2002 replies to this topic

[Kraven Kor]

Gaan Cathal, on 19 June 2013 - 01:28 AM, said:

Why is this assumed to be a huge draw?

Because this ONE GUY asked Bryan about it on frackin' Twitter, basically saying "No 3rd Person View? I refuse to play."

Or, that's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

The reality? We don't know, and they won't tell us.

[BigMekkUrDakka]

Kraven Kor, on 19 June 2013 - 07:38 AM, said:

Because this ONE GUY asked Bryan about it on frackin' Twitter, basically saying "No 3rd Person View? I refuse to play."

Or, that's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

The reality? We don't know, and they won't tell us.

makes me want to register twitter account (whatever it is) and spam PGIIGP for not implementing 3pv or for implementing it so they will start to hate their own idea

Edited by BigMekkUrDakka, 19 June 2013 - 07:51 AM.

[von Pilsner]

SirLANsalot, on 18 June 2013 - 03:45 PM, said:

Again, the spotting system we have now, should (and common sense says it will) be kept the same when 3P comes. What dose that mean? No effing jump sniping, besides with JJ the way they are now, its not like there going to be an issue. If I am looking at a wall, I am looking at a wall, regardless if my camera is looking OVER the wall. Now if I get targeting data from say a light on the other side of the wall, then I can pop over and take a shot. This is no different then what we do NOW.

I was simply correcting your memory of how MW4 worked, you seemed to think that you could not switch between 3pv and 1pv and you certainly can (could) in MW4 (FFP being the exception and not the rule).

[Jestun]

SirLANsalot, on 16 June 2013 - 10:49 PM, said:

The suggestions I have been putting out are literally the best compromise you can come up with. Without splitting the community up into two separate camps. One will be "the elitist" camp (most likely 1P) the other will be shat on and disregarded when someone pipes up about something. That is one thing myself and many others fear and are trying to stop.

Placing 3P with 1P at the same time, together and available to everyone DURING the fight, not before, is how WoT got around it. No one can whine about someone in 3P or 1P because you both have it, at the same time. MW4 I know had the two split and you had to choose between the two prior to dropping. However that was back in 1999 tech, today computers are 10x more powerful then back then. As for what Cry Eng 3 can do? Well thats a different story....

As I said, 3P is great for brawling/moving around, gives you awareness of your enviroment and weather if you are going to run into that wall or not. 1P is great for long range shooting, and overall, gives you a far better gunnery at all ranges but your awareness about that wall next to you or your friendly, drops quite a bit.

Note: It would be perfectly fine to see friendlys in 3P even if your pilot can't (WoT dose it this way already) and you can only see enemys if someone else is spotting them, or if you own pilot sees them (like we have now).

Your suggestions are in no way acceptable to me and you have no say in whether people are allowed to disagree with you (whether you call it disagreeing or whining - "No one can whine about someone in 3P or 1P because you both have it").

What your suggestions do is force people to use 3rd person in certain situations to be competitive. This is worse than the current plan of dividing the community into tiny sections where at least there would be a section where there is no 3rd person advantage.

Edited by Jestun, 19 June 2013 - 11:19 AM.

[Kraven Kor]

Jestun, on 19 June 2013 - 10:52 AM, said:

Your suggestions are in no way acceptable to me and you have no say in whether people are allowed to disagree with you (whether you call it disagreeing or whining - "No one can whine about someone in 3P or 1P because you both have it").

What your suggestions do is force people to use 3rd person in certain situations to be competitive. This is worse than the current plan of dividing the community into tiny sections where at least there would be a section where there is no 3rd person advantage.

Exactly.

von Pilsner, on 19 June 2013 - 10:41 AM, said:

I was simply correcting your memory of how MW4 worked, you seemed to think that you could not switch between 3pv and 1pv and you certainly can (could) in MW4 (FFP being the exception and not the rule).

And NOBODY played the FFP modes but for the hardcore clans.

We are almost literally watching this game go the same direction as MW:3 and MW:4; the First Person Only, Heat On, Limited Ammo servers were dead if you were not in a hardcore clan or unit. The servers you could find pub games on were almost all Third Person, No Heat, Unlimited Ammo.

And many of us hated that.

All I'm asking for, is to not be forced to play Third Person View (and praying that we won't see "No Heat, Unlimited Ammo" modes pop up...)

[von Pilsner]

Kraven Kor, on 19 June 2013 - 11:29 AM, said:

All I'm asking for, is to not be forced to play Third Person View (and praying that we won't see "No Heat, Unlimited Ammo" modes pop up...)

As is my hope as well...

[Sean von Steinike]

They have the gall to claim 3pv will be "normal" and more frequently used mode. Idiots that cannot figure torso twist deserve to be shunted into "easy 3pv baby mode" with normal being the 1st person view.

[Grey Black]

TPV should be in training grounds and nothing else. Perhaps in a beginners mission/training mission implemented to teach people controls. Nothing more.

Queue splitting and breaking from simulation are why we should not implement it elsewhere.

[Jestun]

Sean von Steinike, on 19 June 2013 - 11:22 PM, said:

They have the gall to claim 3pv will be "normal" and more frequently used mode. Idiots that cannot figure torso twist deserve to be shunted into "easy 3pv baby mode" with normal being the 1st person view.

If they see the "normal" player as one who cannot manage to workout which way their torso is facing compared to their legs then they are going to have to dumb the rest of the game down too.

Otherwise these morons will finally be able to work out which way they are facing but will still be incapable to devising a good build for their mech, they won't be able to grasp the concept of manually controlled weapon groups, etc

Hell, how do they manage to walk about IRL? Do they have a kite flying behind them with a webcam or are they constantly staring down at their legs so they can work out which way they are facing? This is the audience they now want to target?

Edited by Jestun, 20 June 2013 - 04:02 AM.

[Xenois Shalashaska]

3rd person in training grounds and that's it. My assumption was this is a "simulator" of mech combat. S-I-M-U-L-A-T-O-R !!!!. The bad points of third person view. If you approach a enemy rear too closely they can see you shooting there back torso. So that's 1 strategy gone when playing with friends. Some ones a decoy and another executes. The ability to align your mech with the wall and keep it concealed while the 3rd person view can be panned around the corner protecting your mech and identifying what mech variants are in the area... Information in 8 mans is essential to winning, now it comes with no consequence to enemy fire. Another example is entering the crashed drop ship on Frozen city, hopefully the 3rd person view doesn't zoom outside the drop ship and gives the player a wide view of enemy movements. Now these strategies are only possible if the enemy doesn't have seismic, so it negates these strategies any way, but this shouldn't give it merit to implement 3rd view. You maybe thinking how these assumption of view will effectively be use against other players is pretty much Team Speak, that allows us the players when we form a group to speak information to each other and form quick strategic counters before the enemy even knows this. 3rd person will benefit the Team speak players. This is another step towards and arcade mech game such as MechAssault and the game is almost a cross of MechWarrior 4 mercenaries. 3rd person view needs to be restrictive as a narrow frontal view but it will defeat the purpose of a outside view as it wont give wide angle view. I wouldn't mind having a view parallel with the centre torso or side torso infront of the mech.

[Aggressor666]

when they impliment this (and they will for the herp a derp crowd) they should remove first person and just force 3rd since anyone using 1st will be at a HUGE disadvantage
found that out in MW4 I used 1st through the single player and my first horrid weeks in multiplayer till I joined a clan and they told me I HAD to use 3rd pv, they even showed me how I could see the ENTIRE AREA from complete cover behind a ridge just by looking slightly downward
totally ruined the sim experience but at least I could play my 60$ game

[Kraven Kor]

Aggressor666, on 25 June 2013 - 12:51 PM, said:

when they impliment this (and they will for the herp a derp crowd) they should remove first person and just force 3rd since anyone using 1st will be at a HUGE disadvantage
found that out in MW4 I used 1st through the single player and my first horrid weeks in multiplayer till I joined a clan and they told me I HAD to use 3rd pv, they even showed me how I could see the ENTIRE AREA from complete cover behind a ridge just by looking slightly downward
totally ruined the sim experience but at least I could play my 60$ game

THIS POST EXPLAINS EXACTLY WHY WE HATE 3PV.

BECAUSE IT RUINED MW:4 MULTIPLAYER, WHOLLY, FOR MANY OF US.

THIS IS WHY WE RAGE

[Mystere]

Kraven Kor, on 25 June 2013 - 12:59 PM, said:

THIS POST EXPLAINS EXACTLY WHY WE HATE 3PV.

BECAUSE IT RUINED MW:4 MULTIPLAYER, WHOLLY, FOR MANY OF US.

THIS IS WHY WE RAGE

Then repeat after me:

MWO is not MW4.

MWO is not MW4.

MWO is not MW4.

MWO is not MW4.

MWO is not MW4.

[Carl Wrede]

Mystere, on 25 June 2013 - 07:03 PM, said:

Then repeat after me:

MWO is not MW4.

MWO is not MW4.

MWO is not MW4.

MWO is not MW4.

MWO is not MW4.

I bloody well will be if they introduce 3pv.

[Jestun]

Carl Wrede, on 25 June 2013 - 07:20 PM, said:

I bloody well will be if they introduce 3pv.

Indeed.

Despite a few people claiming 3rd person will have no advantage, it will.

Why would they develop it with no advantage? The people who need their 3rd person crutch would still not be interested. People unable to see things out of LoS of their cockpit would have a mostly black screen with a cone of visible terrain / mechs in the middle.

The reality is if it is going to attract 3rd person users they need the 3rd person they are used to... the one that gives them an advantage.

[Kraven Kor]

Mystere, on 25 June 2013 - 07:03 PM, said:

Then repeat after me:

MWO is not MW4.

MWO is not MW4.

MWO is not MW4.

MWO is not MW4.

MWO is not MW4.

Yeah, we don't have an overabundance of Jump Snipers in this game or anything! (Yes, they kind of fixed that.)

This game will go the way of MW:4 if we don't prevent it from happening. It just will. Path of least resistance - 3PV, look over hill, line up shot, jump, 6x PPC alpha, rinse repeat. And the guys doing it will post, at length, about their elite snipah skillz.

[Mystere]

Kraven Kor, on 26 June 2013 - 06:33 AM, said:

Yeah, we don't have an overabundance of Jump Snipers in this game or anything! (Yes, they kind of fixed that.)

This game will go the way of MW:4 if we don't prevent it from happening. It just will. Path of least resistance - 3PV, look over hill, line up shot, jump, 6x PPC alpha, rinse repeat. And the guys doing it will post, at length, about their elite snipah skillz.

And this is what I just don't get: Why do people keep on insisting that the 3PV implementation of MWO will be just like what was found in MW4 (e.g. ability to look over hill in 3PV but not in 1PV)?

And the solution, wildly celebrated by many, was to make using JJs more difficult by making me and other people feel like puking? NUTS I say!

*****

P.S. I just almost puked again. As such, my jumping Spider will continue to gather virtual dust for a while. It's a real shame because she was fun to ride, not to mention also both beautiful and scary.

Edited by Mystere, 26 June 2013 - 12:06 PM.

[Hotthedd]

Mystere, on 26 June 2013 - 12:05 PM, said:

And this is what I just don't get: Why do people keep on insisting that the 3PV implementation of MWO will be just like what was found in MW4 (e.g. ability to look over hill in 3PV but not in 1PV)?

Two reasons:

1. Because they are implementing it to attract players who like 3PV for the ability to see things that they otherwise would not be able to see. If they do NOT implement 3PV like that, they will NOT draw in that crowd.

2. Because (as you stated) people want to be able to take screenshots of their mech' in action. Without a view from far enough away from your mech', and the entire screen not being rendered, then nobody will take those screenshots.

[Signal27]

Hotthedd, on 26 June 2013 - 02:45 PM, said:

1. Because they are implementing it to attract players who like 3PV for the ability to see things that they otherwise would not be able to see. If they do NOT implement 3PV like that, they will NOT draw in that crowd.

PGI said they're implementing it mainly to help new players get used to piloting their mechs around, so that they can see where their legs are taking them in relation to where their torso in pointed (since the arrow on their minimap doesn't seem to be enough). PGI has also mentioned trying to balance 3PV by limiting its FOV in various ways (such as putting the camera straight behind the mech, as opposed to slightly up in the air, and having the camera "pull in" if the mech gets closer to cover), so it could very well be the case that PGI isn't trying to attract the 3PV "see everything" crowd at all.

But that's just my optimism typing away at the keyboard. It may or may not actually turn out to be that way. I've adopted the "wait and see" approach before I actually start complaining about it just by the concept alone.

Edited by Signal27, 27 June 2013 - 04:51 AM.

[Mr Blonde]

I came late to this party, but I read that some people wanted 3pv because they can't master the basics of controlling their mech. I let my son play around on the training grounds, and even run a few matches on my (alternate)account. He did alright, got some kills even and was in a commando. Either he's a MWO prodigy, or they are suggesting watering down the game for adults who can't do what an 8 year old boy became proficient at in less than an hour. I suppose those are the same sort who are easily parted from their money. I say poll the whole community, send an email to each unique player (not account) and tally the results.