144 replies to this topic

[M4rtyr]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 17 March 2013 - 05:23 PM, said:

I drive an Atlas with 2 SRM6s, 4 Ml and an AC20 but I dont seem to have any issue with killing people and pulling 4 to 600 damage a game

Gonna go out on a limb and say its a DDC and i want to see4 SS of match results on Alpine with those number.

[Pihb]

I do not like lrm's because if there is one boat in the match, you cannot brawl. Either the guy on the other team is going to get you, or some mouth breather on your team is going to light you up. Fair or not, lrm's ruin the fun.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

M4rtyr, on 17 March 2013 - 05:29 PM, said:

Gonna go out on a limb and say its a DDC and i want to see4 SS of match results on Alpine with those number.

Founders... didnt know the DDC had 4 energy points
and who said anything about alpine? Ive been there MAYBE 4 matches. I almost never end up there, then again I also almost never die on Alpine due to LRMs, I almost never find anyone at all and just wait for it to end lol

Edited by Mechwarrior Buddah, 17 March 2013 - 05:31 PM.

[Pihb]

M4rtyr, on 17 March 2013 - 05:29 PM, said:

Gonna go out on a limb and say its a DDC and i want to see4 SS of match results on Alpine with those number.

DDC has two energy slots. This is a D or an RS me thinks.

[Naja]

Pihb, on 17 March 2013 - 05:30 PM, said:

I do not like lrm's because if there is one boat in the match, you cannot brawl. Either the guy on the other team is going to get you, or some mouth breather on your team is going to light you up. Fair or not, lrm's ruin the fun.

Much like light mechs 'ruin the fun' for snipers and boats. Brawlers who rush mid ruin the fun for people preferring formation organized direct fire, etc. Not everyone's idea of 'fun' is the same.

[Ryokens leap]

It's the strategy of using two or three ECM lights to flank main group, cap hit, and spot for multiple LRM boats that players get frustrated with. Everyone scurries around trying not to get Streaked in the back, run into the open and get LRMed. Unfortunately it's a viable tactic in the current game. Maybe balance will level out in the future.

[StalaggtIKE]

LRM are simple to fire. It takes no skill to make a lock and fire, however that's it. Beyond that it gets a bit more difficult. If you do not have tight coordination among your teammates, you will have to keep eyes on target directly for the best chance of success. Even then it's not guaranteed, there are so many counters:

• ECM
  
• AMS
  
• speed
  
• cover
  
• distance

Yes if you get caught in the open and focused on, you will go down quickly. But what weapon doesn't have that capacity? MG and Flamers? Everything else will do so quicker than LRM ever could, because they have much better travel time. Perhaps we shall see how well they fair once splash damage is removed.

[Davers]

Ryokens leap, on 17 March 2013 - 05:36 PM, said:

It's the strategy of using two or three ECM lights to flank main group, cap hit, and spot for multiple LRM boats that players get frustrated with. Everyone scurries around trying not to get Streaked in the back, run into the open and get LRMed. Unfortunately it's a viable tactic in the current game. Maybe balance will level out in the future.

Sounds like "Crush your enemies and see them driven before you". I hope that doesn't go out of style!

[Zerberus]

There IS a smallbalance issue, primarily vs lighter mechs, that will almost certainly alleviated when splash damage is patched out on April 2nd.

BUT: if you`re in a light mech getting hit by LRMs at more than 200-250m, the problem is behind the keyboard anyway, not the weapon.  And even at 200m, WTF are you doing charging an LRM equipped mech head on, are you daft? At 200m the 2xArtemisLRM20 of my ATL-7D is one of the heaviest single hits you can take, and at that range you WILL eat most it if you`re charging. If the gauss and LLS are also on target you just ate. Assuming some of the missiles miss, you``ll die in a roughly 100 pt fireball.  So, yeah, not really a good idea for a light to be anwhere other than behind anything with multiple LRM racks, and definitely not to charge it or stand still.
Then again, every other mech pilot and weapons system will do the exact same thing to you under those circumstances.

I take a hit every so often in my Atlases, which is a direct result of their record setting speed and my immense stupidity. I have NEVER taken one in the trial Commander or Trebuchet, and feel really stupid when I take one in the Hunchback.  And I`m at best a "better n00b", but I know where the throttle is and how to spell and take cover, None of these mechs are superfast, the commando barely does 81.

TBH I get all giddy with joy when I ruin some Raven, Jenner or Commando`s day with LRMS, simply becasue a light should not ever die from an Atlas except by an insanely lucky shot or pilot error. So I either have a 5 leaf clover in my pocket or I killed the skilless insect that still could have crept up on my *** later and made a general nuisance of himself, Win-Win, break out the champagne, the whiskey if it was dumbfired salvo from 600m+.

Edited by Zerberus, 17 March 2013 - 06:06 PM.

[MischiefSC]

Again. On avoiding LRMs.

If you're never getting into trouble against LRMs you are:

A) winning about 80% of your games since the vast majority of games has LRM boats in it. Or are you saying that the LRM boats are pointless and just occupying space and so no threat but the remaining 2-5 mechs on the other team who were NOT boating LRMs were so amazingly incredibly good that they managed to drag the dead weight of the LRM boating teammates and win anyway?

playing at such a low Elo that nobody you play with or against has any idea how to use LRMs effectively. Organized teams in 4 or 8 man drops have a few LRM boats and some spotters. The boats are back nice and safe while spotters pick and tag viable targets and tell them which one to shoot via VOIP, letting them put all 70 missiles into the air quickly and efficiently.

C) not being honest about how often you get hammered by LRMs.

Seriously. Spare us the BS about 'pfft, LRMS are nuffin', L2P n00bz!' and lets have a useful conversation on the topic.

My D-DC suffers far less from LRMs, obviously, but when I play my C4 it's a whole other story. Same with my K2. LRMs are out of balance and need fixed.

[Faldrin]

Oh MiscgiefSC you are so wrong I rock a C1 founders that runs a XL engine without max armour and almost never die to LRM unless I get stupid! Oh and it uses 2 LL 1 PLL 2 streak.

[Davers]

MischiefSC, on 17 March 2013 - 05:52 PM, said:

Again. On avoiding LRMs.

If you're never getting into trouble against LRMs you are:

A) winning about 80% of your games since the vast majority of games has LRM boats in it. Or are you saying that the LRM boats are pointless and just occupying space and so no threat but the remaining 2-5 mechs on the other team who were NOT boating LRMs were so amazingly incredibly good that they managed to drag the dead weight of the LRM boating teammates and win anyway?

playing at such a low Elo that nobody you play with or against has any idea how to use LRMs effectively. Organized teams in 4 or 8 man drops have a few LRM boats and some spotters. The boats are back nice and safe while spotters pick and tag viable targets and tell them which one to shoot via VOIP, letting them put all 70 missiles into the air quickly and efficiently.

C) not being honest about how often you get hammered by LRMs.

Seriously. Spare us the BS about 'pfft, LRMS are nuffin', L2P n00bz!' and lets have a useful conversation on the topic.

My D-DC suffers far less from LRMs, obviously, but when I play my C4 it's a whole other story. Same with my K2. LRMs are out of balance and need fixed.

I am curious what your C4 and K2 builds are. SRMs and AC/20s? So you use short range builds and complain about long range weapons? How interesting.

[PaintedWolf]

Majority does not agree LRMs are OP: http://mwomercs.com/...-lrm-balancing/

[MischiefSC]

Faldrin, on 17 March 2013 - 06:02 PM, said:

Oh MiscgiefSC you are so wrong I rock a C1 founders that runs a XL engine without max armour and almost never die to LRM unless I get stupid! Oh and it uses 2 LL 1 PLL 2 streak.

So drop with me, I'm happy to watch you rock against the premade teams and their LRM setups.

Davers, on 17 March 2013 - 06:06 PM, said:

I am curious what your C4 and K2 builds are. SRMs and AC/20s? So you use short range builds and complain about long range weapons? How interesting.

My C4 is 1ERLL, 4xSRM6+Artemis typically. Sometimes I go 1ML, 1TAG, 2xLRM15. Depends.

Ky K2 I run boomcat sometimes when I drop with a team but for solo it's 4xLL, 2MGs and a crap ton of DHS.

The issue isn't range. The issue is availability of ECM, without which LRMs are not balanced.

[CheezPanther]

No there is more justified hate for the 3L's.. LRMS are powerfull but get in close or use cover they are useless...

3L's on the otherhand are people taking advatage of broken game mechanics to win easily.. theres a difference.

[Mawai]

In my opinion, SRM/SSRM and LRM have all been too effective (except when countered by ECM) ... though I can't say I hate them.

The following post indicates that the effect of splash damage for missiles has been enhancing the effectiveness of these weapons ... and perhaps that is the source of the issue.

http://mwomercs.com/...ted-2013-03-15/

When ECM is not on the field ... mechs can be crushed by a small number of LRM volleys if they are caught in the open. One time I was in an Atlas crossing the river on the river city map heading toward upper city from the base - I didn't make it across as 3 volleys of LRMs totally destroyed the Atlas ... I've seen Catapults, Stalkers and Atlases armed with LRMs rip other mechs to pieces extremely quickly ... AMS helps reduce the effectiveness but does not prevent it. That is my experience ... others may have a different perspective ... but from what I have seen SSRM/LRM are overpowered when ECM is not around.

[Davers]

MischiefSC, on 17 March 2013 - 06:11 PM, said:

So drop with me, I'm happy to watch you rock against the premade teams and their LRM setups.



My C4 is 1ERLL, 4xSRM6+Artemis typically. Sometimes I go 1ML, 1TAG, 2xLRM15. Depends.

Ky K2 I run boomcat sometimes when I drop with a team but for solo it's 4xLL, 2MGs and a crap ton of DHS.

The issue isn't range. The issue is availability of ECM, without which LRMs are not balanced.

Machine guns? LOL Obviously we have a top ranked player here!

Kidding aside though, if you are getting hit and killed by LRMs you are just not using cover. Try dropping some of those LL and machine guns and get a big *** engine, the biggest XL maybe. Then use your new maneuverability to kill the LRM boats. And please stay out of the water!
.

[Grey Rabbit]

Between people very easily using cover, spotters losing their targets, and ECM, it's actually not as easy as people think. It's the weapon that I have the lowest hit rate with by far(19.3%). Heck, what other weapon has a warning light when it's shot at you for 5-15 seconds before it hits you?

That being said, indirect fire support is an important part of the battlefield. It weeds out the foolish who wander out into the open. It makes any one on one within 1km a two on one if there's no electronics involved. It gives someone the ability to stay in the fight and watch the base at the same time.

In a balanced team, we're effective but easily countered.

[Davers]

Mawai, on 17 March 2013 - 06:17 PM, said:

In my opinion, SRM/SSRM and LRM have all been too effective (except when countered by ECM) ... though I can't say I hate them.

The following post indicates that the effect of splash damage for missiles has been enhancing the effectiveness of these weapons ... and perhaps that is the source of the issue.

http://mwomercs.com/...ted-2013-03-15/

When ECM is not on the field ... mechs can be crushed by a small number of LRM volleys if they are caught in the open. One time I was in an Atlas crossing the river on the river city map heading toward upper city from the base - I didn't make it across as 3 volleys of LRMs totally destroyed the Atlas ... I've seen Catapults, Stalkers and Atlases armed with LRMs rip other mechs to pieces extremely quickly ... AMS helps reduce the effectiveness but does not prevent it. That is my experience ... others may have a different perspective ... but from what I have seen SSRM/LRM are overpowered when ECM is not around.

You are exaggerating their damage. But I would argue that an Atlas caught in the river would be killed by any number of builds. Atlases don't belong in the river. That is NOT USING COVER. That is a textbook example of how to be killed by LRMs, and the exact thing everyone is saying you should not do. That you would bring it up as an example of why LRMs are 'broken' is pretty funny.

[zverofaust]

The problem with LRMs is that they are just a bad gameplay mechanic. There's no getting around it. They are like WoT's artillery, except almost every Mech can (and does) equip them. They require little to no skill, only repeated spam-clicking, while pigeon-holing everyone on the enemy team into doing everything they can to try and avoid them.