Question On Double Heat Sinks
#1
Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:10 PM
#2
Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:20 PM
#3
Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:21 PM
Sadistic Savior, on 29 January 2013 - 01:10 PM, said:
Yes, correct me if I'm wrong, but when you upgrade to DHS, your 10 "free" engines change to double efficiency (2.0). Any other DHS you add extra onto the mech, including the DHS that larger size engines can hold will change to 1.4 efficiency.
Edit: Swift ninja, Sajuk Kar is..
Edited by DDDs, 29 January 2013 - 01:21 PM.
#4
Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:39 PM
What the DHS provides at 2.0 is the heat capacity. Every mech comes with 30 heat capacity, and each engine DHS adds 2.0 heat capacity and every external DHS adds 1.4 heat capacity. So for instance if you had 14 heat sinks, 10 in the engine your heat capacity would be 30 + (10 * 2.0 + 4 * 1.4) =55.6 heat capacity before shutdown. For SHS, it is 1.0 heat capacity each, so 30 + SHS = heat capacity.
Hope that helps!
-S
#5
Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:43 PM
Wow this gets confusing in a hurry.
Edited by Tolkien, 29 January 2013 - 01:43 PM.
#6
Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:44 PM
Sajuk Kar, on 29 January 2013 - 01:20 PM, said:
This is correct. Any heat sinks in the engine are true 2.0. If you have a 250, then all 10 "free" sinks are 2.0, if you have a 275 like above, then if you throw another in the engine, it is 2.0. If you have a 200 engine, therefore only 8 inside, only 8 are true 2.0
Splinters, on 29 January 2013 - 01:39 PM, said:
What the DHS provides at 2.0 is the heat capacity. Every mech comes with 30 heat capacity, and each engine DHS adds 2.0 heat capacity and every external DHS adds 1.4 heat capacity. So for instance if you had 14 heat sinks, 10 in the engine your heat capacity would be 30 + (10 * 2.0 + 4 * 1.4) =55.6 heat capacity before shutdown. For SHS, it is 1.0 heat capacity each, so 30 + SHS = heat capacity.
Hope that helps!
-S
#7
Posted 29 January 2013 - 02:09 PM
#9
Posted 29 January 2013 - 02:22 PM
Krellek, on 29 January 2013 - 02:10 PM, said:
Both
had to confirm
This is news to me - could you link to a description of this mechanic?
Sorry to doubt, it's just that in the source material and in past mechwarrior games to my knowledge Heatsinks/Double heatsinks have never affected how much heat capacity you have (I think the scale went to 30 units of heat on tabletop), just how fast you burn it off.
Edited by Tolkien, 29 January 2013 - 02:24 PM.
#10
Posted 29 January 2013 - 02:26 PM
It would be nice if a Dev somewhere could clarify how heatsinks /actually/ work, so were not left with guesswork, hearsay, and the occasional thorough but perhaps obsolete empirical testing. :-/
The opaque mechanics of this game are a real turn off.
#11
Posted 29 January 2013 - 02:29 PM
Tolkien, on 29 January 2013 - 02:22 PM, said:
This is news to me - could you link to a description of this mechanic?
Here is the post:
http://mwomercs.com/.../66086-archive/
I’d like to expand on some information from an earlier post and provide more details on Standard and Double Heat Sinks.
First, let’s take a look at a Standard Heat Sink. It’s a pretty basic piece of equipment that weighs 1 ton, occupies 1 critical slot. Each Standard Heat Sink equipped on your Mech cools it by 0.1 heat/sec and increases the maximum heat threshold before you shut down by 1.
A Double Heat Sink also weighs 1 ton, but it occupies 3 critical slots. This means that you’re unable to fit them in a Mech’s head, center torso, or legs. The upside is that each one cools your Mech by 0.2 heat/sec and increases your maximum heat capacity by 2.
Edited by Krellek, 29 January 2013 - 02:38 PM.
#12
Posted 29 January 2013 - 02:35 PM
Krellek, on 29 January 2013 - 02:29 PM, said:
I can't find the post I am referring to and had to ask a couple people. From what I understand is that SHS and DHS both add a slight increase to threshold while increasing the decay rate of heat. The latter is the more noticeable change.
I could be wrong, but let me pose an opposing viewpoint - that DHS do nothing to increase the size of your heat scale, they just *look* like they do.
Reason being if you fire enough weapons to heat up your mech quickly, then switch to DHS it will heat up 'slowly' - this will make the meter look like it is taking longer to fill but that's because the difference between the amount of heat you generate and the amount you dissipate per unit time is smaller, not because the "heat meter" got bigger.
Just a thought how it could look like DHS makes you have more heat capacity, but does not actually.
#13
Posted 29 January 2013 - 02:38 PM
Tolkien, on 29 January 2013 - 02:35 PM, said:
I could be wrong, but let me pose an opposing viewpoint - that DHS do nothing to increase the size of your heat scale, they just *look* like they do.
Reason being if you fire enough weapons to heat up your mech quickly, then switch to DHS it will heat up 'slowly' - this will make the meter look like it is taking longer to fill but that's because the difference between the amount of heat you generate and the amount you dissipate per unit time is smaller, not because the "heat meter" got bigger.
Just a thought how it could look like DHS makes you have more heat capacity, but does not actually.
Refer to my edit above for what you were looking for.
#14
Posted 29 January 2013 - 02:44 PM
Jaded Jasper, on 29 January 2013 - 02:26 PM, said:
It would be nice if a Dev somewhere could clarify how heatsinks /actually/ work, so were not left with guesswork, hearsay, and the occasional thorough but perhaps obsolete empirical testing. :-/
The opaque mechanics of this game are a real turn off.
I don't think it that confusing. The way I've always understood it, which has been confirmed by my math, is that your mech has a heat threshold, at 100% of which you shut down. This is your heat meter. The threshold is determined by a base of 30 for all mechs plus 1 for every standard heatsink you have, and 2 for the engine double heat sinks you have, and 1.4 for the non engine heatsink you have. For instance, if you are using standard heatsinks, and have 35 of them total including your engine ones, you heat threshold is 65, which is 100% on your heat gauge. Each single heatsink also gives .1 heat dissipation per second, engine doubles give .2 and non engine doubles give .14. A good way to estimate how much of your heat threshold your weapons are gonna make when fired is to take the heat of the weapons added up and then divide that by your heat threshold. That will give the percent of your total heat threshold. This is before any bonuses affecting heat you might have.
Summary:
Heat threshold=
30+1 for standard heatsink
1.4 for non engine double heatsink
2 for engine double heat sink
Heat dissipation=
.1 per second for standard heatsink
.14 for non engine double heatsink
.2 for engine double heat sink
Edited by Sajuk Kar, 29 January 2013 - 02:51 PM.
#15
Posted 29 January 2013 - 02:46 PM
Only up to the first 10 DHS inside the engine count at 2.0, all others (including any inside the engine over 10) count as 1.4.
A std300 with 12 DHS inside it, has ten that operate at 2.0 and two that operate at 1.4.
From the standpoint of head dissipation, a 250 engine with 2 external DHS has the same exact heat dissipation capacity of a 300 with 12 inside it. Beyond the first 10 DHS inside the engine, the advantage to sticking them in there is freeing up slots, which is actually a huge deal in big mechs...
#16
Posted 29 January 2013 - 02:46 PM
Sajuk Kar, on 29 January 2013 - 02:44 PM, said:
I don't think it that confusing. The way I've always understood it, which has been confirmed by my math, is that your mech has a heat threshold, at 100% of which you shut down. This is your heat meter. The threshold is determined by a base of 30 for all mechs plus 1 for every standard heatsink you have, and 2 for the engine double heat sinks you have, and 1.4 for the non engine heatsink you have. For instance, if you are using standard heatsinks, and have 35 of them total including your engine ones, you heat threshold is 65, which is 100% on your heat gauge. Each single heatsink also gives .1 heat dissipation per second, engine doubles give .2 and non engine doubles give .14. A good way to estimate how much of your heat threshold your weapons are gonna make when fired is to take the heat of the weapons added up and then divide that by your heat threshold. That will give the percent of your total heat threshold. This is before any bonuses affecting heat you might have.
Summary:
Heat thresold=
30+1 for standard heatsink
1.4 for non engine double heatsink
2 for engine double heat sink
Heat dissipation=
.1 per second for standard heatsink
.14 for non engine double heatsink
.2 for engine double heat sink
Yes
#18
Posted 29 January 2013 - 02:55 PM
Loc Nar, on 29 January 2013 - 02:46 PM, said:
Only up to the first 10 DHS inside the engine count at 2.0, all others (including any inside the engine over 10) count as 1.4.
A std300 with 12 DHS inside it, has ten that operate at 2.0 and two that operate at 1.4.
From the standpoint of head dissipation, a 250 engine with 2 external DHS has the same exact heat dissipation capacity of a 300 with 12 inside it. Beyond the first 10 DHS inside the engine, the advantage to sticking them in there is freeing up slots, which is actually a huge deal in big mechs...
I can't find any post discussing the drop off following the first two HS relative to any additional HS's. Can you please post the thread / post #? I know a bunch of stuff has been archived.
#19
Posted 29 January 2013 - 03:02 PM
Krellek, on 29 January 2013 - 02:55 PM, said:
I can't find any post discussing the drop off following the first two HS relative to any additional HS's. Can you please post the thread / post #? I know a bunch of stuff has been archived.
Where did you get the idea that there is some sort of drop off related to the first two heatsinks?
#20
Posted 29 January 2013 - 03:06 PM
IceSerpent, on 29 January 2013 - 03:02 PM, said:
Where did you get the idea that there is some sort of drop off related to the first two heatsinks?
From the poster I was quoting. I shouldn't have been exact with using the two and two scenario. Any HS's following the initial 10 rather was what I was referring to. Not saying the OP was wrong, just trying to find the original post. I haven't looked at them in a long time and am rather curious myself. I can't find any posts by PGI discussing a drop off after 10 DHS.
"Only up to the first 10 DHS inside the engine count at 2.0, all others (including any inside the engine over 10) count as 1.4.
A std300 with 12 DHS inside it, has ten that operate at 2.0 and two that operate at 1.4."
Edited by Krellek, 29 January 2013 - 03:13 PM.
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