22 replies to this topic

[Kempner]

Hey all,


I'd like to get input from the community about playing mechs as snipers in MWO.

On the building side, do you devote all your weaponry to long-range combat? Or do you prefer a mix, in order to be able to defend yourself against lights or when you're up close? And what sort of mix, by tonnage? On the one hand, if you get all long-range weaponry you'll be able to do the most damage when at your preferred range. On the other hand, you're probably meat when in close combat.

On the playing side, I know about hanging back and trying not to expose much of yourself while shooting, but in general any input would be great

[dal10]

gauss rifles are your friend (large lasers, and ppcs are good as well). stay away from EVERYTHING. yes you need armor, try to shoot targets that are already engaged, stops that one random mech from bull rushing you because it is already busy.

[Xenon Codex]

As above. The key to sniping is to remain inconspicuous as long as possible. I prefer to NOT carry LRM's, as that's just a smoke signal for a bored enemy (usually a light) to come find you.

Sometimes you can find a nice perch and gallery shoot all day, sometimes you have to duck and cover. When sniping, I try to get out there fast and get the first few shots off (ER PPC), but once the enemy has lined up and starts returning fire I start moving.

Lights are the bane of a sniper. If you get harassed by a light and don't have lasers or streaks to fight him off, you have several options:
- Try to circle with him and die, unless you get really lucky with PPC/Guass.
- Stop and back into a corner, wait for him to fly by, then try to give chase and shoot him as he's going away or coming back towards you. Works with a faster mech (like a Dragon) but not so much with the slower mechs (stay in the corner and call for help if you can). But if you land a good hit or two he'll think twice and might go bug someone else.
- Always know where your team is and run to them, hoping the light gets distracted or retreats.
- If so equipped, use your jump jets to get away. For example, on River City around the docks/Citadel drop into the water and make him follow you down, then immediately jump back up and scurry off towards your team. Or turn around and core him as he heads for an exit.

Another tip: Don't waste too much time moving and getting into position! Your team needs you to be scoring damage and if you're wandering off looking for a good spot they'll be dead that much faster. So stick near them, or at least a small group of brawlers, and be prepared to offer support even if your position isn't optimal.

Edited by XenonCx, 15 February 2013 - 08:35 AM.

[Antique]

sniping is fun as hell, but it requires tons of cbills to work properly. you need the right mech, the right loadout and finaly some of the elite skills (not mandatory).

i curently have 2 sniper mechs, a CTF-Muromets with dual gaus and 3 MLas, 5 tons of gauss ammo, but i find that since the gauss speed nerf it is harder to properly snipe anything from long distances so i stick to a medium distance and try to peel the important parts from mechs (for example the hunchback's hunch). the lasers are there to deal with those pesky lights and to do some dmg after your ammo goes south.

then i have a AWS-8Q that i equiped with 4 PPC in the torso slots and loads of double heat sinks, though i am contemplating to equip some med pulse lasers too due to pesky lights. the key here is to manage heat when you do alpha strikes on sure targets, belive me you dont wanna shut down and see a sloooooooooooooooow mech limping away with a critical part that you can snipe but can't due to you being overheated.

one last thing, dont buy the increased zoom module, it comes in handy once every 100 years, otherwise its a waste of general exp and cbills.

[Kempner]

How can the increased zoom not be worth it!? Really?

If so that's really good to know because I was thinking about getting it when I have 5k gxp.

[Gothbloodman]

Kempner, on 15 February 2013 - 09:21 AM, said:

How can the increased zoom not be worth it!? Really? If so that's really good to know because I was thinking about getting it when I have 5k gxp.

I do not have it, but have seen it in action. It is a DIGITAL zoom and is grainy as he77. You basically can't see anything on it.

[Raso]

Another tip is to be mindful of the locations of your weapon systems. Higher mounted weapons will allow you to peak over a hill to fire while exposing less of your body while lower mounted weapons require you to expose more of yourself.

The Cataphract has some high mounted energy hard points on it's left and right torso but it's ballistic hard points are all mounted along the hip. A pair of PPCs or ERPPCs can work well as a pop up sniper but Gauss builds are also popular.

The Catapult K2 is also popular due to it's side torso mounted ballistic hard points. You can strip the armor off of it's arms (or "ears", if you prefer) and mount the gauss rifles in the side torso for superior pinpoint damage.... but you won't be mounting much else.

The Stalker with 4 to 6 PPCs is also a popular build at the moment. An alpha from 6 ERPPCs at point blank is enough to make even an Atlas panic and find cover. You also have the option to combine PPCs or large lasers with LRMs to provide superior long range support options.

Perhaps less popular is a Hunchback 4G or 4H with a gauss mounted in the shoulder. The hunch allows you to peek over hills and take shots with out exposing too much of your body and starts and goes pretty fast allowing you to quickly pop up and down before they know what hit them. You could also mount a few PPCs in the 4P and it would work much the same.

You don't see as many as you use to, but a Dragon with a gauss and PPC can also work well as a mid range, direct fire support unit. It has the the speed to keep distance and you could even equip them with LRMs to supplement, your long range effectiveness, or SSRMs and medium lasers, to give yourself extra close to mid range effectiveness.

Finally you have the odd Cicada or Jenner PPC turret builds. Not terrible effective but also not terribly ineffective.... basically do it for the lulz but you'll otherwise be gimping your team. When the PPC EM effect comes into play to scramble ECM a light with a single PPC might become usful as an ECM hunter but beyond that lights don't make the best snipers....... On the other hand REAL MEN go into combat with Spiders equipped with a single gauss rifle! (seriously, though, don't do that)

[Ursh]

Well, as a Cicada pilot who has shot a person or two with ppcs, I can say that you're not gimping your team anymore than the cicada pilot who thinks they have to play like a much easier to hit Jenner with 4-6 medium lasers.

If you're not a terrible shot, you can snipe with a cicada, and frustrate the enemy team a lot because you accelerate, brake, and reposition faster than they do.

I've mastered the Catapult K2, and the Cataphract 3D, 2X, and 1X. I enjoy sniping with the Cicadas more than the Cataphracts, because the cataphracts force you to expose your entire torso to get a shot off, and they aren't particularly nimble.

You can also put two ERPPCs on the Cicada 3M and still have a fast mech, which isn't something you can really do with any other mech. You can also snipe with the ECM Spider, by putting an ERPPC on it. It's not the best mech, but it can almost make you feel useful in a spider.

If you're pugging your team is going to suck most of the time. If you're a good player and they suck, they're gimping you, even if you're rolling with a 2xERPPC Cicada 2A and they're rolling with a DDC or Splatcat.

Allow me to show you a video I made of my Cicada 2A with 2xERPPC in a losing pug match. You'll notice by the end that it clearly wasn't me who was gimping the team.

Do you think I would have made much of a difference by mounting a bunch of medium lasers and running around like a Jenner? I don't think I would have. I've gotten better since this video, I can now reliably hit slow moving assaults from 800+ meters. Nothing special for some of the elite guys out there, but good for me.

Any mech that can mount 2 or more ppcs can be a sniper. Some do it better than others due to hardpoint location.

[NRP]

It's best to use a mech with hard points as high as possible. The Cat-K2, STK, and DRG-1C come to mind as viable sniping platforms. There might be others too.

As for weapons, Gauss rifle and (ER)PPCs are best because they allow you to "shoot and scoot". ERLLs work well too, but you have to hold on target and the beam immediately gives away your location.

[Omar Ravenhurst]

I have about 250 drops in my sniper hunches and they are an absolute blast. They require a very strange loadout and you have to get used to using them, but once you do, they are absolutely hated by the opfor. I'll give you my design tips below.

Right up front, let me say that these mechs are not good as brawlers and are pretty useless against a light. You must be a good shot, and you MUST choose your locations carefully. I agree with posters above that the zoom module is of little use. The image is very blurry and not much of an improvement in real terms. For the price and xp, it should be 5x or better and the image should be crystal clear. One more note, speed is key. You need to be able to run away from a brawl and reposition quickly, so drop in as big an engine as reason and resources allow.

The tactic you'll employ is to just pop your head and the gun pod above a ridgeline. I suggest using thermal imaging at all times. These are DPS snipers, so staying on target is important. They are also useful to suppress and pin down an enemy, so don't worry so much about kills. Just chew through armor and make them keep their heads down. If your team is even marginal, they'll use this advantage to approach the opfor. These designs are also effective counters against ecm.

With that out of the way, let's move on to the builds. I use the 4p and the 4g for this role. I've tried just about every possible weapons combination and here's what is best. In both these builds I'm putting all or most of the weapons in the torso gun pod. I know that sounds a bit mental, but it's great as you just have to put the guns and your head into view. The other advantage in doing this is that there are no convergence issues as all the guns are along the same axis.

For the 4p, I put 3ERLL in the torso and that's it. I keep them on chain fire, so I can manage their heat. DPS is less than 7, but your alpha is 27. The key is to keep them steady, so they do damage to a single location. Headshots are not uncommon and they're very useful for knocking the ears off a cat.

I like the 4p, but the 4g is way more fun and even more crazy. I put 2xAC/2 plus an AC/5 in the torso and back that up with a medlas on the right arm. The medlas is just there for killing blows or to swat away a light. I carry about 9 tons of total ammo. I do not use these in chain fire. The greatest difficulty with this build is that the AC/2 and AC/5 rounds travel at different speeds and have different cooldowns (.5 and 1.7 respectively), making it difficult to put all rounds on target. Yes, your alpha is terrible at 14, and the ACs just do 9, but your DPS for just the ACs is 11, and that's a bunch. For example, that's higher than a twin AC/20 cat. You're up in LRM/20 territory assuming all the missles hit. I know that alpha sounds bad, but I have killed charging, undamaged Atlases several times simply by chewing throught their CT or head. If it takes 6 or 7 seconds for them to charge you, that's 60 to 80 points of damage. That's twin gauss, twin ac/20 territory from a 50ton mech.

Ok, a few notes before I close. Both of these mechs can have heat problems, but they are not serious. I run DHS in both and I can run on Caustic with no problem. Obviously the 3xERLL are the bigger issue and thus the reason for chain fire. The trick with sniping is that you often have several seconds between shots and during repositioning, so you can use that time to bleed off heat. Speaking of repositioning, do it, and do it often. These builds get you noticed because they're both very annoying. You will find that people will ignore an Atlas and focus on you because of the whap, whap, whap upside their head. If you keep poping up in the same place or, worse, stay still you will die very quickly. That said, it's a hoot to stand at a ridgeline and shoot people while counter fire impacts the dirt all around you. Friendly ECM is also very useful to you, so stand near a DDC if possible. Because of your minimal exposure and the reduced sensor range, they may not even know you're there until it's too late. Finally, I typically use adv sensor range and adv target info modules.

Good hunting!

Edited by KamikaziChaser, 15 February 2013 - 06:35 PM.

[Stingz]

Mount long ranged weapons in the torso, or arms without lower-arm actuators. Fully-movable arms seem impossible to hold steady at long-range.

[nungunz]

Another thing to keep in mind while sniping is which enemies are the biggest threat and where they are damaged. My favorite sniping mech by far is the "Poptart" Cataphract-3D with 2 ER-PPCs (one in each side torso) and a Guass Rifle in the arm. That gives me a 35 point alpha (just enough to pull off a 1-hit headshot).

As the Guass is in the arm and has limited ammo, I only use this when I have a sure shot or when I don't have the heat to fire a PPC. It's also useful for pulling off shot that torso mounted weapons can't.

The torso energy slots are great because they are situated very high on the mech and you don't have to expose mech of the mech to pull off a shot.

I always try to evaluate where placing a shot will do the most damage. If I can find a light that held still, I'll try it hit a leg or side-torso (they usually have XL engines). On other mechs, I'll target sections that have the most dangerous weapons to try and crit them out. This usually means going for side torsos, but it really depends on a mech-by-mech basis.

Stay in cover and get a lock. Wait for targeting info. Choose which location is best to apply your damage to, then pop out of cover and take the shot.

When not shooting keep make sure to keep un-armed sections (usually arms) facing the enemy so you don't take damage to your torso slots (though this is true in most cases whether you are a sniper or not).

Remember it is your job to surgically remove dangerous components of an enemy mech either by destroying the section or destroying the weapon through critical hits.

See a Centurion? Take off the right arm...if it's a CN9-A, hit the left torso (missile slots).

Dragon? Go for a torso if you can, they usually pack XL engines, if not go for the right arm (big gun).

Catapult? Go for the cockpit as it's easy to hit.

Atlas? Depends on how and where it's damaged, these are trickier.

Cataphract? Right torso, or whatver is most damaged.

Hunchback? Right Torso unless it's a 4SP, then hit whatever is most damaged.

Stalker? Right or Left Torso

If you can make take a shot at a gauss rifle or AC/20 to try and destroy them with critical hits, take those shots (usually damaged side torsos)

Granted if you can take a kill-shot through the center torso on any of the above mech, take the shot. A dead mech is better than a crippled mech.

Edited by nungunz, 15 February 2013 - 08:47 PM.

[Hex Pallett]

Didn't read any reply cuz I'm kinda in a hurry.

There're basically three types of sniping: Long-range direct fire support, tactical sniping, and Trollcannon.

For direct fire support, get a Dragon 5N or a Cataphract 4X, something that can mount multiple low-power Autocannons (AC2, AC5, UAC5), and keep shooting. Remember to Re-deploy frequently, because these weapons are not ideal for dealing with point-blank combat. Alternatively, you ca have something that carries a few large lasers, stand above brawling range and keep firing.

For "tactical" sniping, aka dealing good damage on a single spot, you need something that packs some good punch without sacrificing your ability of constantly dealing damage. With that you'll need something that can carry two Gauss or something like one Gauss plus a pair of PPC/ERPPC. Catapult K2 and Ilya are ideal for this kind of build. Of course a mixture of Gauss and Lasers would also suffice, but that would eventually come down to your own playstyle.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand at last, but by no mean the least, the Trollcannon. A term I invented specifically those build that can deal ridiculous burst damage by Alpha, but can't keep firing for long and totally lacks close-combat ability; those Assaults that can boat quad, or even hexa, PPCs.

[Antique]

Kempner, on 15 February 2013 - 09:21 AM, said:

How can the increased zoom not be worth it!? Really?

If so that's really good to know because I was thinking about getting it when I have 5k gxp.

well the zoom is kinda useless due to its very very poor zoom image quality and shakiness (you move by a fraction and it goes miles away), i've used it and prospered like 2 times in a hundred games with sniper mechs, its not worth the gxp and the cbills. it also cant be used with gauss, since the gauss speed is 1.2k it is too slow to hit anything that is moving at a range that you must use the extra zoom to see them.

i'd suggest you try sniping in a cat-k2, since you can try both the gauss builds and the ppc builds.

oh yah one general tip, avoid using ER PCCs since they are not worth the heat increase. if you are massing ppcs then use normals, if you have 1 then you can use ER PPC, but that isn't sniping in my opinion. i like to have that 1 big shot that i have to pinpoint to use effectively, so i use 4 ppcs in 1 group or 2 gauss in 1 group. but thats just my playstyle.

[Stingz]

Antique, on 16 February 2013 - 01:44 AM, said:

oh yah one general tip, avoid using ER PCCs since they are not worth the heat increase. if you are massing ppcs then use normals, if you have 1 then you can use ER PPC, but that isn't sniping in my opinion. i like to have that 1 big shot that i have to pinpoint to use effectively, so i use 4 ppcs in 1 group or 2 gauss in 1 group. but thats just my playstyle.

Switch over to Large Pulse instead if you get too close, too often. Same damage for less heat/range.

[liku]

one funny thing is to have some LRM 20 and Lrm 5. Put the Lrm 5 In chain fire. Poke some LLas snipe then swap position.
Repere the target..preferably one light or medium, you should be at around 450-550 meter...shoot one salo... wait 2 secon then teh orther salvo...

The guys usually dont run fore cver but straight at you... then.. snipe with your lovely LLas until et got past 300 meter... then shoot the "you die now button" with the 2 LRM20 and 2 LRM 5.

Just need a little finish touch with LLas if it is other species than a light

[Louis Ci Fier]

Ok,

Here is a thing. I put some ideas in a video. They are not the normal ideas about sniping.

[panzer1b]

For extreme range sniping there is only 2 viable weapons atm, erppcs and erlls.

Now erlls ONLY work well if you boat the crap out of them in order to outtrade at long ranges where ppcs cant realiably hit your mech. It is best to have 4-6 erll per mech if you really want to use that weapon, and try to go for things that are far from cover and unable to return fire, the trick is to get as much free dmg before they inevitable close the distance and murder you.

erppcs are imo better, since you are able to fire and forget, and work best with just 2 erppcs (more then that and you are going ti melt in all but assasults) powered by like 20 or so heatsinks. Your best bet is fire and forget peeking/poptarting, since ppcs allow instant damage and dont require facetabnking or looking at the enemy for lkong. It takes alot of skill/luck to hit stuff far away, but they have the longest theoretical range of any weapon so take advantage of it to get free dmg in.

gauss is the 3rd option, bt since the range nerf its nolonger viable much longer then ~1km without quirks and modules to extend the range.

[Saint Atlas and the Commando Elf]

not sure if OP's grandchildren are actually watching this..

[Mazzyplz]

here is my own build and tactic for sniper. this build engages from outside the enemies range completely. 1000+ meters

i prefer to dedicate just barely enough tons for 2 srm tons with very little ammo for it, has saved me a lot of times not only vs light mechs but to increase my punch and make my mech carry its weight in death train mode or when you hit someone from afar with gauss and they close in you can use all your weapons. so some backup weapons are nice to have.



when a team of yours nascars you need to learn to nascar as well. sniping can be your own death...

you need to stay at the back of your team but that's the thing, if the team rushes ahead quickly or you get distracted sniping you can die from a flank very easily. i wouldn't say stay away from everything but rather only stay at the back of your team, not separated from your team. this is easier said than done.