114 replies to this topic

[Armorpiercer M82]

Separate pugs from premades completely, or you loose 90% of casual gamers = your income.
think.


we need this:

option 1
premades 4-8 vs premades 4-8 (the rest is filled with pugs, IF THEY WANT TO)

option 2
pugs vs pugs ONLY.


ill go only option 2. thx

Edited by Armorpiercer M82, 02 December 2012 - 05:07 AM.

[Lefty Lucy]

Armorpiercer M82, on 02 December 2012 - 03:08 AM, said:

Separate pugs from premades completely, or you loose 90% of casual gamers = your income.
think.

Nice kill against me a few minutes ago

[Wizard Steve]

Armorpiercer M82, on 02 December 2012 - 03:08 AM, said:

Separate pugs from premades completely, or you loose 90% of casual gamers

Could you cite your references and publish your methodology and data please so we can peer review your conclusions.

[Hekalite]

Armorpiercer M82, on 02 December 2012 - 03:08 AM, said:

Separate pugs from premades completely, or you loose 90% of casual gamers = your income.
think.

90% of all statistics are 45% bogus.

[Armorpiercer M82]

Lefty Lucy, on 02 December 2012 - 03:31 AM, said:

Nice kill against me a few minutes ago

realy ? probably luck...

[Mack1]

Armorpiercer M82, on 02 December 2012 - 03:08 AM, said:

Separate pugs from premades completely, or you loose 90% of casual gamers = your income.
think.

Yeah there should never be a situation where pug's face organised groups and if the so called group players had any skill at all they would be backing this 100% but if you check similar threads they argue against this. I guess they just like easymode and Premade v Pug is as easy as it gets and it is ruining this game for new players and lone wolf players.

MWO is just as much a solo game as it is a group game, people have different lives and some, like me hardly ever have time to run in a group, I rely on being able to jump in for a quick solo game and expect to have fun, premades make this game no fun and no fun = no spending on MC and that means game loses money which means game goes bust.

All we need is an option to join a solo queue, how hard must that be to implement? No problem at all and it fixes everything, it's a no brainer.

[Shiney]

90% of pre-mades will play with 8 man groups. Moreover I think people 'blame' premades when things go sour more often than is the case. I even find myself assuming so if I lose at times if I'm pugging or whatever. Not sure it's very accurate, sometimes people 'JUST' out do you that game, such is war.

[Mack1]

The December patch should be good, I look forward to it and hope the premade v premade works so us soloists have our fun back

[Tinhead]

+1 i rarely play any more
PGI have lost alot of solo player who downloaded and played the mechwarrior we all been waiting years for...why ?

Because of solo vs pre-made games
solo new player trying New game = trial mechs
Premade players ..................... = voice comms + custom mechs with XP skills

Hmmm i wonder what will happen ?

lol at phase 2 = still solo vs pre mades WTF ..this is why PGI thinking of 3rd person view to get more people playing Because thay not do Solo pug vs Solo pug only

Phase 1: November 6th

Pre-made groups will be limited to a max of 4 players when playing in random public forums. This is a quick fix to ease the PUG vs PRE issues. We do not consider this a final, nor complete fix to matchmaking.

Phase 2: December 4th - 80% (Delayed due to testing)

Pre-Made groups will be able to match against other pre-made groups.

• Min/Max group size: 8 players - Updated
  
• 8 player group matchmaking will not take into consideration Light, Medium, Heavy, Assault classes.
  
• All other forms of matchmaking will still use the current class matching rules.
  
• 2, 3, 4 player groups will be matched against other groups and solo players per Phase 1 rules.

Phase 3: December TBD


high light > "2, 3, 4 player groups will be matched against other groups and solo players per Phase 1 rules."
and high ligh again "2, 3, 4 player groups will be matched against other groups and solo players per Phase 1 rules."

And solo players can mean 8 solo players

omg Fail

Edited by Tinhead, 02 December 2012 - 04:09 AM.

[Sam Slade]

Not long now

[Hekalite]

Mack1, on 02 December 2012 - 03:53 AM, said:

Yeah there should never be a situation where pug's face organised groups and if the so called group players had any skill at all they would be backing this 100% but if you check similar threads they argue against this. I guess they just like easymode and Premade v Pug is as easy as it gets and it is ruining this game for new players and lone wolf players.

MWO is just as much a solo game as it is a group game, people have different lives and some, like me hardly ever have time to run in a group, I rely on being able to jump in for a quick solo game and expect to have fun, premades make this game no fun and no fun = no spending on MC and that means game loses money which means game goes bust.

All we need is an option to join a solo queue, how hard must that be to implement? No problem at all and it fixes everything, it's a no brainer.

There is a big difference between an optional solo queue and PUGs should never face groups. One is a choice, and the other is not. I'm sure there are some groups who love 'easy mode' as you call it, but most that I've read comments from don't. In fact, so many don't like it that they quit playing or substantially cut back on the amount of time they play.

It may be a no brainer that things should be different than they are now or how they were in closed beta, but the disagreement has always been in how it should be changed. I personally feel that if C3 was better integrated and threw each side in a into a voice channel automatically, most of the problem would be alleviated.

[Krivvan]

Tinhead, on 02 December 2012 - 04:08 AM, said:

high light > "2, 3, 4 player groups will be matched against other groups and solo players per Phase 1 rules."
and high ligh again "2, 3, 4 player groups will be matched against other groups and solo players per Phase 1 rules."

And solo players can mean 8 solo players

omg Fail

Why is this a problem?

[Warenwolf]

Shiney, on 02 December 2012 - 04:03 AM, said:

90% of pre-mades will play with 8 man groups.

I doubt this. What will happen is that lot of those groups will get stomped by good, coordinated premades and will then come back to PUGs (by forming smaller groups so that they are no longer matched against other 8 man groups).

Ignore the above:

Quote

2, 3, 4 player groups will be matched against other groups and solo players per Phase 1 rules.

A matchmaking system (the type that is promised for the 4th of December) that puts equally sized premades in each team (so if you got two man group, the other team gets also a two man group) would go long way in solving this issue*.

As an interesting note, WG (owners of WoT) dropped the idea of 5 man groups after intensive testing because they felt that it would unbalance their 15 vs 15 player public games.


*and people claiming that there is no problem currently, are people with vested interest in keeping the system as it is. Premade = easy mode on.

Edited by Warenwolf, 02 December 2012 - 04:39 AM.

[Jadel Blade]

Tinhead, on 02 December 2012 - 04:08 AM, said:

high light > "2, 3, 4 player groups will be matched against other groups and solo players per Phase 1 rules."
and high ligh again "2, 3, 4 player groups will be matched against other groups and solo players per Phase 1 rules."

And solo players can mean 8 solo players

omg Fail

What are you talking about? Do you not understand what that says? Reading your post I think you dont speak english well / or at all so perhaps you missed the point.

8 man groups will only play against 8 man groups. Small groups will be mixed with solo players. How is this a problem for you?

[Sifright]

Jadel Blade, on 02 December 2012 - 04:34 AM, said:

What are you talking about? Do you not understand what that says? Reading your post I think you dont speak english well / or at all so perhaps you missed the point.

8 man groups will only play against 8 man groups. Small groups will be mixed with solo players. How is this a problem for you?

I think you are the one having reading problems.

He didn't disagree with anything you just said.

What he stated was that he doesn't want solo puggers dropping against even 4 man groups.

Which will include 8 man premades on one side and 8 solos on the other.

We still have 8 man premades now, it's just more fiddly to setup.

[Blark]

Mack1, on 02 December 2012 - 03:53 AM, said:

Yeah there should never be a situation where pug's face organised groups [..]

I disagree (playing pug most of the time myself, but also playing with rl-friends).
The magic word for me: Machtmaking

When proper matchmaking is finally implemented I would see no reason why better pug players cant play vs. even full groups.. works in some other games too.

[Krivvan]

Sifright, on 02 December 2012 - 04:36 AM, said:

What he stated was that he doesn't want solo puggers dropping against even 4 man groups.

Which will include 8 man premades on one side and 8 solos on the other.

We still have 8 man premades now, it's just more fiddly to setup.

You mean 2 4-man premades?

[Grand Ayatollah Kerensky]

Pugs need to learn to either accept their rightful place at the bottom of the MWO food chain or go through the minimal effort of joining the public teamspeak.

[Lykaon]

Warenwolf, on 02 December 2012 - 04:26 AM, said:

I doubt this. What will happen is that lot of those groups will get stomped by good, coordinated premades and will then come back to PUGs (by forming smaller groups so that they are no longer matched against other 8 man groups).

A matchmaking system that puts equally sized premades in each team (so if you got two man group, the other team gets also a two man group) would go long way in solving this issue*. As an interesting note, WG (owners of WoT) dropped the idea of 5 man groups after intensive testing because they felt that it would unbalance their 15 vs 15 player public games.


*and people claiming that there is no problem currently, are people with vested interest in keeping the system as it is. Premade = easy mode on.

The problem is simple.You and many other PUG players are vastly over estimating the numbers of premade players currently in game.

The problem is there are not enough premades to meet the criteria of matching them to eachother and use pre-existing match maker prerequisites like tonnage matching.

The vast majority of the losses PUGs experienced prior to match maker phase 1 were against other PUGs and not Premades as is the case now.

If Pugs were 100% seperated from premades then pugs would have nearly instant drop times and premades would spend vast amounts of time waiting for a match.And still the pug players will want some changes to match making...

No trial mech vs custom
Skill level match
Tonnage match
battle value matching
painted vs non painted or some other idiotic criteria that avoids the issue of bad players are simply bad players.

[Sifright]

Krivvan, on 02 December 2012 - 04:47 AM, said:

You mean 2 4-man premades?

No i mean, we can still engineer 8 man groups to play on the same side vs pugs.