173 replies to this topic

[M4NTiC0R3X]

I was writing about how I agree with seeing who's in a pre-made group, and other things which I feel would even out the playing field between solo PUG and premade group. About half way through the write I thought to myself, '' Someday there is probably most likely going to be a very improved and much more functional in-game chat and group voice features " So in the grand scheme of things we'll all have the advantage to listen in, read the chat boxes and provide more input.

One thing I can say for certain is that without any type of PvE for players to practice on and enhance their knowledge/abilities [like easy mode, moderate, hard, deathmode and which weapons should I use because I've tested them on a fully armored Atlas and have a perfect plan of execution.. lol sounds sexy]... lol, i just really don't like being grouped with people who run around like chickens with their heads cut off.. It's not that pre-mades are ruining the game... it's that newbies who run around with their heads cut off and have no clue what weapons or engines or minimum ranges that is usually what makes you get steamrolled over and over and that's what takes away from the overall experience. ELO will help atleast a wee bit.

[Joanna Conners]

Cordy Ceps, on 04 February 2013 - 06:35 AM, said:

Hello everyone

Regarding the premade pugstomp discussion, Id like to make a simple suggestion for starters:

Make the premades recognizeable! Mark the players with a small L1 (for lance 1) and L2 in the players list before battle.

This way, the other team can see that theyre not against uncoordinated pugs BEFORE they lost 5 mechs to focus fire. The better pugs will be able to adapt their tactics.

Also, Im really upset about these games, where you just seem to have no chance , no matter what you do. Personally, Id like to know, if its my and my teams fault or are there really pure pug teams facing 4 and 4+4 man premades.

Because this problem needs to be solved. There are times, where you lose 8 of 10 games as a pug. This cannot be enjoyable experince. Id like to know for sure, if its to my lack of personal skill and there are as many 4-mans landing in my team as in the enemy team, or is there truly a (grave) matchmaking imbalance towards premades.

Another thing id like to add; a comparison to WoT:

In WoT, you have 15vs15 battles. The max amount of players in a premade platoon is THREE.
Three out of fifteen.
Here, its 4 out of eight. Think the rest for yourselves.

And, please, no "Its your fault for not teaming up"- posts. Ive been in several Clans till now, didnt enjoy it.
My RL friends are not into MMOs. Thats it

Maybe people should play intelligently no matter what or who they're up against.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Demona, on 04 February 2013 - 12:26 PM, said:

Maybe people should play intelligently no matter what or who they're up against.

I think people will play the same regardless of whether it's a pre-made or a pug. When I'm playing while my kids are awake, it doesn't matter one bit whether i'm against a pug or a pre-made. lol

[Pihb]

You see the problem is, different people seek different things when they play a game. The organised players want to have grand battles in an organized setting and thats cool. We will call them the Groupies. Others (myself included) want to hop on and blow some **** up when we have a free moment. We will call them the pugs.

From what i can gather from all this is the Groupies want everyone to conform to their interpretation of MWO. "Just go to a ts server and join a 4 man, everything will be fine". The Pugs,
can't or don't want to commit to 3 other people for a set amount of time. That is why i don't group up that often. It would not be fair to 3 other people if i played 3 games and just left cause my kid is beating the other kid with a toy horse cause their sister called them a dummyhead.

All the pugs want is not to play organised teams. Pugs don't care about your tournaments, we don't care about your kdr (or our own for that matter) , we don't care about your merc unit. We just want to drop a few games and have a reasonable chance to have fun. We are not as good as the Groupies and we know this, we just don't care.

Last thing. Information is power. Give us the info so we can see just how prevalent pre mades are (imo i think there is alot more pugs getting stomped by other pugs than anything else) so we can see where the problem lies.

Edited by Pihb, 04 February 2013 - 12:36 PM.

[chiXnhawk]

CLAN TAGS

[Havyek]

Does no one remember what the MatchMaker was in MW4(and 3 and 2)?

Pick the server from the lobby list.


That was your MatchMaker.

[Volume]

This would fix a lot of things.

1: It would fix the whole "perceived pubstomp" problem by showing whether or not it really is or isn't a pubstomp
2: It would show players who is in a group / who might be issuing commands
3: It would demonstrate if the matchmaker puts an equal amount of grouped players on each team
4: It would make the whole "us vs. them" stuff transparent

Sidenote, it might be bad because some people get demoralized when realizing they're against an organized team, and assume that their allies won't listen or help at all.

Also, I did point out the 4/8 and 3/15 thing before. The sad thing is that in this game, just 2 people who know what they're doing and work as a team can make a huge difference, god forbid having 3.

BDU Havoc, on 04 February 2013 - 01:19 PM, said:

Does no one remember what the MatchMaker was in MW4(and 3 and 2)?

Pick the server from the lobby list.


That was your MatchMaker.

And it was a thousand times better because you can at least have some control over what map you get, what weapons/mechs are available, all the NH/UA people can have their own sandbox to play in, arranged teams can play vs. other arranged teams easily, etc. etc...

Edited by Volume, 04 February 2013 - 04:46 PM.

[Deamhan]

Your train of thought can have an influence on how you play. Positive attitude and all that. People talk about seeing premades as if they will only ever be on the opposing team. How about knowing if you have one on your team?

They could identify premades on your own team while leaving the opposing team a mystery.

Edited by Deamhan, 04 February 2013 - 05:34 PM.

[Kunae]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 04 February 2013 - 11:48 AM, said:

Just so you know, I reported your post. As a Jew comparing anything that happens in this game to the holocaust is amazingly stupid.

You should take a break from the game and go get your priorities in real life in order if you are going to post crap like this.

I personally hope you never have to understand what it's like having relatives who have been through that.

Amazing.

Get over yourself, really. The situations are analogous.

All these folks want to deride the hated "premades". Let's mark them, so we know who they are! Let's harass them simply because of what they choose to believe. Let's punish them, because they won't conform to your belief. Let us limit their freedom to associate with others.

The current MM system is an example of this hatred, made manifest. The "demands" being made by the PUG mob are just the next step... what's after that? Reduced XP and money because you want to drop with your friends? People who group forced to only play in "trial" mechs?

It's a slippery slope, and you all have pushed PGI to take the initial steps.

Think about it.

[Aegis Kleais]

Cordy Ceps, on 04 February 2013 - 06:35 AM, said:

Hello everyone

Regarding the premade pugstomp discussion, Id like to make a simple suggestion for starters:

Make the premades recognizeable! Mark the players with a small L1 (for lance 1) and L2 in the players list before battle.

This way, the other team can see that theyre not against uncoordinated pugs BEFORE they lost 5 mechs to focus fire. The better pugs will be able to adapt their tactics.

Also, Im really upset about these games, where you just seem to have no chance , no matter what you do. Personally, Id like to know, if its my and my teams fault or are there really pure pug teams facing 4 and 4+4 man premades.

Because this problem needs to be solved. There are times, where you lose 8 of 10 games as a pug. This cannot be enjoyable experince. Id like to know for sure, if its to my lack of personal skill and there are as many 4-mans landing in my team as in the enemy team, or is there truly a (grave) matchmaking imbalance towards premades.

Another thing id like to add; a comparison to WoT:

In WoT, you have 15vs15 battles. The max amount of players in a premade platoon is THREE.
Three out of fifteen.
Here, its 4 out of eight. Think the rest for yourselves.

And, please, no "Its your fault for not teaming up"- posts. Ive been in several Clans till now, didnt enjoy it.
My RL friends are not into MMOs. Thats it

If you want to ensure you're not fighting a group that is using the overpowering, yet freely available 'teamwork' cheat, you can either join a group (doing, in essence, what they did) or you can play 1v1, (when it becomes available), where there is no option to work with anyone else.

If players come into the game knowing better that this game is unlike the vast majority of other games out there, in that you MUST work together in order to be more successful, then people will just have to realize this and submit to it rather than fight it with the mentality that other games allow (aka "I am an army of 1; I can take on all comers and rise victorious) Cause that's just not gonna happen here, and until someone accepts that, they'll be bashing their head against the walls.

A cooperative 4-man team is enough to usually pick up the slack and turn the tides if they have 4 puggers on their side, but it doesn't change the fact of the matter that if your team choose not to work together, you're just going to lose. Lots. I know it's not fun to lose repeatedly at a game, and this game does not warn players about the importance of teamwork, but take it from someone who knows; find a crew, join up, stop pugging. If you choose to pug, accept the fact of life that a rag tag uncoordinated group against a cooperative 4+ man force is 9 times out of 10 going to lose, even if you personally pulled your weight and more.

It's teamwork; you win together; you lose together.

[Hedonism Robot]

If the premade was marked I would just alt f4 then get into a game where there was no premade. I am sick and tired of people telling us to go find other people to group with. I want to listen to music and shoot robots, I also want close matches that are fair. Premades at the moment just roll people creating shut out games.

[Kanaric]

******** is visible obviously as shown in this thread

[Eddrick]

Being able to tell who is in a group would be nice. But, if they just painted all thier Mechs the same colors, like team colors. You could tell them apart anyway and they could also tell eachother apart when effected by ECM.

[Tempered]

The match maker uses lone wolves as filler for premade groups. They have stated as much and this has always been their intention. It is easier to pick a group of lone wolves in the desired weight class than it is to find two premades with similar weights.

[Joseph Mallan]

Tempered, on 04 February 2013 - 06:56 PM, said:

The match maker uses lone wolves as filler for premade groups. They have stated as much and this has always been their intention. It is easier to pick a group of lone wolves in the desired weight class than it is to find two premades with similar weights.

And right now if you aren't in a group drop you/we are Lone Wolves.

[Tempered]

Absolutely.

[krash27]

Seems like a good idea, can't imagine what any team has to hide that they would be against this.

[Ilwrath]

Jacmac, on 04 February 2013 - 09:49 AM, said:

I agree with you for the most part, however, it must be pointed out that PGI has allowed the situation to happen. I don't believe PGI intended to 'rig' the matchmaking system, they were more likely simply ignorant of how it would be used. I believe you are correct about some players quitting the match or even the game if they could see the premades though.

How hard could it be to ensure that each team has 1 premade before starting to fill up with pubs? Most of the premades has left the 8 man que so there should be plenty to pick from?

[Sean von Steinike]

Erata, on 04 February 2013 - 09:23 AM, said:

I'm not sure what making groups visible is supposed to do except reinforce your persecution complex.

The pre-made groups often claim there is no problem and pre-mades are a tiny minority, so there should not be a complaint by showing just how few pre-mades are out there right? The pre-mades can then feel justified that the problem never existed or was hugely over blown.

[sarkun]

I fully support the OP.

I don't really care if the premades are made visible only after the match, it would just give me something to think about when my team get's wiped 8-1. Was our team really terrible? Or just unlucky to fight a well organized premade?

I PUG because when I once joined a well organized clan, doing just the basic stuff like calling targets and sticking together... the game became so easy it stopped being fun. Played 20 matches, won 19. PUGing is frustrating at times, but much more challenging.

Also support the notion that the teams need to get bigger.

Kunae, on 04 February 2013 - 05:45 PM, said:

Get over yourself, really. The situations are analogous.

OMG. You just gotta be trolling... right?

Edited by sarkun, 05 February 2013 - 01:45 AM.