205 replies to this topic

[Escef]

Crunk Prime, on 10 February 2013 - 04:58 AM, said:

Going "LOL IT HAS WEAKNESSES. JUST SHOOT OFF THE ARMS ITS EASY." is ********.

Well, it's a good thing I didn't say that, isn't it?

Crunk Prime, on 10 February 2013 - 04:58 AM, said:

They can only really be taken down by focusing fire on them the second they are seen. If you miss it becuase it was hiding, it takes out half your team and then some before going down. If a team has more than one, and you have none, you are screwed unless your team is very organized.

The only way, eh? It's a good way, it works. Far from the only.

Crunk Prime, on 10 February 2013 - 04:58 AM, said:

I find the funniest part of your post to be about light mechs being able to outmanuever it. Yes, they can, but just barely. An A1, with a 315XL can stay right on their ***, and all it needs to do is clip them once or twice with a full salvo to completely cripple them, if not kill them in one hit.

As I said, with speed tweak it maxes out at 86.4 kph. Solid numbers, indisputable. The ONLY stock light mechs that have any difficulty outrunning it is the 2X and 4X Raven without speed tweak. Look at the numbers if you don't believe me. Yes, if you stumble into it blind in a light you should expect to die or be neutered. I Alpha'd 36 SRMs into a Commando at somewhere between 100 and 150 meters, took both his arms and side torsos, but the little ******* lived long enough to be part of the victorious cap team.

Crunk Prime, on 10 February 2013 - 04:58 AM, said:

I can take an A1 boating SRMs into a pub match and wipe the floor with the enemy team.

Than I would posit one of the following: you are very good, your opponents all suck, or you are lying. None of those scenarios is particularly relevant, as two are statistical outliers (anyone can own face when they're abnormally good or the opposition is abnormally bad), and the third is a false data point.

Crunk Prime, on 10 February 2013 - 04:58 AM, said:

All the pults need some serious tweaking. Their torso twist is the biggest offender. While every other mech in the game is trying to turn to keep uo with you, you can twist around almost 180 degrees to blast them no matter where you are standing around the enemy mech. If somebody gets behind you, you can instantly twist around and alpha them with your SRMs or dual AC20/Gauss in the case of the K2.

The 'pult also has no horizontal movement in its arms. With all Basic proficiencies unlocked, a Cat's weapons have a 156⁰ field of fire. Which is impressive. Compare to, say, the Hunchback's arm mounted weapons having a whopping 172⁰ field of fire, it seems less impressive. Yes, it's above average, but far from overpowered. And in any case, no, it cannot fire directly behind itself. You can get a peek, but unless you turn your legs you won't be hitting diddly.

Crunk Prime, on 10 February 2013 - 04:58 AM, said:

I can post plenty of after game screens if you want to see proof of A1s ****** everything else.

I've used an SRMcat enough to know its strengths and weaknesses. And I know how badly you are exaggerating.

[Az0r]

Vassago Rain, on 10 February 2013 - 03:55 AM, said:

If money isn't a concern, then why do they get so mad when we total up all the gold they spent to sit in the box?

You're the one(s) who get mad about sitting in the box, not other people. The last time we played your team you spammed LOLCAP, PAY TO SIT IN BOX. You take 8 assault mechs then get mad when people try to use the basecap to mitigate their weight disadvantage.

[QuantumButler]

Escef, on 10 February 2013 - 05:25 AM, said:

Well, it's a good thing I didn't say that, isn't it?



The only way, eh? It's a good way, it works. Far from the only.



As I said, with speed tweak it maxes out at 86.4 kph. Solid numbers, indisputable. The ONLY stock light mechs that have any difficulty outrunning it is the 2X and 4X Raven without speed tweak. Look at the numbers if you don't believe me. Yes, if you stumble into it blind in a light you should expect to die or be neutered. I Alpha'd 36 SRMs into a Commando at somewhere between 100 and 150 meters, took both his arms and side torsos, but the little ******* lived long enough to be part of the victorious cap team.



Than I would posit one of the following: you are very good, your opponents all suck, or you are lying. None of those scenarios is particularly relevant, as two are statistical outliers (anyone can own face when they're abnormally good or the opposition is abnormally bad), and the third is a false data point.



The 'pult also has no horizontal movement in its arms. With all Basic proficiencies unlocked, a Cat's weapons have a 156⁰ field of fire. Which is impressive. Compare to, say, the Hunchback's arm mounted weapons having a whopping 172⁰ field of fire, it seems less impressive. Yes, it's above average, but far from overpowered. And in any case, no, it cannot fire directly behind itself. You can get a peek, but unless you turn your legs you won't be hitting diddly.


I've used an SRMcat enough to know its strengths and weaknesses. And I know how badly you are exaggerating.

And you'd have a point about weapon fields of fire if the huinchback mounted all of it's guns in the arms, but with the cat, ALL OF IT'S GUNS HAVE THE MAX FIELD OF FIRE, where the hunchback's biggest guns are limited to the torso arc only. It's like if all of a hunchbacks guns were arm mounted, and it had a full field of motion.

[Escef]

QuantumButler, on 10 February 2013 - 05:36 AM, said:

And you'd have a point about weapon fields of fire if the huinchback mounted all of it's guns in the arms, but with the cat, ALL OF IT'S GUNS HAVE THE MAX FIELD OF FIRE, where the hunchback's biggest guns are limited to the torso arc only. It's like if all of a hunchbacks guns were arm mounted, and it had a full field of motion.

And you make a valid point. However, There is also the issue of the arms, on every mech, being the one of the weakest hit locations on a mech. You blow the arms off a Hunchie and he's lost... What? Medium lasers? Worst case Large lasers or PPCs. That worst case is a large chunk of the Hunchie's armament. But still not all of it. You take a Hunch's arms and he more likely than not still has a respectable amount of firepower left. Not so with the A1 'pult.

It's a tradeoff. Sometimes it works out, other times, not so much. From experience, there have been several times I've been in my A1 'pult wishing for some torso guns. When you tap out the ammo, or have your arms blown off, you would gladly trade 15 or 20 degrees of torso twist for just 1 energy hard point in your torsos somewhere.

[ConnorSinclair]

Oh **** video updates?

Looks like this thread might not disappear any time soon.

[Norris J Packard]

Escef, on 10 February 2013 - 05:43 AM, said:

And you make a valid point. However, There is also the issue of the arms, on every mech, being the one of the weakest hit locations on a mech. You blow the arms off a Hunchie and he's lost... What? Medium lasers? Worst case Large lasers or PPCs. That worst case is a large chunk of the Hunchie's armament. But still not all of it. You take a Hunch's arms and he more likely than not still has a respectable amount of firepower left. Not so with the A1 'pult.

It's a tradeoff. Sometimes it works out, other times, not so much. From experience, there have been several times I've been in my A1 'pult wishing for some torso guns. When you tap out the ammo, or have your arms blown off, you would gladly trade 15 or 20 degrees of torso twist for just 1 energy hard point in your torsos somewhere.

I am so confused, why are you two comparing a Medium to a Heavy? Under no circumstances will an argument like that ever fly with me.

[QuantumButler]

Escef, on 10 February 2013 - 05:43 AM, said:

And you make a valid point. However, There is also the issue of the arms, on every mech, being the one of the weakest hit locations on a mech. You blow the arms off a Hunchie and he's lost... What? Medium lasers? Worst case Large lasers or PPCs. That worst case is a large chunk of the Hunchie's armament. But still not all of it. You take a Hunch's arms and he more likely than not still has a respectable amount of firepower left. Not so with the A1 'pult.

It's a tradeoff. Sometimes it works out, other times, not so much. From experience, there have been several times I've been in my A1 'pult wishing for some torso guns. When you tap out the ammo, or have your arms blown off, you would gladly trade 15 or 20 degrees of torso twist for just 1 energy hard point in your torsos somewhere.

No, because the A1 pult's ears have a total of 60HP, 40 armor, 20 structure.

It's less damage to core out an A1's CT than to kill both it's ears, I drove my A1 for hours today and only lost ears once, after vaporizing half the enemy team.

[Oni Ralas]

Make SRM ammo highly susceptible to explosion due to heat. Flamer counter boats ahoy!

[Sifright]

QuantumButler, on 10 February 2013 - 05:48 AM, said:

No, because the A1 pult's ears have a total of 60HP, 40 armor, 20 structure.

It's less damage to core out an A1's CT than to kill both it's ears, I drove my A1 for hours today and only lost ears once, after vaporizing half the enemy team.

but you don't understand quantum, when you remove just one ear suddenly the A1 can't do ANYTHING. It's not like he still has 45 damage smashing out every 4 seconds.

GAWD

[Escef]

QuantumButler, on 10 February 2013 - 05:48 AM, said:

No, because the A1 pult's ears have a total of 60HP, 40 armor, 20 structure.

It's less damage to core out an A1's CT than to kill both it's ears, I drove my A1 for hours today and only lost ears once, after vaporizing half the enemy team.

It's less damage to core out any mech than take both of its arms. You haven't exactly proven anything here.

[Norris J Packard]

Escef, on 10 February 2013 - 05:52 AM, said:

It's less damage to core out any mech than take both of its arms. You haven't exactly proven anything here.

The argument being made is that the Catapult is notoriously difficult to hit. That works with Light Mechs (and the Cicada), but that doesn't work with a 65-ton Mech that can stack 6 SRM-6's and use JJ's.

[QuantumButler]

Escef, on 10 February 2013 - 05:52 AM, said:

It's less damage to core out any mech than take both of its arms. You haven't exactly proven anything here.

Then why does everyone claim it's such a good idea to aim at the arms of the A1 catapult, which are constantly moving around since good pilots torso twist, fly, or take over until they are in engagement range?


In MY experience, they never lose their ears until they're ready to die anyway, when it literally doesn't matter if the ear goes, or if they do magically lose one ear somehow, they stiill have a whole DDC Atlas worth of srms in the other ear, halving their DPS? Yes, but the half that is left is still enough to vaporize most mechs in 2 salvos.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Lol Cats are totally OP. I bought a Phract because I refuse to be a part of it.

Its sad people actually debate it. Are these the same people who don't want premade designations in the PUG queue? Lol

[QuantumButler]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 10 February 2013 - 06:00 AM, said:

Lol Cats are totally OP. I bought a Phract because I refuse to be a part of it.

Its sad people actually debate it. Are these the same people who don't want premade designations in the PUG queue? Lol

Protip: they're not debating it, they're lying through their teeth because they don't want their precious cheese to be nerfed.

Don't refuse to be part of it, though, drive a A1 splatcat, abuse the cheese, get all your friends to abuse it as well, the only way we can force PGI to fix it is if we exploit it as much as possible and prove that it IS a problem.

Edited by QuantumButler, 10 February 2013 - 06:09 AM.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Whatever it is, as an adult it hurts to read.

They actually sound like my 5 year old when she tries to rationalize herself out of time out. It hurts my brain that these people figured out how to create an account and download a game.

Edited by Nicholas Carlyle, 10 February 2013 - 06:12 AM.

[Escef]

QuantumButler, on 10 February 2013 - 05:56 AM, said:

Then why does everyone claim it's such a good idea to aim at the arms of the A1 catapult, which are constantly moving around since good pilots torso twist, fly, or take over until they are in engagement range?


In MY experience, they never lose their ears until they're ready to die anyway, when it literally doesn't matter if the ear goes, or if they do magically lose one ear somehow, they stiill have a whole DDC Atlas worth of srms in the other ear, halving their DPS? Yes, but the half that is left is still enough to vaporize most mechs in 2 salvos.

Well, you've also said you have personally vaporized half the enemy team before. And I'm going to tell you the same thing I told Crunk Prime: either you are very good, your opponents all suck, or you are lying. None of those scenarios is particularly relevant, as two are statistical outliers (anyone can own face when they're abnormally good or the opposition is abnormally bad), and the third is a false data point.

In MY experience (see, I can capitalize, too) as a mediocre player (I don't make any claims to greatness here), I have found that sometimes I would get 2 or 3 kills with a handful of assists as well. And other times I've rounded a hill or building and come face to face with 2 other heavies and an ECM Atlas, which gives me one Alpha (which likely won't drop any of them) and then I get gunned to pieces before my weapons recycle or I can get away. I've also found myself swarmed by lights, which is a painful death for just about anyone (though I've killed one with a luck shot before in such circumstances).

Good players will do good in just about any halfway decent machine. A good player will own face in a trial mech. A good player in a good mech should be difficult to stop. And I've seen several bad players get torn to shreds in good mechs, the only reason why they last long at all is because the quality of the mech does a little something to make up for their ineptitude.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

And no I cant do the abusive build thing. Integrity and maturity are important.

[Oni Ralas]

It's cheese due to the limitations of open space, the general speed of such a boat (70+kph is hard to run from if you turn a corner on one) + jump jet manuverability. There are no counters for SRM, other than "engage at range" (see above) and go for the ears.


Many things are broken, mainly (IMHO) how the dropship matching is done. Tonage and firepower are not being used for proper matching - it's a free for all no matter what.

Edited by Oni Ralas, 10 February 2013 - 06:16 AM.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

If I wasn't typing on my phone id break down why your post has a many logical fallacies and poor conclusions Escef. Jesus Christmas.

[Escef]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 10 February 2013 - 06:16 AM, said:

If I wasn't typing on my phone id break down why your post has a many logical fallacies and poor conclusions Escef. Jesus Christmas.

No, please, tell me how a good player in a good mech should be easy to stop. I'd love to hear it. Tell me about how skill should be irrelevant.