31 replies to this topic

[Corralis]

OK here it is...

... Reduce ECM's effective range based on what class of mech is carrying it.

So the Raven/Commando/Spider only gets a 5 meter radius cause there small and can get up close real quick, the Cicada gets a 20 metre radius with it being a slightly bigger target and easier to shoot at and keep the atlas at current form of 180 metres as it's slow and easy to hit and also get out the way of.

Now time to pour myself a whiskey and wait for all the netcode exploiting light pilots to come here and flame the living hell outta me

[Lil Cthulhu]

Better way to fix ECM: split it into Guardian, Angel and Null Sig.
Because we all know that's what it is anyways.

[Corralis]

Lil Cthulhu, on 22 January 2013 - 06:39 PM, said:

Better way to fix ECM: split it into Guardian, Angel and Null Sig.
Because we all know that's what it is anyways.

Well we already know that that isn't gonna happen.

[Solis Obscuri]

Corralis, on 22 January 2013 - 06:41 PM, said:

Well we already know that that isn't gonna happen.

Who are you calling "we", kemosabe?

[Das Wudone]

current ECM implementation is in fact not guardian but angel ECM. guardian doesnt block missile lock and radar can sometimes pick up the ECMed mech. angel completely blocks/scrambles all kinds of electronics except the mechs but shouldnt be available in the current timeline.

null signature only cloaks heat and electronic emissions at the cost of increased heat. current ECM implementation doesnt do this.

[Rocket Puppy]

ECM should be left as is when it comes to LRM targeting.

ECM should have a bubble of 90 meters for SSRMs.

The LRM protection is not what makes ECM hurt so badly, its the SSRM protection. Reducing it to 90 for short range targeting requires a more skillful battle of being in the correct range.

I've managed to take down a few Ravens 3L's and Commando 2D's via SSRMS without their ECM being jammed by sticking within 280 and 180 meters away from them, but it is extremely difficult to do.

Reducing that bubble to 90 meters makes the pilot using ECM have to keep track of their distance to keep safe. Doing this will allow make non-ECM variants of light mechs much more viable.

[Xigunder Blue]

My third ECM post tonite.
1) ECM be usable only by the mech carrying it.
2) Make ECM a module with increased weight and crit spaces but available as option to all mechs.
3) Allow SSRMs to fire as SRMs against an ECM mech.

Just a few positive suggestions for a compromise, any of which would help alleviate some flaming rants.

[Green Mamba]

Rocket Puppy, on 22 January 2013 - 09:56 PM, said:

ECM should be left as is when it comes to LRM targeting.

ECM should have a bubble of 90 meters for SSRMs.

The LRM protection is not what makes ECM hurt so badly, its the SSRM protection. Reducing it to 90 for short range targeting requires a more skillful battle of being in the correct range.

I've managed to take down a few Ravens 3L's and Commando 2D's via SSRMS without their ECM being jammed by sticking within 280 and 180 meters away from them, but it is extremely difficult to do.

Reducing that bubble to 90 meters makes the pilot using ECM have to keep track of their distance to keep safe. Doing this will allow make non-ECM variants of light mechs much more viable.

Wait, Are saying increase SSRMs where they are even more effective?

[Rocket Puppy]

Green Mamba, on 22 January 2013 - 10:16 PM, said:

Wait, Are saying increase SSRMs where they are even more effective?

No, I'm talking about reducing the range that ECM can block SSRM targeting to a 90m wide bubble, half the current bubble.

If you happened to be in another mech with SSRMS and an ECM mech walked up on you, you can now target that mech between 280m out to 90m in with your SSRMS. This would make ECM mechs less godly at close range and give other mechs a chance to damage them with streaks.

[Corralis]

Xigunder Blue, on 22 January 2013 - 10:06 PM, said:

My third ECM post tonite.
1) ECM be usable only by the mech carrying it.
2) Make ECM a module with increased weight and crit spaces but available as option to all mechs.
3) Allow SSRMs to fire as SRMs against an ECM mech.

Just a few positive suggestions for a compromise, any of which would help alleviate some flaming rants.

Sorry I don't understand your point number 2. you say have ECM as a module, but increase weight and crit spaces? Well modules do not use weight or crit spaces. If you are saying what I think you are saying and that all mechs should have ECM but that lights mechs can have ECM at 1 tons and 2 crit spaces but for assaults it'll weight 10 tons and 8 crit spaces then that would be about the most awful thing you could ever imagine. If anything it should be the other way round and have light mechs with ECM unable to bring any weapons at all. That will force you to think about whether you really wanna bring ECM in a match instead of it being a must have item.

[Flapdrol]

Rocket Puppy, on 22 January 2013 - 09:56 PM, said:

ECM should have a bubble of 90 meters for SSRMs.

I think its ridiculous you cant target because the ecm mech is to close. I'd say just make streaks always lock within 180m, even with ecm, then nerf streaks to reflect their ridiculous dps/ton, ammo/ton, damage/heat advantage.

[Corralis]

Flapdrol, on 23 January 2013 - 05:31 AM, said:

I think its ridiculous you cant target because the ecm mech is to close. I'd say just make streaks always lock within 180m, even with ecm, then nerf streaks to reflect their ridiculous dps/ton, ammo/ton, damage/heat advantage.

Well this is the thing, I sometimes use a LRM boat and having a single light mech running straight up to within 180 metres and staying there is all it takes to remove me from the game, they don't even have to do anything, just stand there and I can't do anything. Now I'm all for light ECM mechs having the ability to remove themselves from my sensors, essentially cloaking themselves, but taking me out of the entire game before I can even fire a shot is stupid. That's why I am saying that lights should have less ECM radius than assaults and it would also kinda make sense as they have less power for the ECM to function so it would have less range as well.

[JSparrowist]

Corralis, on 23 January 2013 - 05:40 AM, said:

Well this is the thing, I sometimes use a LRM boat and having a single light mech running straight up to within 180 metres and staying there is all it takes to remove me from the game, they don't even have to do anything, just stand there and I can't do anything. Now I'm all for light ECM mechs having the ability to remove themselves from my sensors, essentially cloaking themselves, but taking me out of the entire game before I can even fire a shot is stupid. That's why I am saying that lights should have less ECM radius than assaults and it would also kinda make sense as they have less power for the ECM to function so it would have less range as well.

Don't LRM boat. Take some energy weapons too. ECM in its current form really sucks but it is what it is for now and you're gimping yourself.

[Roughneck45]

Make AMS more effective against streaks. Non ECM lights can take ams for the same tonnage(depending on how much ammo they want) and have streak defense.

Problem solved.

ECM is fine.

Netcode, collisions, and the reliance on streaks is what is broken.

Not the most popular stance, but thats how I feel about it.

Edited by Roughneck45, 23 January 2013 - 05:54 AM.

[Corralis]

JSparrowist, on 23 January 2013 - 05:44 AM, said:

Don't LRM boat. Take some energy weapons too. ECM in its current form really sucks but it is what it is for now and you're gimping yourself.

Well I do take energy weapons as well but that is basically taking my damage down from over 100 to less than 20, all because a light mech stands somewhere within 180 metres from me? Nah light mechs shouldn't have an ECM radius. It would solve a lot of the whining. Don't get me wrong the Netcode still needs to be fixed as a priority, I'm just trying to come up with another solution that may work.

[l33tworks]

Corralis, on 23 January 2013 - 07:45 AM, said:

Well I do take energy weapons as well but that is basically taking my damage down from over 100 to less than 20, all because a light mech stands somewhere within 180 metres from me? Nah light mechs shouldn't have an ECM radius. It would solve a lot of the whining. Don't get me wrong the Netcode still needs to be fixed as a priority, I'm just trying to come up with another solution that may work.

I agree, ECM from a balance perspective should be for a big mechs like an Atlas.

Light mechs should have to rely on their speed and cover to avoid detection/missles in addition to having some kind of PASSIVE increased targeting lock protection due to their smaller size, so enemy mechs have a tougher time targetting them or picking them up on radar but it should be a small, intermittent decrease and offset by such things as BAP and increased sensor range modules.
Heck, have a electrical shielding module or some kind of mat Armour to passively aid in stealth but not full blown ecm.

Edited by l33tworks, 23 January 2013 - 08:06 AM.

[Das Wudone]

all the devs need to do is stick to the canon guardian ECM and balance missiles properly. like i said the ECM we have now DOES NOT FUNCTION AS GUARDIAN BUT ANGEL ECM which is not supposed to be available in the timeline. guardian does not block missile locks but it jams fire control systems like artemis, electronics like beagle, radar and C3 comms. Angel ECM blocks/jams/renders useless all kinds of electronics. see this link here: http://www.sarna.net...Angel_ECM_Suite

balancing streaks is easy. just reduce its rate of fire like a lot have been suggesting cos from what i can tell they will do more dps than normal srms as long as u have a lock cos normal srms require u to lead target and the fact that not all missiles hit at a longer range compared to streaks that always land no matter what... LRMs on the other hand are easy to tweak and avoid... GUARDIAN ECMs SOLE PURPOSE WAS STEALTH, NOT AN ANTI-MISSILE COMPONENT.

[gunghoblazes]

How about it comes in either a disrupt or counter mode? and also up the tonnage based on mech class. Light 2 tons medium 3 tons heavy (if and when they do have it ) 4 tons and assault 5 tons.

[N0MAD]

Never personally had a problem with ECM and i seldom drive an ECM boat altho i do own a DDC and i Never drive a Ecm Raven.
Have i changed they way i play since ECM? i certainly have(im sure you dont want a wall of text of me describing my personal tactics), Am i reliant on Streaks? nope, do i use LRMs? at times(i use a tag laser).
ECM Ravens were my bigest problem, I just couldnt damage them (have killed 3 today..MUAHA). I have Elited Atlasas,Stalkers and Catas since ECM and altho i consider myself an Average pilot at the very best im sitting on a 1.5 K/D ratio...ohh and i pug at least 80% of the time.
I have seen the ECM debate with post after post day after day and Frankly im baffled that the same people complain about it continuosly.
Now im sure the ECM is OP loby is going to write post after post as to why im wrong and they are right and the word fanboi or others will be brought up BUT this is MY PERSONAL experience with ECM.
Just had to have my say.

[Ixis]

Ok I've read a lot of posts saying how OP ECM is and in some cases I'd have to agree,the raven 3L's standard loadout comes with a tag laser and a NARC pod which clearly means that it was designed to scout ahead of the main mech body and provide long range spotting and targeting,instead its turned into the battleground axe murderer running round heavier mechs at 150kph with a lag shield firing streak missiles with virtual impunity.So how about this as a solution.If a targeted ECM mech closes to within 100m that after 10 seconds a non ECM mech sensors will burn through the ECM and guided weapons will then be able to acheive a lock-on,but this will only work if the non ECM mech holds the target for the full 10 seconds.At least this way you'll limit the amount of time a light mech can run around in the "circle of death".And before the 3L community goes ballistic,I own a 3L myself and have used the "circle of death" tactic myself on heavier mechs.At least this way it will reward a skilled pilot who knows when to bug out until the heat dies down before coming back to re-engage and bring more balance to the game play