205 replies to this topic

[WarHippy]

Rotaugen, on 15 February 2013 - 01:37 PM, said:

Once again, which part of you get 4 more free mech bays by starting a new account do you not get? Yes, you have to sign in again, but it is still free. You pay for the convenience of one sign in. MC get you stuff faster, not more stuff, outside of the hero's that generate c-bills faster and really aren't the best option in their class. So, you CAN keep all the mechs you buy with c-bills permanently. You don't have to have just one account and sell them off. You can have one account per chassis and get Master level on ALL of them.

The suggestion of having people make multiple accounts is pretty stupid. For one thing it makes it harder know how many players the game really has. It also allows people who want to circumvent the match making system to stomp on new players chasing them off(Smurfing in LoL). It is just a bad idea to promote that in my book.

The reason I don't have a problem with other options for getting mech bays is because I understand that there are a lot of people that play games in different ways and for different reasons. For instance you have players that like to collect things like champions in LoL or mechs in MW:O. The difference is in LoL those players have a place, but they are not readily welcome here. For a game community to grow it needs to appeal to more than one group type.

[RickySpanish]

Sir Burpalot21, on 15 February 2013 - 01:21 PM, said:

Perhaps I overreacted. My apologies.
I will however still have to disagree about the cost of things in GW2. While yes, gold and gems are tied together that doesn't put pressure on players to spend money on gems. It's far better than an auction house system which is far more open to exploitation. In addition, the dye system works perfectly fine. While it might not be account based as initially proposed, they drop so often that's really not a problem. Most rare dyes cost less than a single ecto on the trade post so if there is a color you want (besides black and white) it's cheap to obtain.
Even Anet admitted the Karka event was handled poorly so they made amends to those who disconnected and didn't get the final chest and said they would refrain from holding 1-time events in such a short time frame.
As for legendaries. They are supposed to be something to work for. It should be understood by anyone that it's going to be a long endeavor. For Guild Wars 1 you had to grind a lot for the best looking armor. This isn't that much different.

I don't think there is anything wrong with how MWO markets itself as a free-2-play title. I think the problem lies with some consumers who are not familiar with how the model works and how to judge the value of the offerings of such games.

After the karka event I stopped playing for a couple of weeks to get on with other endeavours, after which I came back to see what they'd done in the aftermath. I got the chest in the mail and figured it'd be pretty funny if I opened it and there was a precursor inside... And there was. At that point I got quite conflicted - do I keep playing now, despite how enraging the whole event thing was coupled with my misgivings about the gold/gem system, because I did get compensated in the end, or do I stick to my guns and leave? I played on for a bit, did some WvW, a bit of sPvP and some fractals but honestly I just didn't feel right playing it anymore, I kept thinking that I'd made a decision and my reasons for making that decision hadn't changed, and my choice to stop playing wasn't made any less valid by a new shiny item. After the Christmas event I decided to give it a rest and still haven't gone back.

I think in the end, I bought into the hype a little too much, and upon realising that 'cosmetic' items were just another grind (albeit from a different angle) got so disillusioned that I couldn't keep playing it.

Finally, I agree with your point that consumers can have a misconception of the meaning of "Free to Play", but would add that it is by its very nature a bit more of a grey area than the standard "here's $60 where's my game" model, because you may end up freely paying far more for the game - that's cool, as long as you're aware of how much more effective the F2P model can be psychologically.

[Xyroc]

" Free to play " - in order to play the game no purchase is required before hand ... yep its free to play ...

[Commander Kobold]

Mackman, on 15 February 2013 - 08:50 AM, said:

you have to set aside labels and just ask yourself: Is this game worth $7? And if you've played enough to fill up all four mechbays, then the answer is a blatantly obvious yes.

this game, as it is currently, is not worth 7$ it isn't worth 5$ the only people who would sink money into this are fans of the series that either a) hope that with enough funding the game will change for the better (i hope it does but I'm not spending money on a beta for obvious reasons) or b ) people with too much disposable income

Edited by Omni 13, 15 February 2013 - 02:02 PM.

[Furmansky]

Well I think, many things are overpriced in MWO. But they are not mandatory and you still can do fine without even extra mech bays, to add the bay prices are actually reasonable and worth those few bucks. Look out for promotions, like the now ongoing Valentine 1 premium and MC off, I think its not so very bad. Definitely this game is still free to play.

[Sir Burpalot21]

RickySpanish, on 15 February 2013 - 01:49 PM, said:

Finally, I agree with your point that consumers can have a misconception of the meaning of "Free to Play", but would add that it is by its very nature a bit more of a grey area than the standard "here's $60 where's my game" model, because you may end up freely paying far more for the game - that's cool, as long as you're aware of how much more effective the F2P model can be psychologically.

This is true. The very nature of successful F2P relies on converting freebies to buyers which utilizes micro-transactions in the hopes that consumers make smaller purchases over time. It's success hinges on impulse buys.
Impulse buys are not a new thing to gamers. Its the primary reason why Steam sales are so popular.

Furthermore the psychology of micro-transactions is in many ways similar to gambling, for better or for worse. I'm the type who approaches gambling with set standards and limits which allows me to pull out in a reasonable manner while still having fun. However, there are others who get sucked in and end up loosing massive amounts.
Do I fault the casino industry for this? No, because I believe people are ultimately responsible for what luxuries they spend their own money on.

Edited by Sir Burpalot21, 15 February 2013 - 02:19 PM.

[Mr Mantis]

I am not a fan of the payment model myself, but whatever your opinion it is free to play. I don't see any problem with how they have it set up with heros and cosmetic. only thing that gives any true benefit would be some hard point variation, everything else is just nice to have.

[TheMightyWashburn]

The "OP is ***" sentiment comes to mind when I read this. But Im sure that violates some rule here so I am only speaking hypothetically.

[Mackman]

Omni 13, on 15 February 2013 - 02:01 PM, said:

this game, as it is currently, is not worth 7$ it isn't worth 5$ the only people who would sink money into this are fans of the series that either a) hope that with enough funding the game will change for the better (i hope it does but I'm not spending money on a beta for obvious reasons) or b ) people with too much disposable income

Well, here we have two options.

1. You haven't filled up four mech bays, and thus have an extremely limited understanding of the new/free player experience, and consequently you have nothing to contribute to this conversation, or...

2. You have​ filled up four mech bays, thereby investing an inordinate amount of time into a game that, in your own words, is not worth $5. In that case, I just feel sorry for you that your time is so utterly worthless that you can afford to spend so much of it for so little gain.

If it's 1, no more needs to be said. If it's 2... get help, sir. Your time is more valuable than this.

[Xendojo]

To the people who think this game is P2W...






EDIT: Also...

Edited by Xendojo, 15 February 2013 - 03:00 PM.

[IceSerpent]

WarHippy, on 15 February 2013 - 01:31 PM, said:

Actually LoL is F2P because you can buy heroes with in game currency or real money and keep them. MWO is mostly F2P because you can buy a mech with in game currency or real money but only get to keep them all if you spend extra real money.

You get 4 free mech bays per account and you can have as many accounts as you want, therefore you can keep as many mechs as you want without spending any real money.

[Mister Blastman]

StalaggtIKE, on 15 February 2013 - 11:17 AM, said:

Who cares about previous games? Within the current competitive scene of MWO, the Dragon does not fullfil a necessary role. That's not to say the Dragon is not a great mech, but it's not missed in the competitive scene.

What? I can't hear you. I'm too busy boosting my stats by killing PUGs. I've been booted from the competitive scene due to my lack of knowledge.

[Wintersdark]

Khobai, on 15 February 2013 - 10:00 AM, said:

And I agree. Mech bays are perfectly costed. I just don't agree that 4 mech bays is enough to keep free players interested in the game. I really don't see the harm in allowing players to buy upto 4 additional mech bays with c-bills. At most it's costing PGI $4 per paying customer... but they're increasing the grind length for free players by almost four times. So those free players will stick around for that much longer.

Seriously, 4 bays is enough. If they actually master a chassis - that's a substantial amount of play time right there, buy another mech, like them all enough to not sell any of them... And they are STILL unwilling to pay $1.75? Well, then, there's the door.

My story:
A Commando 2D was my first mech bought. Did reasonably well with it, but didn't really like it.

Bought a flame with MC - my first game purchase - when they were released. I was poor, this of course was before the cadet bonus. I loved my Flame, so my next two mechs were two DRG variants. Pushed the FLM up to Master. At this point I'd still ONLY spent MC on the Flame.

I decided to go to Catapults next, so I sold my two standard Dragons (I wasn't particularly fond of them), bought an A1 then a C1, filling my mech bays. I enjoyed them, got enough XP to master both, then (wanting to buy a third Catapult, but wanting to keep the Flame I'd mastered) I sold the Commando 2D, and bought a K2.

At that point, two months had gone by and I had mastered 4 mech variants (FLM, A1, C1, K2). I still had just 4 mech bays.

Two months. Now I could have continued playing these chassis, or sold them (I generally don't play the K2 and C1 anymore) but I'm not a cheap ******* and I was loving the game, so I dumped my remaining MC into Mech Bays and everything opened up.

I didn't have to, though. I could have sold the K2 and C1, bought, say, two Hunchbacks, sold one after getting enough XP with it and then bought a third.

The system, as it is, is perfectly fine and reasonable.

Don't be a cheap *******.

[Lyoto Machida]

Dude...its like $1.25 for a mechbay. Not sure how that is "pay to win" but stop being a cheapskate. There isn't really anything you can't get by grinding as a free player that people with MC can't get that matters in game (except maybe hero mechs).

[Rahnu]

The fact that so many players apparently think making new accounts is an acceptable workaround is deeply disconcerting.

MWO is going to be so full of smurfs, I can't imagine the new player experience is ever going to be anywhere near remotely acceptable.

Edited by Zyrusticae, 15 February 2013 - 04:16 PM.

[Kinney]

RickySpanish, on 15 February 2013 - 08:33 AM, said:

There seems to be a trend with recent games like MWO, Guild Wars 2 and even Deadspace 3 where micro-transactions have become... less micro. In all three cases they are still optional, and MWO has the distinct advantage of not costing the down-payment on a house to purchase AS WELL AS the "micro-transactions" that follow, nevertheless perhaps we could move away from "Free To Play" and the expectations that entails (no we can't -Finance & Marketing Dept.).

Uh, GW2 is not F2P. You still have to purchase the game, there's just no monthly fee. There is a difference. Just felt that needed to be pointed out.

[Bogus]

I personally can't stand the F2P/MT/whatever-you-want-to-gussy-it-up-as model but I would like to note that MWO is perfectly playable without paying cash money. I set up a free account to test this...the cadet program really does make a huge difference as do the various economic adjustments, yall should try it if you've not already. If it was still November I'd probably agree with you but it's a different game now.

I do think that four mechbay slots is too few given how the pilot tree works. Should really be six to eight; one for each class and several for whatever mech(s) you're currently needing to level up.

Edited by Bogus, 15 February 2013 - 04:31 PM.

[Oppresor]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. If they were to make it like it used to be, a one of payment of say £34.00 I would pay it. But the idea of paying loads of small or not so small payment is wrong.

[Taizan]

I had 4 different mechs / 2 different chassis leveled up to master, fully equipped and had a great time playing before getting any MCs or additional mechbays. 4 Mechbays are really enough to get a solid foot on MWO before you decide to invest any money for MCs. I think 2 would even suffice, but I guess PGI is being nice.

[Tetatae Squawkins]

I still don't understand how having extra mechbays makes you more powerful. It's a convenience. Nothing more.

Oppresor, on 15 February 2013 - 04:32 PM, said:

I've said it before and I'll say it again. If they were to make it like it used to be, a one of payment of say £34.00 I would pay it. But the idea of paying loads of small or not so small payment is wrong.

That is simply the way FTP games work. You will have to get used to it.

Edited by crabcakes66, 15 February 2013 - 04:55 PM.