158 replies to this topic

[o Riva o]

We had a funny discussion, when we sat in a pub with couple of my colleagues who work on AAA games (3d artist / animator, coder, and I am general artist, level / game designer).

We were arguing how long did it really took to make the MWO. For fun and cause we like to argue. Who doesnt in a pub

So at the end we counted all the mechs and levels, estimated all the props and time needed to make them, animate them, script them.
I was the 'nicest' one, since Im not so specialised as the other artist so I ie. estimated creation of one Mech (3d model, mormalmaps, textures, putting together in engine, animation ..) to 2 days of work (of single 3d art person). My other 3d-artsy buddy was 'brutal' and actually stood behind "5 hours not more" ! :-o (..and Im quite sure he can do that, which is scary )

What we ended up with as total time was quite surprising (or not so much, seeing how little content MWO actually has): around 60 man-days for all the graphic and scripting in the game !

60 man-days means that it would take 60 working days if everything was done by single multi-talented person (there actually are people like that), step by step until completion.
If it was done by lets say a team of 3 people: 3d artist (modeler), texture artist and animator-scripter, it would actually take around 40 days, counting in that the texturer and animator would be so bored most of the time, they would make all the game GUI together in theyr spare time.

Our programming buddy added, that since the project is using a Cry3 engine and MWO is such a standard, simple game (gaming mechanics wise and custom special-fx wise) there was little actual coding work needed on top of what stock Cry3 engine already had.

All of it's quite funny compared to claims of MWO publishers that they worked on the game since March 2009 (?), which is roughly 3 years ! or 900 work days, and that they have highely skilled team of 50 people .. working on MWO(?)

Just doenst add up, does it

Edited by o Riva o, 31 January 2013 - 09:34 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Cool...
...
...
The DEVs are highering I hear.

[DEN_Ninja]

This has troll written all over it. Close the thread. This guy is an *****.

[Bishop Steiner]

where should I send your tinfoil hat to?

Since you and your buds seem to overlook all the things we not had released yet, which have had to be beuilt and tested internally, like the different maps not even announced, any ideas that were deemed failures, and rejected (yet ate up man hours), the fact that they are certainly parallel developing all the Clan content WHILE releasing the IS stuff, etc, etc.

If you really want to "impress" anyone with your Pub crawl induced BS blowing.... why don't you and your buddies take the next 2 months to build that game?

[CDLord HHGD]

I'd say apply for the jobs they are offering and get some first hand knowledge. I'm sure there are lots of corporate snags along the way and for any corporate decision takes weeks potentially. I'm sure if all it was was a dozen or so people, they'd be cranking this out, but they got more people pulling their strings including a caveat that any art and model may need to be approved not by PGI and IGP, but FASA as well. That alone could take months....

[DEN_Ninja]

You know Bishop...I'm glad Steiner and Davion are allied right now. I like you.

[Thirdstar]

Joseph Mallan, on 31 January 2013 - 09:34 AM, said:

highering

[Joseph Mallan]

No really They have said they are hiring. if you are as good as you say you are, then man, you are everything the DEVs are looking for!

[DEN_Ninja]

Thirdstar, on 31 January 2013 - 09:37 AM, said:

You saw nothing.

[Joseph Mallan]

Thirdstar, on 31 January 2013 - 09:37 AM, said:

Graduated in 84 and really could care less any more

[Heeden]

Didn't one of PGI guys say they only started coding etc. about a year ago?

Also with the modelling, are you including the time for concept sketches, consultations, redesigns etc. because personally I think the art-style in MW:O is utterly fantastic and I don't think the time-scale you're allowing would lead to such a brilliant aesthetic that manages to keep the resemblance to classic battle-tech but with a modern feel, let alone the animation which is pretty top-notch.

[Thirdstar]

As much criticism as I throw around the forums, the OP is clearly trolling. Or very stupid, that line is always very thin.

[Bishop Steiner]

Tichorius Davion, on 31 January 2013 - 09:36 AM, said:

You know Bishop...I'm glad Steiner and Davion are allied right now. I like you.

Thanks... I'll fighting shoulder to shoulder with you Davies still when it comes time to depose the B1tchQueen Katrina Steiner and her rabid attack dog Nondi in 17 years.......

[DEN_Ninja]

So a Steiner Scout Lance walks into a Caldera.









They all overheat.

[DEN_Ninja]

Bishop Steiner, on 31 January 2013 - 09:42 AM, said:

Thanks... I'll fighting shoulder to shoulder with you Davies still when it comes time to depose the B1tchQueen Katrina Steiner and her rabid attack dog Nondi in 17 years.......

-sigh- Clearly the black sheep of the Steiner Davion family. Long Live Melissa Steiner!

Thontor, on 31 January 2013 - 09:43 AM, said:

They have been working on this game since late 2011 (October or November?). Not March 2009

And clearly you and your friends are wrong and missed something in your "estimation"

The skeleton or rather a very rough outline of the game was developed from the canceled reboot started in 2009 but 2011 is when real production began.

[Bishop Steiner]

Heeden, on 31 January 2013 - 09:42 AM, said:

Didn't one of PGI guys say they only started coding etc. about a year ago?

Also with the modelling, are you including the time for concept sketches, consultations, redesigns etc. because personally I think the art-style in MW:O is utterly fantastic and I don't think the time-scale you're allowing would lead to such a brilliant aesthetic that manages to keep the resemblance to classic battle-tech but with a modern feel, let alone the animation which is pretty top-notch.

aaaand don't forget Alex didn't just bang out 1 sketch of each Mech and POOF, "we have a winner!" (Only I am that cool..... ) Between back and forth concepts and idea, it would be weeks before the Models even were started for reach one. And even then, you oftentime need to change stuff as you find out what looks good in 2D doesn't always actually WORK in 3D.

Add into that the number of concepts that never launched, or were scrapped, sometimes when finished, and them having to do at least 16 Clan Mechs in secrets during this whole time, and just the Art department side would have needed the better part of a year.

(helps when you actually work in a field to understand what goes on in getting Art from doodle to fully integrated, and that ain't even the fact tehy are essentially having to rewrite EVERY line of Code in Cryengine as they go to make it "work" for MWO)

Tichorius Davion, on 31 January 2013 - 09:42 AM, said:

So a Steiner Scout Lance walks into a Caldera.









They all overheat.

Naw.. that was the OLD Steiner Scout Lance........ wait til you see our new ones.... (Hint.... http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Thunder_Hawk)

You know you wanna scout with us.....

[Vechs]

Well I'm a level designer so I'll toss in my two cents.

If I know EXACTLY what to make, I can get the work done pretty fast.

You seem to be doing a time budget for just recreating what they've already made.

If I had a hard drive failure and had to recreate and area, that's one thing.

But being assigned to create an area from scratch involves planning, testing, and just... time.

[o Riva o]

Joseph Mallan, on 31 January 2013 - 09:34 AM, said:

The DEVs are highering I hear.

They are what ?

Bishop Steiner, on 31 January 2013 - 09:35 AM, said:

where should I send your tinfoil hat to?

What is it good for ?

Quote

Since you and your buds seem to overlook all the things we not had released yet, which have had to be beuilt and tested internally, like the different maps not even announced,

Thats a wild speculations, right Why are all the great things not released, if they already been secretly finished (for years I guess, if I follow our original time-content estimation).

Btw "we" ? Are you one of the developers ?

Quote

any ideas that were deemed failures, and rejected (yet ate up man hours),

The pub-estimate I explained above is very rough, indeed. You can double it if you want though, and it will still be 90 man-days, compared to 3 years of supposed work of x member profi team

Quote

the fact that they are certainly parallel developing all the Clan content WHILE releasing the IS stuff, etc, etc.

Where did you ge that information ? (and certainty)
I would personaly guess its your wild dreams ?

Quote

If you really want to "impress" anyone with your Pub crawl induced BS blowing.... why don't you and your buddies take the next 2 months to build that game?

If you'll secure commercial rights to Mechwarrior franchise, why not. Actually (ok it was after few glasses of wine / beer ) the guys started to plan they'll make theyr own online mech game , since they like and lack any good one.

If that would actually happen, I only fear I'll have to be the one designing all 100 and 10 mechs for theyr new franchise ) (since acquiring Battletech one would be though nut )

[Fake Inception]

o Riva o, on 31 January 2013 - 09:31 AM, said:

We had a funny discussion, when we sat in a pub with couple of my colleagues who work on AAA games (3d artist / animator, coder, and I am general artist, level / game designer).

We were arguing how long did it really took to make the MWO. For fun and cause we like to argue. Who doesnt in a pub

So at the end we counted all the mechs and levels, estimated all the props and time needed to make them, animate them, script them.
I was the 'nicest' one, since Im not so specialised as the other artist so I ie. estimated creation of one Mech (3d model, mormalmaps, textures, putting together in engine, animation ..) to 2 days of work (of single 3d art person). My other 3d-artsy buddy was 'brutal' and actually stood behind "5 hours not more" ! :-o (..and Im quite sure he can do that, which is scary )

What we ended up with as total time was quite surprising (or not so much, seeing how little content MWO actually has): around 60 man-days for all the graphic and scripting in the game !

60 man-days means that it would take 60 working days if everything was done by single multi-talented person (there actually are people like that), step by step until completion.
If it was done by lets say a team of 3 people: 3d artist (modeler), texture artist and animator-scripter, it would actually take around 40 days, counting in that the texturer and animator would be so bored most of the time, they would make all the game GUI together in theyr spare time.

Our programming buddy added, that since the project is using a Cry3 engine and MWO is such a standard, simple game (gaming mechanics wise and custom special-fx wise) there was little actual coding work needed on top of what stock Cry3 engine already had.

All of it's quite funny compared to claims of MWO publishers that they worked on the game since March 2009 (?), which is roughly 3 years ! or 900 work days, and that they have highely skilled team of 50 people .. working on MWO(?)

Just doenst add up, does it

inb4thelock or delete, MWO devs don't like people pointing things like this out.

[Bryan Ekman]

It takes

2 Modellers
2 Animators
1 Concept Artist
1 Texture Artist

6 people x 1 Month to make each BattleMech.