67 replies to this topic

[Denno]

Hell, last week I dropped solo in a Stalker and timed out 2 different times unable to find a match. I hope it was just a glitch and not indicative of population.

Edited by Denno, 04 February 2013 - 07:47 AM.

[Antony Weiner]

Skinny Pete, on 03 February 2013 - 06:50 PM, said:

Six times and counting of "failed to find match". Get online people!

Its a bug. Just remake the group.

[Z0MBIE Y0SHI]

Mycrus, on 04 February 2013 - 07:33 AM, said:

in our timezone the only chance we have to play 8s if we drop against each other...

if you want scrims looks us up at NGNG TS3 server

this screenie from tonight's drop

Dang, you guys got some numbers. You should check out RHOD, teams have been dropping a lot recently (Especially in div 4...)

[Bushwick Bill]

Before the implementation of the 8 man queue many of the big groups stated 'give us 8 man and pug stomps will end'....' we don't enjoy pug stomping, but we have no choice....'. There were a few posts of concern from the 8 man crowd over the lack of weight limits, but most had retorts such as ' a balanced team... ' or 'it is the pilot not the mech...'. Bottom line seemed to be the 8 man sect wanted a competitive queue. Many, myself included, warned that, as in other games, such a queue would quickly dwindle as the few true competitive groups would dominate. See current situation.

There should be no surprise that the 8 man queue (the competitive queue) has teams running what they see as competitive, min/max style. The statements such as 'every team runs nothing but ecm ravens and ddc's' however is pure bunk. My son plays 8 mans and out of 12 matches i watched I saw only one full raven/ ddc team. There were some ravens and ddc's on most teams, but also stalkers, k2's, a1's , etc.. I was surprised because after reading these boards you get the impression it is a raven/ ddc only club - not true.

Bottom line, in my opinion, is people want an advantage. Look into the public ts servers and see how many 4 mans are there. If those 4 mans wanted a challenge they would group and queue 8 mans, but that is not happening. It is easier to claim the competitive 8 man queue is 'unfair' (too challenging) for whatever reason and return to pug stomping because 'they have no choice.'

Kudos to those still queuing 8 man. Until PGI fixes the match maker to distribute groups between teams nothing will change (I do not think elo alone will do much of anything). I do not care if folks drop in premade groups for the general queue, I will continue to play and have fun. I do get daily entertainment from reading the reasons and justifications of those who no longer drop 8 man.

The 8 man queue will be more viable when the general queue is made more competitive and is not the easy win for premades as it is now. Just my opinion and observations, see you all in game.

[Sug]

Bushwick Bill, on 04 February 2013 - 08:22 AM, said:

Bottom line, in my opinion, is people want an advantage. Look into the public ts servers and see how many 4 mans are there. If those 4 mans wanted a challenge they would group and queue 8 mans, but that is not happening. It is easier to claim the competitive 8 man queue is 'unfair' (too challenging) for whatever reason and return to pug stomping because 'they have no choice.'

The only other situation I have for comparison is when WoW used to have mixed premade/pug queues for their PvP battlegrounds.

It was the same story. Premades swore they just liked playing with friends and weren't pugstomping on purpose. Pugs complained that PvP was impossible to enjoy when getting matched up against premades.

So Blizzard fixed their matchmaker so premades would only get match against other premades. Surprise surprise, suddenly people weren't having fun with premade pvp groups and switched to queuing for matches with a friend or 2 instead of a full group.

Very few people are competitive gamers. Look at WoW's Rated Battleground system. So few people do them that they had to allow teams from the same faction to compete against each other just to fill the queues.

Most people play games to have fun. Working hard to win is not fun. Losing over and over is not fun.

[Vassago Rain]

Bushwick Bill, on 04 February 2013 - 08:22 AM, said:

Before the implementation of the 8 man queue many of the big groups stated 'give us 8 man and pug stomps will end'....' we don't enjoy pug stomping, but we have no choice....'. There were a few posts of concern from the 8 man crowd over the lack of weight limits, but most had retorts such as ' a balanced team... ' or 'it is the pilot not the mech...'. Bottom line seemed to be the 8 man sect wanted a competitive queue. Many, myself included, warned that, as in other games, such a queue would quickly dwindle as the few true competitive groups would dominate. See current situation.

There should be no surprise that the 8 man queue (the competitive queue) has teams running what they see as competitive, min/max style. The statements such as 'every team runs nothing but ecm ravens and ddc's' however is pure bunk. My son plays 8 mans and out of 12 matches i watched I saw only one full raven/ ddc team. There were some ravens and ddc's on most teams, but also stalkers, k2's, a1's , etc.. I was surprised because after reading these boards you get the impression it is a raven/ ddc only club - not true.

Bottom line, in my opinion, is people want an advantage. Look into the public ts servers and see how many 4 mans are there. If those 4 mans wanted a challenge they would group and queue 8 mans, but that is not happening. It is easier to claim the competitive 8 man queue is 'unfair' (too challenging) for whatever reason and return to pug stomping because 'they have no choice.'

Kudos to those still queuing 8 man. Until PGI fixes the match maker to distribute groups between teams nothing will change (I do not think elo alone will do much of anything). I do not care if folks drop in premade groups for the general queue, I will continue to play and have fun. I do get daily entertainment from reading the reasons and justifications of those who no longer drop 8 man.

The 8 man queue will be more viable when the general queue is made more competitive and is not the easy win for premades as it is now. Just my opinion and observations, see you all in game.

When the 8 manz was new, we used to get a lot of silly teams with XL assaults and the terrible guns, like LBX, because 'this is how you do it, you guys.' They got farmed out so bad, it was actually more profitable meeting them than playing several matches in the ghetto.

Right now, 8 manz is basically Kong, ponies, Kaos, and some australians.

[Z0MBIE Y0SHI]

Vassago Rain, on 04 February 2013 - 02:07 PM, said:

Right now, 8 manz is basically Kong, ponies, DV8, Kaos, Goons (or posers) and some australians.

Thats better =P

Edited by Z0MBIE Y0SHI, 04 February 2013 - 02:10 PM.

[Zylo]

I really don't see too many problems dropping in 8's without weight limits. It adds additional challenge to the matches since you never know exactly what the other team will bring to the match. I recently had an entire lance of recruits join. Their first test was making up half the team in an 8-man drop. Sure it was a bit more difficult but we did manage to win.

We tested a match a few days ago running only 2x DDC for ECM and no lights and chose to play defensive. Enemy had Raven 3L + a spider of some sort and tried to cap at the start. Raven 3L was easily killed by 1 of my guys who was running... a YLW. It didn't end up being a flawless win but we also didn't need to use more ECM than the other team to win. We built our team around direct fire weapons mostly, we did have a new recruit in some LRM catapult that couldn't do much due to enemy ECM but it didn't seem to matter much.

I try to get my group into 8's whenever possible as it makes the team better players but we do like to run with only our own players and close friends of the corp. If Elo does match teams based on skill, those who are choosing to continue sync-dropping for easy fights will be in trouble when the meet teams of equal skill.

I would like to see a sort of weight matching system used where it is optional. Let those who want weight matching have the ability to drop weight matched and those who want unlimited drops can choose an unlimited option similar to the Assault/Conquest/Any options we have now. If players are telling the truth that they don't drop due to the lack of a weight matching option then 8-man drops won't be so dead as a result.

[Volume]

Z0MBIE Y0SHI, on 04 February 2013 - 02:09 PM, said:

Thats better =P

...kong is goons though?

[p00k]

Bushwick Bill, on 04 February 2013 - 08:22 AM, said:

If those 4 mans wanted a challenge they would group and queue 8 mans, but that is not happening. It is easier to claim the competitive 8 man queue is 'unfair' (too challenging) for whatever reason and return to pug stomping because 'they have no choice.'

why should 4mans join with 4 strangers to make an 8man, if pugs won't join with 3 strangers to make a 4man

also, let's be real, a trial mech has no place in 8man right now. so should new players just solo pug until they have an optimized build, rather than joining a <4 man?

[wolf74]

almost goto drop in an 8man Saturday night but we could only find 7players

[QuantumButler]

Volume, on 04 February 2013 - 02:36 PM, said:

...kong is goons though?

[Vassago Rain]

Volume, on 04 February 2013 - 02:36 PM, said:

...kong is goons though?

Goons are something awful. It's the ancestor of 4chan, and 4chan is the father of reddit.
We're all very different, culturally, even if we share a number of traditions, and untrained eyes can't tell us all apart.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Zylo, on 04 February 2013 - 12:36 AM, said:

I was running small groups tonight observing the performance of a new recruit since we didn't have enough online for 8-man drops. Ending up with another group on our team by chance was happening maybe 1 out of 5 drops. We were able to verify the presence of another group when I would make a comment like "4 on TS going cave" and would get a reply stating that another group of 4 was on the team.

It appeared that at least some of these matches also had at least a single 4-man group on the enemy team as we recognized the same group of 4 on the enemy team a few times and they seemed to be working together better than a pure pug team would be doing.

its also funny when they say theyre not a premade but they all have the exact same color scheme.

Vassago Rain, on 04 February 2013 - 03:09 PM, said:

Goons are something awful. It's the ancestor of 4chan, and 4chan is the father of reddit.
We're all very different, culturally, even if we share a number of traditions, and untrained eyes can't tell us all apart.

and Lowtax is Goons primarily

[Serapth]

All the 8mans are playing right now, ruining the PUG experience completely.

[Hedonism Robot]

p00k, on 04 February 2013 - 02:38 PM, said:

why should 4mans join with 4 strangers to make an 8man, if pugs won't join with 3 strangers to make a 4man

also, let's be real, a trial mech has no place in 8man right now. so should new players just solo pug until they have an optimized build, rather than joining a <4 man?

You didn't get the post, he is saying that on the clan TS server there are multiple 4 man groups running rather than grouping for an 8 man because they like to stomp pugs and are not looking for a challenge. It doesn't have anything to do with strangers at all, they probably already know each other very well.

[Scryed]

Ilwrath, on 04 February 2013 - 06:59 AM, said:

How about: "Yes. 8 man que was too awful"?

The 8 man que is filled with awful people?

Awful?

Tiny population and its awful. I almost feel sad for the devs.

Why feel sorry for the Devs? They made the game this way, if they listened to all the input being RAGED/capslockswarrior/insightfulposts at them they wouldn't be in this problem. The DEVS brought it upon themselves, they said "We are going to try to be close to tabletop as possible" What a load of crock, at this point the only reason why MWO at this point is better than MW4 is the graphics and weapons balance, thats it.

I feel sorry for no one who refuses to look at data and completely disregards it.

[Gammanoob]

Hedonism Robot, on 04 February 2013 - 04:08 PM, said:

You didn't get the post, he is saying that on the clan TS server there are multiple 4 man groups running rather than grouping for an 8 man because they like to stomp pugs and are not looking for a challenge. It doesn't have anything to do with strangers at all, they probably already know each other very well.

I can confirm this is the case for the Euro Timezone.

Looking during our "Prime Time" I can find multiple large units with an excess of 16 players spread out into 4 man groups.

Seems legit...

---------------------------------------

If anything, any clans/groups/organizations who feel 8-mans are unbalanced should at least limit themselves to two man groups without sync dropping.

That way they can still have a massive advantage but not kill the game for the poor ******** trying to PUG.

Edited by Gammanoob, 04 February 2013 - 04:30 PM.

[Alaric the Arcane]

Serapth, on 04 February 2013 - 04:00 PM, said:

All the 8mans are playing right now, ruining the PUG experience completely.

lol... cry me a f'ing river

Edited by Alaric the Arcane, 04 February 2013 - 04:33 PM.

[Serapth]

Alaric the Arcane, on 04 February 2013 - 04:32 PM, said:

lol... cry me a f'ing river

I cant, Im too busy doing something that requires skill....

Your sister.