2021 replies to this topic

[Pendraco]

[RedDragon]

MonkeyCheese, on 25 August 2013 - 05:37 PM, said:

So how is this not giving the player an advantage in a split 1pv/3pv match?

The lies and broken promises are one thing but this no advantages with 3pv is a joke...

Ah, makes me feel playing MW4 again back in the good old days. What a fun time we had. Not.

[RussianWolf]

Finally checked my bank account. My PP refund has been fully processed.

[carl kerensky]

BattleTechMan, on 25 August 2013 - 08:39 AM, said:

At first I was really upset at PGI, but the more I think about it, i think its IGP fault. Let me explain why I think this is. In an age where developers ram unwanted features on the developers and customers alike, I think Im gonna blame them. Ive been playing since march or may of early closed beta last year. At that time the games vision was one that kicked some serious ***. Community warfare, U.I. 2.0 and other features were promised. 3pv on the other hand was promised not to ever be in the game, and coming from just the developer PGI I believed them. The problem is shareholders and publishers like IGP make pisss poor decisions, and force it on the developers. In less than 6 months from announcing 3pv its now in game, where other features like U.I. 2.0 have been lagging for over a year. Why? Because IGP forced PGI to divert resources from things like U.I. 2.0 and community warfare to things that they think will pull in gobs of cash, things like 3pv. And when we cry foul, poor PGI who is under a contract to defend whatever decisions IGP makes, makes them look bad to us. Just look at the apology made. Seems more like a forced one by IGP than PGI. Money diverted from the Founders program to other games, and forced features on developers and customers alike, are all hallmarks of bad publishers ruining games like usual, not bad developers.

So in conclusion, I am asking IGP and any of the staff to just go away. Thank you for getting the cash flow going for this great game, but you are out of touch with your customers, and you need to back off, or better yet, just let PGI make the development decisions before you kill your money makers so to speak. Would be even better if PGI could just drop the crappy developer and move on to a crowd funding system with no publisher. At nearly $16 million and counting for games like Star Citizen, people are crying for a new way do make video games, and to get rid of out of touch, poor decision making, lame non- playing video game publishers.

I try not to buy into conspiracy theories BUT this scenerio could be very plausible. I remember when Microsoft got a hold of Mechwarrior. They backed Mechwarrior 4. If anyone recalls the Mech4 test that was released it had some sim elements that helped the immersion. Loved the test better than the actual game. It was great. Once it got released those elements were removed, effectively DUMBING down the experience. Afterwards they shelved the license for a long time. It seems these companies that get a hold of this intellectual property become blinded by the dollar sign instead of being focused on delivering that sim experience we all have been waiting for. Now it seems history is repeating itself once again. The idea for self funding sounds like a real good option.
Ck

[Compit]

...Im actually quite ok with this...

All i see are the "OMG ITS LIKE A WALLHACK" kind of posts and nearly nobody is commenting on its drawbacks :/

YES. having 3rd person gives the ability of a uav and gives a slight Tactical advantage at SPECIFIC occasions...
but does it give you a combat advantage.. NOT AT ALL!!

Despite being able to see over a edge the 3rd person view is a HORRIBLE way to fight. Forced Arm-lock, Lack of minimap/lance-list and ofcourse that the weapons move with the mech instead of staying focused on the cursor. Combined this makes 3rd person more of a tactical-tool rather then a game-mode. ive seen so many mechs that died miserably against a 1st person pilot that its hilarious. especcially Long-range firing is near impossible in 3pv.
also dont forget that the drone itself can be spot. ive spotted lots of hiding scouts by those little white discs.



So im indifferent to it. Its a mere tactical tool that needs a bit of time to be tuned and for the people to warm up to it.
It is not causing me to rage in game, yell that im uninstalling nor demanding that i get a refund.

Its the ECM and Artemis introduction all over again...that also had resistance and now everbody is ok with their influences, once they got the nescessary tweaks for them.

[AndyHill]

The reason nobody is commenting on the drawbacks is because they just don't matter. The F4 key (or any other key for that matter) on most keyboards can handle multiple presses even per match, so you can pick the moments you utilize 3rd person so that you only get the benefits.

[TLBFestus]

shellashock, on 24 August 2013 - 02:36 PM, said:

To be honest, probably by next patch they will enable the hardcore queues. My guess is that they wanted as many people to play 3rd person and gather data from their matches, plus feedback, and then enable the queues.

If they enabled them from the start, they probably wouldn't have enough players playing 3rd person view to get enough data for them to justify tweaking 3rd person. Judging by the community backlash, I say that they got more then enough feedback and data to properly tweak 3rd person view, but we will have to wait to see what PGI says.

If they want most of the community to stick around, they probably won't dare push enabling the 1st person queues back more then 2 patches, but given their track record, who knows?

This is exactly indicative of the problem though. It's poor, very poor communication that is at the root of all the angst.

If they wanted us to test 3rd person, they should have simply asked/stated it and been open about it. Most would have been glad to test it, even if it was begrudgingly.

If they had had 2 separate queues and one of them was servicing a much lower percentage of the player base, wouldn't that in and of itself be good data? Regardless of whether it was 1PV or 3PV, the ratio of players would have told them "This is GREAT!" or "This is BAD". If it really is a question of not enough players in total for the game..that's a whole other problem.

[Cest7]

Why was this feature pushed to live?

It honestly does not add a damn thing, breaks Immersion for a quirky tactical gimmick.

[Jonathan Paine]

3pv removes a lot of the suspense from the game. Instead of risking getting shot to pieces to gain information on enemies that may or may not be on the other side of a ridge/ship/wall/whatever, you can simply hit F4 and get the information at the very low cost of showing your drone for a small amount of time.

3pv reward: complete information on potentially the whole enemy team
3pv risk: enemy team may notice that there is one mech on your side (until they too abuse 3pv)

Result: less tense moments, increased sense of "this is just a silly game"

[repete]

TLBFestus, on 26 August 2013 - 01:53 PM, said:

If they wanted us to test 3rd person, they should have simply asked/stated it and been open about it. Most would have been glad to test it, even if it was begrudgingly.

Yup. I don't want to play in 3PV. BUT, had they implemented the queues as promised and asked us to test 3PV, I'd have tested the living heck out of it. But they didn't do this. It is totally, epically obvious to us, given the information we have that this would have been the right way to do it. And yet this isn't what was done...So what information do we not have IGP?

Player numbers can't handle being split? "Mechwarrior continues to grow. PGI is happy with the growth of player numbers". If total number of registered accounts is your measure, then perhaps. Active player numbers? How about a counter for that. Oh, wait... (Commercially sensitive my arse. I guess a low or decreasing number might be commercially sensitive).

[Mercules]

Niko Snow, on 20 August 2013 - 10:05 AM, said:

Tell us what you think of the Third Person View gameplay feature!

Spoiler

Third Person View:
In the options menu is a "Start In Third Person" option to determine which view you start each match in
By default, this option is toggled on (to start games in third person view)
When you are in third person view, Arm Lock is turned on and cannot be turned off
When you are in third person view, the lance and minimap HUD elements are not available
When you are in third person view, there is a camera drone hovering behind you that other players can see
By default, you can press F4 to toggle between third and first person view
This key can be rebound in the options menu
You cannot switch views while your Mech is shut down

What I think is not able to be posted due to forum rules. I will try to post a less colorful version of it though.

I think you betrayed your core player base. I think you went back on not just one promise, but two. I think I am done giving you money or playing. I think someone who has supported PGI in some of their unpopular decisions is done with PGI. I think your game has just gone in the wastebin when it had potential which is why so many of us invested. I think I will never get my friends back on even if ~I~ was willing to play with 3rd person perspective.

[Franchi]

Protection, on 20 August 2013 - 09:42 PM, said:

I'm going to go into the old ELP files (of which I'm no longer a member) and dig up an old game from the very first Run Hot Or Die Tournament. Game 1 of ELP versus Jade Wolves - a game that many of our team still consider to be one of the very best we ever played.

------------------------------------------------

Eridani Light Pony vs Jade Wolf

"Dangerous at Both Ends, and Crafty in the Middle"

A back and forth struggle with nonstop intense action, and some cunning and risky plays by both teams. All three of the matches could easily have tipped the other way, but fortune favoured the bold in each of the respective matches.

Round the First: "Borrowing a Page"

Frozen City

Ponies on High Side (two cave entrance), Wolves on Low Side (one cave entrance)

Ponies funnel into the caves, prepping for an all out cave rush, sending the Jenners around to the side to scout ahead. Jenners call for full abort, as Jade Wolf has already organized into a firing line, with vision from the dropship ridge to the caves. Pony forces pull back, and the two teams enter into a long range sniper war, with the occasional glancing blow from PPCs or Gauss. PureNo tries a risky play in his Jenner, ends up getting tackled deep near the Pony heavy mechs, but gets away with only modest damage. Neither team has a definite advantage, both waiting for the other to make the first move. Window darts across the dropship, but PureNo is too good, tackles him and Window is down - giving the Wolves a 1-0 lead with less than 5 minutes to go, and sitting comfortably in a fortified position. Ponies split up their forces and make a charge. Two Atlai and a Catapult pour out from the caves, Jenners and Hunchbacks storm the ridge, and others move up from the ravine. Centagon guns down Protection, but the firing line is suddenly surrounded on all sides, Pony Atlai Stimbles and Zylo take down the Wolf Assaults, giving the Ponies the weight advantage. Wolf Jenners take down a Hunchback and Catapult, but the Pony Atlai grind down the Wolves to only two Jenners. With all four remaining Pony Mechs on the Wolf base, the Jenners are forced to try and defend, but don't have the time for hit and runs, and are gradually shot down by Rextale, the Pony fast Hunchie.

Result: Light Pony Victory. 8-4 Elimination.

----------------------------------------------------

Jenner scouting absolutely defined this game for both teams. Jade Wolves were the better snipers, by far, and arguably even the better team. We might've been the better brawlers (at the time, anyhow), but we needed an opportunity to close in. Without the extreme high risk scouting, nothing in this game would have happened the way it did. It was extremely close and every decision was costly and even painful. My heart was in my mouth when Window went down and the clock was ticking away.

And the second game, Jade Wolf won by faking the same tactic then rushing for the base, and got away with it because we failed to scout adequately that round.

In the current game mode, none of this would ever happen and all of that scouting would be irrelevant and wouldn't matter. We'd know enemy locations and positions without ever being susceptible to attack, and we could all just take turns cover shooting and remaining dormant until the clock winds down.

3PV is a castration of game depth and strategy. It has no place in this game.

THIS 100000000000000000000000000000000X THIS

Not knowing whats over that ridge, behind that hill, or around that corner unless you took a risk, WAS EVERYTHING THAT MATTERED IN MECHWARRIOR ONLINE! It was not a test of who was a better shot, it was not a test of who brought the heavier mech, it was not a test of who brought the best sniper, it was not a test of who brought the best brawler, all of those things were factors but at its core MWO was a test of who brought the best MECHWARRIOR.

If someone wants to play the castrated version of MWO that is fine, I wish it didn't exist but as long as I don't have to play in that pool I can deal, since my choices are play the new and castrated version of MWO or don't play at all I choose to not play at all.

I am using your last line as my sig.

Edited by Franchi, 26 August 2013 - 09:07 PM.

[tiR tiRRit]

Feedback 3PV
i used it several times, but i cant use it at movement
it feels weird, i get a headache -.-

i cant use it the whole game
but i can abuse it to look around corners, just a short look, press F4 and some sec later press F4 again
( noone can see the drone about me, i stand behind a high building/Rock)

But the Game experience has suffered, i dont like to cheat, and it feels like
I dont use 3PV furthermore, but my enemy can -.-

3PV nice for new player? I believe not.
But a benefit for experienced Player.

Dont wait 2 weeks to unlock that Hardcore mode!!!!
u chase so much players of my friendlist
maybe some come back
plz hurry

[Corleym]

From reading this thread its obvious that most players do not welcome this change and are upset that PGI have lied about this feature and also implemented it poorly.

What I find worse is the development time wasted on a system nobody wanted instead of essential fixes this game desperately needs or rolling out CW months ago as promised.

[NvSylvenau]

Regarding 3rd PV I'm still feeling like
"WHY????"

[Ravensshadow]

I have to say I am proud of those people who have put in the hard work to do videos and screenshots. I am also proud of the way most of you have posted well thought out and resoned argments.
I am jsut as disgusted by those who have insulted and belittled us. I have yet to see a single well resoned argument stating why everyone should be forced into 3pv. They jsut attack us personally and sling around accusation thet we are bing insulting and lying.


Uh RA

[Boronho]

Please remove the 3PV. Noone likes it. New players don't like it because you cannot fight well in mode and it's frustrating and experienced players don't like it, too.

So please remove it until I repent of having purchased the great Phoenix package :-(

[General Taskeen]

Back in many posts before 3PV was introduced I want to apologize for believing that there would be separate matches for difficulty levels - I was completely wrong.

[skill gap]

We gave it a week. Now what?

[Chronojam]

gumpy2k7, on 27 August 2013 - 11:39 AM, said:

We gave it a week. Now what?

"It's beta!" is next I think.