to dodge the LRMs & unload.)

In fact, me generally take down more sniper mechs with the MLs than they take me down when me play this joke build.
Now lights/fast med or heavy mechs will still easily kill me, but it usually takes them some time to get to me.
Me play LRM boats as the were designed to be played, not as the majority of people who can't aim do. (I.E, me don't hide alone 800 meters behind the main group, me disguise myself as a CQC stalker until me has acquired an optimum target, etc etc.)