400 replies to this topic

[armyof1]

Flashback37, on 10 March 2013 - 06:31 AM, said:

Just finished a match with 2 assault, 2 heavy, 4 med no ecm on my side against 2 atlas, a dragon and 4 lrm boats. and a raven 3l. It did NOT go well. With 2 fast spotters there is no cover except the cave/tunnel.

I think the biggest problem with missiles is the amount of ammo that can be carried. LRM boats would'nt be raining fire so much if they could'nt carry more ammo than a machine gun!
Just for giggles I stripped my phract of everything but 2 lrm 5's and ammmo. I can fit almost 4 thousand rounds in there.

Yes the amount of missiles you get per ton is one of those things that need to be looked over, that would require you fire them with more care and your opponents won't be forced to hide as much because you can carry so much spam with you. But whenever I put that idea on a thread discussing LRMs the LRMboaters go totally silent and never comment it.

[Suki]

armyof1, on 10 March 2013 - 06:44 AM, said:

Yes the amount of missiles you get per ton is one of those things that need to be looked over, that would require you fire them with more care and your opponents won't be forced to hide as much because you can carry so much spam with you. But whenever I put that idea on a thread discussing LRMs the LRMboaters go totally silent and never comment it.

It's because when during the conversation someone mentiones something really stupid, all other people have two choices - ignore it or hurt his feelings by telling him the truth.
I can mount 2 AC2 and tons or ammo, 2 SL and never overheat, heck even 3-4 MG but it will be just plain STUPID.

PS: judt for You - put 2 LRM5 in Atlas, You'll get even more ammo.

Edited by Suki, 10 March 2013 - 08:36 AM.

[TheNarwhal]

armyof1, on 10 March 2013 - 06:44 AM, said:

Yes the amount of missiles you get per ton is one of those things that need to be looked over, that would require you fire them with more care and your opponents won't be forced to hide as much because you can carry so much spam with you. But whenever I put that idea on a thread discussing LRMs the LRMboaters go totally silent and never comment it.

I play a trebuchet and a c1 with 2 lrm 15s. I already have to be careful with my shots because I can't carry that much ammo and still have a decent weapon load out. Assaults are the main ones that can carry tons of ammo but the are also gimping themselves are other weaponry to do. (and to the guy earlier, just fyi, LRM 5 doesn't use squat for ammo. Try the trebuchet trial mech and you'll see how much you can go through LRM ammo).

I tend to carry just enough ammo to last me a standard match. This allows for a higher engine, bigger weapons, and more maneuverability Nerfing LRM ammo will be hurting those that are using it the way you want them too and won't do much to the huge boats that carry tons of ammo anyways. Just punish those by getting in close and exploiting their lack of close range weaponry.

Edit: Grammar

Edited by TheNarwhal, 10 March 2013 - 08:59 AM.

[armyof1]

Suki, on 10 March 2013 - 08:34 AM, said:

It's because when during the conversation someone mentiones something really stupid, all other people have two choices - ignore it or hurt his feelings by telling him the truth.
I can mount 2 AC2 and tons or ammo, 2 SL and never overheat, heck even 3-4 MG but it will be just plain STUPID.

PS: judt for You - put 2 LRM5 in Atlas, You'll get even more ammo.

I'm pretty sure it's because LRMboaters want to keep their spam as much as possible and be able to do good damage even with a hit ratio of 15%.

[Baltasar]

armyof1, on 10 March 2013 - 09:07 AM, said:

I'm pretty sure it's because LRMboaters want to keep their spam as much as possible and be able to do good damage even with a hit ratio of 15%.

As was said earlier, the only boats that can truly spam and dish out lots of damage are the assault mechs. They are slow and tend to be left by their team because of this. Flank and kill. Conquest makes it even worse for these builds.

[armyof1]

Baltasar, on 10 March 2013 - 09:20 AM, said:

As was said earlier, the only boats that can truly spam and dish out lots of damage are the assault mechs. They are slow and tend to be left by their team because of this. Flank and kill. Conquest makes it even worse for these builds.

I don't know how LRM work on conquest, I never got into the whole idea of running around collecting points. But since you can choose not to play Conquest you never have to bring the LRMboat there. Considering how small most maps are there really isn't much an LRmboat needs to move to keep fairly close to their team. Flanking and killing just isn't so easy as most people make it sound like, especially if the guy running the LRMboat is on TS and can quickly ask for help.

[Tarl Cabot]

For this thread, LRM grouping on damage is too extreme. There has been 3 patches, iirc, where LRMs became more powerful than intended and changes had to be made, or old LRM code was reintroduced. Watching any mech's CT color change the most with only LRM is really sad for weapon that does not need the crosshair's over the intended mech/section.

[Suki]

armyof1, on 10 March 2013 - 09:07 AM, said:

I'm pretty sure it's because LRMboaters want to keep their spam as much as possible and be able to do good damage even with a hit ratio of 15%.

I'm pretty sure someone doesn't want to learn fighting mechs ingame.

[Dredhawk]

Only time Iv really had a problem with LRMs is getting caught out in the open..

[armyof1]

Suki, on 10 March 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

I'm pretty sure someone doesn't want to learn fighting mechs ingame.

Oh the L2P argument, how refreshing. There's way too much boating going on in MWO, from PPC to SRM to LRM that make just a few builds superior, while other mechs and builds just become fillers. Not exactly a good way to make the gameplay more varied.

[Rift Hawk]

Dixie Normiss, on 07 March 2013 - 02:09 AM, said:

Things were so close to balanced and matchs were fun but since the last patch its become an LRM clickfest again. I understand you guys need to put a weapon in the game for the kiddies that's easy to use and requires no skill but its killing the fun again. Its bad enough that LRMs force us to use only 5 out of the 64 mechs available since its crazy to fight without an ECM. I don't know how you should fix it this time just that 6 out of 8 mechs are boats each match again and theres no point in playing the game at the moment because of it.
Edit - I did try AMS and they are worthless (Including double AMS) the only time I ever found AMS to work well is when this game first came out.

Edit - I know I can stick to cover the whole game that is the point of this topic that hiding from LRMs the whole match is boring and no fun.

Edit - Maybe Im not cool guy vet because I play PUGS but I have built up 42 mechs since the first week of open beta and I get a few kills most matchs.

Edit - Are people really arguing that it takes skill to use LRMS?? I threw a couple on to check out their damage and got 5 kills in 3 minutes and I haven't use them in 4 months so get serious. LOL

Edit - Keep in mind Im talking about PUG on PUG battles here, not the 8 Man Premade vs PUG battles because I agree that theres not much of anything OP when your 8 man is facing a PUG. lol

How is the LRM clickfest any different than the SRM clickfest or the PPC or Gauss clickfest ?

[Max Genius]

Kain, on 07 March 2013 - 03:11 AM, said:

What is the problem? LRMs are good support weapons, and you can defend yourself against them.
Duck and cover!, stay away from the open areas, let them deplete their ammo etc..

And when you get close with LRM boats they are much easier to kill because they have less short range firepower.

And when the other team has 6 LRM boats, that is great, just wait, dig in and try to flank them a little bit,

For every tactic there is a counter..

Good support weapons? It has become the main weapon. And good luck with "duck and cover" tactic. You're assuming that they will just sit there and not maneuver to get a shot at you from 1000m away. OPs point is very valid. Spending all your time ducking and staying behind cover was not how I was playing the game before the patch. Before I was able to hide for a bit and rush the boats before I die because the missile hit was spread out. Now there's no way to rush them. This classic cheese build got more cheesier.

Imperial X, on 10 March 2013 - 11:24 AM, said:

How is the LRM clickfest any different than the SRM clickfest or the PPC or Gauss clickfest ?

Simple. The other weapons actually require you to aim and requires LOS which gives opponent opportunity to fire back at you. LRM boats just sit there, wait for a team mate to Tag or to just even see the mech and all they do is "click". Don't even have to move or worry about incoming fire especially if they have ECM.

Edited by Max Genius, 10 March 2013 - 11:40 AM.

[Magicbullet141]

learn 2 cover

[RickySpanish]

Had yet another ridiculous game last night with 1100 damage and 6 kills (seems I can never get the last two!), my team mates were incredulous and told me to screen shot it, but it's really not that fantastic. I also ran into a couple of teams using D-DC's with LRMs backed up by Stalkers and my God, the LRM death was a sight to behold. We had several 8-0 losses with the enemy team advancing across the map and opening fire once there was no more cover to be had.

I think part of what makes mounting LRMs so strong right now isn't just Artemis - it's TAG (as someone pointed out) being able to cancel ECM so effectively. My Awesome routinely TAGs ECM'd mechs and blasts them to smithereens and the only counter to me is a light with ECM nearby or another stronger LRM boat. Or you could get to cover oh-no-wait-you-can't because I'm 300 metres away from you with a clear line of sight because I travel WITH my team-mates instead of standing 800m away like a fool.

[Flashback37]

I had a match earlier that was hilarious. 5 minutes of standing behind a building while missiles are raining down.
Being bored I turned to look around behind me. Standing about 90m away is our Atlas, returning the barrage. Funny thing is, the enemy raven is standing with his face in the Atlas backside. You could hardly even see him for the bulk of the Atlas. He was dead about 3 seconds later and the rest of his team went like dominoes soon after. lol

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

armyof1, on 10 March 2013 - 09:07 AM, said:

I'm pretty sure it's because LRMboaters want to keep their spam as much as possible and be able to do good damage even with a hit ratio of 15%.

im pretty sure this is a person who would rather qq than learn to play.

RickySpanish, on 10 March 2013 - 11:46 AM, said:

Had yet another ridiculous game last night with 1100 damage and 6 kills (seems I can never get the last two!), my team mates were incredulous and told me to screen shot it, but it's really not that fantastic. I also ran into a couple of teams using D-DC's with LRMs backed up by Stalkers and my God, the LRM death was a sight to behold. We had several 8-0 losses with the enemy team advancing across the map and opening fire once there was no more cover to be had.

yes they should ban people who use coordinated tactics outright.

[Profiteer]

I have noticed a large increase of LRMs on the field since the last patch.

I find myself spending most of some matches in cover (I pilot an atlas or a stalker) because as soon as I show my face a hail of LRMs come flying in.

I have actually stripped my Stalker brawler (srm6s and mls) and fitted it with LLs to snipe, since bobbing in and out of cover is the norm for me now.

I'm not sure I'm even complaining, it just seems a little frustrating to think the guy at the end of those lrms is just sitting there, one hand on the mouse, the other wrapped around a mountain dew as he watches TV and occasionally glances at the monitor to launch another volley

[RickySpanish]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 10 March 2013 - 12:01 PM, said:

im pretty sure this is a person who would rather qq than learn to play.



yes they should ban people who use coordinated tactics outright.

You choose some odd quotes to make your points with, and then put words in the mouths of the people who made them.

In that post I state that I obliterated an enemy team; with 1000 points of damage you can pretty much assume that I didn't just kill steal, and that my team did an excellent job of simply being there while I gutted the enemy. This wasn't hard, it didn't take coordination, it took only a small amount of skill on my part - positioning, and it certainly wasn't right. In reality my team mates were just as if not more skilled than me but that was irrelevant in the face of the utter cheeseroll that is LRM spam.

I then state that the few times we got completed destroyed - despite my LRM cheese - was when the enemy team had MORE LRM mechs! See what I did there? I'm saying the only effective counter to cheese is more cheese, and when an entire team runs cheese LRM builds you've precious little recourse. I don't know about you, but even against 8 man sync drops thanks to improved match making, my team and I usually still get 2-3 kills in before we're doomed. These were 8-0 sweeps. On the plus side, MWO looks pretty jaw dropping with that many LRMs in the air and the carnage is a sight to behold.

On a lighter note, in one game I helped take out two splatcats, one before it could even fire at the slowpoke it was making a b-line toward despite being under ECM, and the other stripped in mid-air. That was some poetic justice.

[Revorn]

Max Genius, on 10 March 2013 - 11:38 AM, said:

Simple. The other weapons actually require you to aim and requires LOS which gives opponent opportunity to fire back at you. LRM boats just sit there, wait for a team mate to Tag or to just even see the mech and all they do is "click". Don't even have to move or worry about incoming fire especially if they have ECM.

Rofl, your Elo must be pretty low to meet such LRMBoaters. Sounds more like pre ECM Boating, but even in the early times, it was not the best strategie for LRMing. imho

[Henree]

Thing is lrms did not become more powerful, they are just being used more than before because people think they are more powerful. I have in fact noticed a marked drop in damage done with my a1.