293 replies to this topic

[Particle Man]

Tennex, on 16 January 2013 - 11:11 AM, said:

can't say for sure valid these claims are from the self proclaimed professionals. Since you know, theres no elo system in place, to distinguish actual good people from bad. oops, wasn't phase 3 supposed to make it into the patch.

WTF does ELO have to do with a tourney match? we were playing with the exact people that we wanted to, except for that hour break where we couldnt sync up with them and were playing against other 8man units. There is no restriction in 8man drops. You could take all commandos and end up against an entire team of atlases.

http://youtu.be/Bo0RpBGHjwA

Edited by Particle Man, 16 January 2013 - 11:26 AM.

[Tennex]

best example of the forums here people. by turning this into a flame war you have proven how much of a hippocrite you are..

this was just a simple post, about how the forums although drastic at times is a good reflection of PGI's performance. Out come the flamers: "We hate the flamers" they say "we support PGI, the forums is a bunch of doodoo" they say


well thanks. This started as a very objective thread. and you are the very thing you hate

[fil5000]

Tennex, on 16 January 2013 - 11:34 AM, said:

best example of the forums here people. by turning this into a flame war you have proven how much of a hippocrite you are..

this was just a simple post, about how the forums although drastic at times is a good reflection of PGI's performance. Out come the flamers: "We hate the flamers" they say "we support PGI, the forums is a bunch of doodoo" they say


well thanks. This started as a very objective thread. and you are the very thing you hate

It wasn't an objective thread though. You started it from the position of assuming you're being ignored. PGI have a big ol' state package to monitor what mechs people are using, what guns they are using, who's getting kills with what, how much money they are earning, they have a community rep who goes hither and yon seeking opinions from the wider community... And then they have this place. A barely moderated cesspool of people demanding new maps and community warfare when the game is not remotely ready for it, the odd intelligent and well thought out thread about anything drowned in a thousand "U GEIV MADCAT" messes, and any argument on either side of any issue being boiled down to "YOU WANT THIS GAME TO FAIL" vs "YOU'RE A PGI FANBOI".

Is it any wonder that the devs very rarely venture an opinion in here? I imagine its very disorienting being metaphorically fellated and beaten up at the same time.

[Grand Ayatollah Kerensky]

fil5000, on 16 January 2013 - 11:41 AM, said:

Is it any wonder that the devs very rarely venture an opinion in here? I imagine its very disorienting being metaphorically fellated and beaten up at the same time.

Some people like it rough.

[armchairyoda]

fil5000, on 16 January 2013 - 11:41 AM, said:

I imagine its very disorienting being metaphorically fellated and beaten up at the same time.

So you've met Rhianna?

Thank you folks! I'll be here all week and don't forget to tip your waitress!

[Tennex]

look we all just want whats best for the game, I can't speak for all the more intense posts out there.

But I assume the angriest are the people who have invested the most into the game.

[Rannos]

I'd assume the angriest people are the ones who are the most ignorant to the matters of game development.

[fil5000]

Tennex, on 16 January 2013 - 11:53 AM, said:

look we all just want whats best for the game, I can't speak for all the more intense posts out there.

But I assume the angriest are the people who have invested the most into the game.

No, they're just the angriest people. There's a lot of people that are heavily invested in this game that have made detailed, insightful posts without resorting to shouting and yelling and using emotive language. Posting like this or this in a thread purely for gathering information on people's opinions and concerns don't show any sign of people being invested, they show petty vindictiveness. Threads like this are just angry people being angry about the fact that they're angry, and the first person to respond with something contrary to the OP's opinion is shrugged off as a "fanboi".

The signal/noise ratio here is appalling, and unless PGI or IGP start swinging the forum banhammer for lazy, aggressive shitposting, it's not going to get any better.

[Viper69]

Grraarrgghh, on 16 January 2013 - 07:56 AM, said:

List?

1) every problem presented is blown way out of proportion

2) no incremental change is good enough for this community

3) typically the criticism misses the "constructive" part

4) you rehash problems they have addressed every ******* day until they are fixed

5) unrealistic self-entitlement

6) narrow view of game development

7) everything is aired in public like dirty laundry rather than emailed directly to PGI

8) most ideas are myopic and don't take other playstyles/setups/people into consideration

Listen to VCRS!

http://mwomercs.com/...anuary-16-2013/

Have to agree with him, I myself fall victim to non constructive criticism. The last constructive criticism the devs listened to was delaying OB and you see that just got us one week, so even if its constructive its still not effective.

[Particle Man]

Tennex, on 16 January 2013 - 11:34 AM, said:

best example of the forums here people. by turning this into a flame war you have proven how much of a hippocrite you are..

showing you how every point you've made is wrong isnt flaming, snowflake

[Tennex]

alright you guys win

sorry for having high expectations.

[Grraarrgghh]

Tennex, on 16 January 2013 - 12:05 PM, said:

alright you guys win

sorry for having high expectations.

Welcome to real life, slugger.

It's a cruel world out there, disappointment around every turn.

[Josef Nader]

We all have high expectations for this game. You just have to be patient. Pay close attentions to the patch notes and the community chair. They're dealing with everything in time. Development is just a slow process that requires a lot of changes to get it right. Be patient and let the developers do what they do best.

[Particle Man]

Tennex, on 16 January 2013 - 12:05 PM, said:

alright you guys win

sorry for having high expectations.

we ALL have high expectations and ALL want the same thing, a working game.

it's HOW you express those expectations that matters. Accusing the devs of ignoring everything, while you yourself ignores the devs actively NOT ignoring anything, doesnt help your arguments.

[Tennex]

Grraarrgghh, on 16 January 2013 - 12:07 PM, said:

Welcome to real life, slugger.

It's a cruel world out there, disappointment around every turn.

Don't get the wrong idea. I'm in a 7 year medical program on a 20k scholarship this year


but the **** i know about high expectations and work ethics. I will keep it to myself

Edited by Tennex, 17 January 2013 - 05:37 AM.

[Pihoqahiak]

Grraarrgghh, on 16 January 2013 - 08:09 AM, said:

Spoken like a true pubbie.
There are 3 tournaments going on right now that have organized drops, and every Clan/Guild/Whatever worth half a crap has weekly organized group drops against themselves and other groups to practice. That is where the real competition is.

Get over yourself already Grraarrgghh. A handful (or less) of player created "tournaments" is not a valid metric for the state of the game in any way whatsoever. That doesn't even come close to the level of competitive play in most established games on the market today. Also, these tournaments have to be attempted with player workarounds to even have a semblance of something sporting. Sync dropping and player agreed upon limitations to mech tonnage or loadouts. Self imposed limits due to the game having fundamental flaws do not invalidate those flaws, or get them addressed.

Edited by Pihoqahiak, 16 January 2013 - 12:17 PM.

[Grraarrgghh]

Pihoqahiak, on 16 January 2013 - 12:13 PM, said:

Get over yourself already Grraarrgghh. A handful (or less) of player created "tournaments" is not a valid metric for the state of the game in any way whatsoever. That doesn't even come close to the level of competitive play in most established games on the market today. Also, these tournaments have to be attempted with player workarounds to even have a semblance of something sporting. Sync dropping and player agreed upon limitations to mech tonnage or loadouts. Self imposed limits due to the game have fundamental flaws do not invalidate those flaws, or get them addressed.

So wait, because Clans/Groups have to do all the legwork to drop together themselves it invalidates the level of play?

:allears:

[Congzilla]

Grraarrgghh, on 16 January 2013 - 12:15 PM, said:

So wait, because Clans/Groups have to do all the legwork to drop together themselves it invalidates the level of play?

:allears:

I think what he is saying is just that because it is able to be done doesn't mean that the system isn't broken and in fixing the system the small groups currently doing it shouldn't be the basis for the new system. At least that is what I got from it.

[Particle Man]

Pihoqahiak, on 16 January 2013 - 12:13 PM, said:

Self imposed limits due to the game having fundamental flaws do not invalidate those flaws, or get them addressed.

no, but they're a work around for features that arent in yet in order for the players to get somewhat of the type of game they're looking for. it also gives us a way to find out what sorts of features that we need/want added in order to do these things in game that we're looking to do. (not pub stomp 24/7)

as much as the denial crowd likes to deny it, the game really still is in a fairly early beta state. They're working on it, but in the mean time teams are taking it in their own hands to get the experience they want out of the game, rather than crying about the things that arent in yet that the devs ARE aware of

[Garth Erlam]

Tennex, on 16 January 2013 - 08:07 AM, said:

no cuz there are other systems in place, for organized 8vs8 play besides getting 8 players together and hitting the launch button you know all those secret 8manteams that PGI keep in a basement that they gather ECM advice from. not the beta testers or matchmaking of course no.

I sent a 5 page 'suggestions from the forums' email to design a couple days ago, with multiple links to ECM ideas.

The reason we don't reply about it, is we don't have a definitive change we can tell you yet. "It might be one of these things or maybe something else" isn't going to help anything, and will lead to more confusion than understanding. An 'incremental change' requires we have data to see how it's actually working. If we went off of Mech popularity the day after a patch where a Mech was released, well, you can imagine how accurate it'd really be.

The fact is ECM numbers are dropping - in both pub games (a LOT), and in competitive games (a fair amount - the average is much, much lower than 'all eight Mechs'. Are we looking at changes? Yes. Am I going to post here every time we have an idea in testing? No. Why not? I'd literally spend my entire work day posting changes that occurred from the day before. And most of it would never make it to the live game, and would cause people to choose the ones that weren't used as 'that would have worked instead' (see: Dual Heat Sinks.)

We're not trying to hide info from you - it's just that barraging you with data that, by and large, won't be used isn't a good use of anyone's time. I try to tell people when I am forwarding their ideas, but when you're sending ten at a time, in a short amount of time, it's tough to justify saying "thanks sending this!" over and over, and then getting PM's saying you clearly didn't, because that exact change wasn't used in the next patch.

That said, we do listen, we do look at your ideas, and we do value your info. I try to answer PM's as fast as I can, but again, I'd spend an entire day responding, and then responding to the responses, and so on. We do see, and we do appreciate, and I am constantly forwarding your comments.

I hope you all understand this isn't an attack on you guys, or saying you're all shouting blasphemy. It's, sadly, a time thing. Were I able to clone myself, every single suggestion would get a reply, kudos, and a free bobblehead of me agreeing with your assertions.