214 replies to this topic

[Biruke]

Wolfways, on 20 January 2013 - 11:45 PM, said:

That's what the wife is for

I have to tell her what to do, she's even more Russian than I am

Edited by Biruke, 20 January 2013 - 11:56 PM.

[Morang]

MechAssault is available for long and Hawken just has been released. I suggest OP go there and don't even ever touch OUR PRECIOUSSSSS!

[Imperius]

Wolfways, on 20 January 2013 - 11:43 PM, said:

Aren't there training videos that explain all that?

First you have to look for the video then watch it. We should have a tutorial map with a toggle tutorial tips ON/OFF with NPC's. This could be used to teach new players how to play and set things up and for vets to set up new mechs/builds or practice. You know why they wont do it? Cause very few will play the multiplayer cause it sucks.

[Vassago Rain]

No, to everything.

[The Cheese]

quasihuman, on 20 January 2013 - 11:10 PM, said:

This game is not hard to learn. It is hard to master, but not hard to learn. Just play about five to ten games and you should know all the basics.

If you've never played an MW game, those first 10 matches are hell. It's turned off a few people that I've tried to introduce to the game.

[hashinshin]

ITT: Arrogant brats try to defend their arrogant bratty ways.

[John MatriX82]

Jetfire, on 20 January 2013 - 08:51 PM, said:

Non-Throttle movement?! No way. 3rd Person maybe in a tutorial mission.

Really this is what we need for the beginners, the same tutorial mission from all the past MW games. 15 minute training session.

THIS is the solution. Create a [REDACTED] offline/online training ground so that you can show basics to newbies, the possibility to configure and try your mech, explain the cadet bonus. 3rd person is fine unless it's confined to this. The above must be mandatory for new players and should be accessible also to experienced ones that just would like a target practice to evaluate heat efficiency and such.

Edited by Dakkath, 21 January 2013 - 02:31 PM.
language filter bypass - fixed

[MinusHuman]

Im sure its been said before... but we... as humans... have a head, upper and lower torso. that can all turn different directions (though not very practical). The fact that anyone finds it hard to comprehend the 'mech movement vexes me greatly, and i recommend we remove them from the gene pool pronto.

[Thirdstar]

MinusHuman, on 21 January 2013 - 12:29 AM, said:

Im sure its been said before... but we... as humans... have a head, upper and lower torso. that can all turn different directions (though not very practical). The fact that anyone finds it hard to comprehend the 'mech movement vexes me greatly, and i recommend we remove them from the gene pool pronto.

Trolling with your first post. Well done.

Do most of you just pop into existence with all your gaming knowledge, I'm terribly curious.

Edited by Thirdstar, 21 January 2013 - 12:51 AM.

[Taemien]

MechWarrior, as in the franchise has always had a steep learning curve. For some people it takes 6 months to a year to be on the level that you might see some players. There are some basic and not so basic strategies that have been integral to success in all the MechWarrior games including this one that are second nature to some of the pilots that have mastered them.

As I have said in other threads, there are things far more dangerous than a TS using 4-man premade. Those are your MechWarrior Veterans. Those players that seemingly take on a good portion of your team (or other team) by themselves. These players started in MechWarrior 2, 3, or 4, or perhaps even Living Legends. But either way, they have 2-15+ years of experience on some of you.

Imagine playing Basketball at the local park with a few guys. One of them played in College and has been coming to that park for the last 10 years. That is akin to the few Vets you see running around.

This is not to brag, as it is merely a statement of fact, but when playing and when I encounter an enemy player by themselves, to me its a free kill. Doesn't usually matter what I am in or what they are in. But I know 9 times out of 10 its not going to be a Vet and they are not going to know how to deal with me.

What usually happens is I start firing on them and of course they fire back. But their mistake is gluing their view to me. They don't turn away while their weapons recharge. So I systematically tear them apart. While my weapons cooldown I turn another component towards them. Therefor spreading out the damage. They get destroyed, I come out with.. scratches all over.

If that pilot was good (for not being a Vet) they might have done equal damage to me. The difference is, they did it spread out all over my mech while my damage was focused.

Sounds simple, but its VERY rare that I see other players do what I do. Some may in theory, but when the heat gets on, they forget to, its not second nature.

The next thing is lag shooting. This is even a smaller percentage as not every Vet (the ones from MW4 and MWLL) even knows how to do it, or has had the experience.

You can complain about lightmechs and netcode till you are blue in the face. But in the end, you really only have a few options:

1. Stop Playing
2. Get Destroyed
3. Learn to Lagshoot

Complaining will do very little. PGI is working on a fix that will more than likely work to fix the issue. But it has to be coded, and well, its not done yet. Players aren't going to stop using light mechs. PGI isn't going to restrict light mechs or engine size, especially with Death's Knell being a fast light. So lets be realistic here. The only effective way you're going to have fun is to lag shoot.

This means shooting ahead of the direction that the light mech is running. In MWO it is only half an inch at most. It takes practice, but at least you don't have to shoot 2-5 mechlengths as you did in MW3, there you had to try different distances until you found that opponents sweetspot.

Again, players aren't going to stop using light mechs. PGI isn't going to restrict them. AND there is a fix that will eventually come. The complaints there (and not saying anyone in this thread is complaining) really won't help. They've heard the cries for the change and are working on it.

As for a Tutorial...

I will say this, MechWarrior 2, 3, and 4 had tutorials, not only that, but they had single player campaigns. None of them prepared you for what was online. Sure you learn how to move a mech around and sorta use the mech labs. But it also makes you complacent. You prepare yourself for AI and not intelligent players.

A tutorial in my opinion will set players up for failure. Unless it showed the bare minimum like guiding them through setting up weapon groups and the very very basic movements. Then I'd have to say it is a waste.

However what would be a great benefit to players is a peer to peer match making system that allows 2-16 players to drop together in a match for a 1v1 up to a 8v8. This battle would result in NO exp or cbill gain and could be called the BattleSimulator. This would allow new players to be trained by veteran players. Or new players could congregate and practice with each other until they feel they are ready for the real thing.

That I would definitely agree that MWO does need.

[Thirdstar]

I'm sad that newbs who have since moved on always forget that they were newbs once.

[Erihs]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 20 January 2013 - 10:56 PM, said:

well given that in the game you SEE the *** hit animation in too close, so that isnt telling you that you didnt hit, same with LRMs. You SEE that they hit and look like they should do damage but you dont.
I said the exact dame stupid thing in CB

especially the ones with timelines

Trusting what you see on your screen and taking it for what's happening in the game in MWO is rather funny subject. Half of what I saw on my screen wasn't actually there, but 2-5 cm to any direction but there. I think at the point where I stopped playing, a definition of "there" in this game was anywhere but where your screen shows it.

[Imperius]

Thirdstar, on 21 January 2013 - 12:52 AM, said:

I'm sad that newbs who have since moved on always forget that they were newbs once.

Thats why i say we need a tutorial map and instruction. Sure I don't need it now, but we kinda all do if we want new players to feel welcome when they come to the game. I see people say damn pug n00b over heating and crap then they say it's my first game and they get flamed more for it.

[Xiao Youngblood]

I come from the generation of players who tends to not read a manual, but have been tought to R.T.F.M. and usualy after having started playing.

Would traning manuals be useful, obviously ! are they going to be offered and updated each patch before official release? Maybe...I doubt it. Down the road if they survive 2-3 years? Yes, but for now too many things are changing, need changing, are broken both in good or bad depending on the playstyle. Added like CW, they have a huge ammount of work ahead of themselves which is why i doubt seeing such a thing before a long time,

As for my learning curve, never played the MW series,Am now with hunchbacks, catapults and now the stalker as mastered all elites sold the models i play less and started the spider, i'd say my learning cuve took about 20 games before my first kill back in closed Beta. after that came the learning curve of each mech's and learning how to shoot depending on the guns.. is it steep yes, specially if you are not placing money on it

I signed in knowing it was an unfinished product but one i'd like to see implemented, every game aside from a select few have given me everything i wanted in it, yet i still liked them for other reasons. people who are looking for. As for the original post yes i beleive the hardcore players will be a bit disapointed in the end to accomodate the common gounds of their need of survival. but not by very much and as with every other game... game mechanics will favor a certain type of mech's (classes) on a patch basis But a player in a mech he truly loves will find somehow to perform... if it is a versatile mech since ECM.

[Impyrium]

Hrm... don't agree with the OP at all. And it worries me more that people would come to play this with such an attitude. Things such as throttle based acceleration have been a part of MechWarrior since... since the first MechWarrior. I for one would probably abandon MWO if the developers decided to add in ridiculous features such as that.

That said though, a tutorial wouldn't hurt, would it? Obviously it would if it took away from other developmental areas, but that's why it's in beta, right? I for one wouldn't need it, being relatively used to the MechWarrior series, but some sort of area with AI to practice against would be a good thing in my books. Such things would have lower developmental priority, though, I suppose.

[Thirdstar]

AUSwarrior24, on 21 January 2013 - 01:16 AM, said:

That said though, a tutorial wouldn't hurt, would it? Obviously it would if it took away from other developmental areas, but that's why it's in beta, right? I for one wouldn't need it, being relatively used to the MechWarrior series, but some sort of area with AI to practice against would be a good thing in my books. Such things would have lower developmental priority, though, I suppose.

Disagree, new player retention is essential to the health of any F2P MOG. But I suppose 'developmental priority' should instead go to bobbleheads and Hero Mechs instead?

[Pr8Dator]

Over 2000 games and over 200 hours and I think I just learned the basics of lag shooting, target selection etc. So yes, this is a hard game to master.

[Varaxus]

Biruke, on 20 January 2013 - 11:45 PM, said:

Why the hell would anyone need a tutorial. just run through the key settings and you see all possible actions. if not, you'll learn it in action.

I've played rather many games so far and never ever I have wasted my time reading tutorials, lmao.

When I buy something, including tv-sets, computers, any digital staff - I never ever open a tutorial. Oh, sorry, I'm lying, one thing always makes me look into the tutorial - new washing machines - you always have to look up what programms are for washig your socks

there's a good saying here: the Russian open the tutorials only when the thing is already broken. That's true.

So in that case when is your government going to open the manual? lol jk
But in all reality this game is fairly simple to play. Im sorry you cant be complete ****** and just point and click. Of all the matches I've played in I have only seen a handful of guys not able to atleast pilot on a beginner level. I have played over 1000 games and seriously only seen 5 maybe 6.

[Adrienne Vorton]

honestly, OP... the learning curve might be very steep for you... i for my part didn´t play mechwarrior or similar games for about 8 years before MWO... 2 of my RL friends didn´t for longer, and another friend NEVER played them... all three of them never play 1st person shooters or simulation games what so ever... all of us didn´t have any problems to get into this game within a few days (with a few matches per day)... i won´t say we are the best players around, but it´s really not hard to learn how to use a mech to the best possible personal success... you are telling us, you even still learn the basics after over 400 matches? well weither you are learning a bit slow, or my definition of "basics" is different from yours...

3rd person? not nescessary, just eyecandy and the easy way for situational awareness... non throttle movement? i hated that in a previous MW title (forgot which one, but i guess it was MW4), it´s really not that hard to manage the 4 steps of the throttle and press the "full stop" if needed... if anything, i´d like to have "10%, 25%, 50%, 75%, 100%" added to some keybindings, but that would just be a nice bonus...

Edited by Adrienne Vorton, 21 January 2013 - 04:52 AM.

[Krondor]

3rd person view is a cheat. It allows you to "see" things you wouldn't normally be able to see, and gives you artificially inflated situational awareness.

You know why most games are 3rd person? Because traditionally first person games suck on console systems due to control issues and limited POV. Because of the dominating position of console systems on the market, 3rd person has become the norm. That's it. Neither of those issues is present on a PC, especially with a widescreen monitor where you can take your normal console POV (usually around 70-80 degrees) and up to a more practical 90-120.

Also, this game is designed to be a loose sim. Sims aren't typically 3rd person.