981 replies to this topic

[Shock4ndAwe]

Protection, on 26 March 2013 - 12:33 AM, said:

Think your link is broken at the moment.

Fixed, thanks for the heads up.

[gabgrave]

Protection, on 26 March 2013 - 12:33 AM, said:

The real problem with the 6xAC/2 Jager is that you are trying to spend 36+ tons on weaponry (plus ammo) on a 65 ton mech, so it just doesn't have the tonnage needed to translate well. The 6 AC/2 Jager is almost always doomed to be a joke build.

I was able to get you a little more speed and ammunition, and make your amour a little bit better: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...780727c8312ae1d
It's a small improvement, but it'll work a little better. Always get Endo Steel before ferro fibrous - Endo is always the better deal.

On the other hand, a 5 AC/2 Jager is possible without being so ruinous to your speed and armour - and can even have some kicker weapons (or take them out for even more ammo): http://mwo.smurfy-ne...10fb4a7e60637b3

Great! Thanks for the assist. Will try out the builts.

[TechKnight1337]

Protection, on 26 March 2013 - 01:04 AM, said:

It's decently optimized in its current state - there's no 'total' improvement to offer.

Well, one thing, and a few ideas: First thing is first - we can strip some tonnage off of the ballistic arm. There's no reason an empty arm needs full armour. If there's no gun inside it's just a (small) meatshield, and can easily lose half or more of its armour to give you more tonnage to play with.

The 360XL isn't actually that bad of a deal -- you only get 1.5 tons by switching to a 350XL, and lost almost 3kph, so it's not a terrible deal either way. It's much more dramatic for STD engines.

With a 350XL and 4 LLas you will still be fast, but also quite hot: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...94dbd6cefb0cd7b

If you go for a 325XL you would be much cooler, but also 10kph slower: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5ca0e4e2744f078

Or you could ditch the SRM6 and keep the big engine and have more reasonable heat: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...41a3d64be3c560a

Thanks! I'd been afraid to strip the armor off the ballistic arm for fear I'd get side-cored too easily, but I'll give it a shot.

[Protection]

Shock4ndAwe, on 26 March 2013 - 01:13 AM, said:

Fixed, thanks for the heads up.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...8d07f88cb2012a9

Well you have an AMS with no ammunition - so that isn't doing anything. And with missiles as weak as they are currently it's probably a safe choice to leave the AMS off for the time being.

Other than that, no absolute upgrade, but I would suggest dropping leg armour a bit -- it's rare that anyone tries to undertake the long, tedious and difficult task of legging an assault mech.

By dumping the AMS, reducing leg armour, and just a bit off that not-too-important right arm, I squeezed in two more heatsinks: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...3eaa528a474e32e
ER Large Lasers are some of the unfriendliest heat weapons in the game, so every heatsink counts.

If you feel like I stripped too much armour for your taste, you can take one heatsink out and put a little more back on the arm and legs.

The one other option to consider is adding Artemis IV. It's okay with SRMs, and usually good for LRMs, although your design seems to be a little on the fence about being long rage or close range.

By downgrading to a flat 300 STD and sacrificing one heatsink for space, you can squeeze in Artemis IV: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...605334555b402a5

Just as an idea to consider.

TechKnight1337, on 26 March 2013 - 01:16 AM, said:

Thanks! I'd been afraid to strip the armor off the ballistic arm for fear I'd get side-cored too easily, but I'll give it a shot.

A lot of people have this concern, but it doesn't usually come up often. Make a mental not when you lose that arm, and then make it into an mental exclamation point if you die to losing that side torso after having lost the arm. If you start to notice that it happens often, then try leaving 15-20 points on instead of 1-4 points and see if it makes a difference.

[Shock4ndAwe]

Protection, on 26 March 2013 - 01:34 AM, said:

Well you have an AMS with no ammunition - so that isn't doing anything. And with missiles as weak as they are currently it's probably a safe choice to leave the AMS off for the time being.

Yeah I fixed it, AGAIN. I'm a noob with regards to the mechlab website. Thanks for the info. Will give these a shot.

[Protection]

Shock4ndAwe, on 26 March 2013 - 01:38 AM, said:

Yeah I fixed it, AGAIN. I'm a noob with regards to the mechlab website. Thanks for the info. Will give these a shot.

One last thing - you may want to consider getting a Stalker 3F. The 5S and 3F have identical hardpoints, and are otherwise the same - except that the 3F has better torso twist than any of the other Stalkers. A lot of Stalkers make it feel like you are wearing a neck brace -- the 3F gives you more freedom to twist.

[Shock4ndAwe]

Would it be beneficial to drop to LRM5s/2(one on each arm?) And then I'd have another ton for an addtional heatsink?

Protection, on 26 March 2013 - 01:41 AM, said:

One last thing - you may want to consider getting a Stalker 3F. The 5S and 3F have identical hardpoints, and are otherwise the same - except that the 3F has better torso twist than any of the other Stalkers. A lot of Stalkers make it feel like you are wearing a neck brace -- the 3F gives you more freedom to twist.

Good to know when I get the next Stalker mech. Appreciate it.

Edited by Shock4ndAwe, 26 March 2013 - 01:44 AM.

[Just wanna play]

what exactly is the beagle active probe, would you recommended a brawler using it????

[AlXander]

What do you think about this modification of RVN-3L (scout)? Could be improved?

add:
I'm thinking of alternative configuration but it has less fire power. Can you advise something?

Edited by AlXander, 26 March 2013 - 03:24 AM.

[Kurkotain]

This build is my baby, but i feel like im too vulnerable during the approach (especially when my LLas become too hot to reliably keep ups their dps, and im too far to facehug the enemy and let the mediums and the srm4s do their job)

double ams kept me and my team alive through those random weeks of LrmWarrior:Online so i'm quite fond of them

still, i feel like i'm not considering something. any problems i'm criminally missing?

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...c23910bcc8641df

Nice builds and Thread by the way.

[Tyzh]

Kurkotain, on 26 March 2013 - 04:53 AM, said:

This build is my baby, but i feel like im too vulnerable during the approach (especially when my LLas become too hot to reliably keep ups their dps, and im too far to facehug the enemy and let the mediums and the srm4s do their job)

double ams kept me and my team alive through those random weeks of LrmWarrior:Online so i'm quite fond of them

still, i feel like i'm not considering something. any problems i'm criminally missing?

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...c23910bcc8641df

Nice builds and Thread by the way.

Hmmm, a lot of that is already squeezed on there pretty tight, isn't it? How close are you to a target usually when you're large lasers start to feel hot, and how fond of that double AMS are you? Considering your problem, I might recommend giving up the AMS for Artemis on the SRMs. Artemis would let you open up with your close range bracket around 180-200m and still hit well enough, rather than having to be right up in the targets face at 60m. The close range bracket also has a bit more sustainable DPS and is more heat efficient, meaning the sooner you can let off the larges and lay into the target with the SRMs the better.

I think that's the smallest change I can manage that might help with what you described. It may also be solved by tactical compensation. Finding an avenue of approach that doesn't leave you exposed as long, maybe. The four large lasers have decent alpha damage, but once they get hot you are probably going to lose the sustained DPS game.

I'm tinkering with it in Smurfy's, but all of my other ideas are more drastic overhauls of the design, and change it too much, I fear. I can post those up if you'd like, though.

[Protection]

Just wanna play, on 26 March 2013 - 03:07 AM, said:

what exactly is the beagle active probe, would you recommended a brawler using it????

It's a piece of sensor equipment that increases your radar and targeting range by 150m.

Generally, I wouldn't recommend anyone use it right now - it doesn't offer very much, and isn't helpful because of all the ECM. If I were going to use it, I'd be more inclined to put it on a light or a fast medium, but then again I usually play with teammates. Solo pugging can be a little different.

AlXander, on 26 March 2013 - 03:14 AM, said:

What do you think about this modification of RVN-3L (scout)? Could be improved?

add:
I'm thinking of alternative configuration but it has less fire power. Can you advise something?

The big big problem with the first Raven is that one of your missile launchers is a NARC tube (has the (1)), meaning that when you fire an SRM6 (6 missiles) all six of the missiles will come out one at a time - rather than a big burst of damage you get an awkward long stream of missiles. This means you end up spreading damage all over, and missing your hits, especially since you are a light mech and travelling fast. And because recycle time doesn't begin until the last missile had left the tubes, it puts the SRM6s out of synch with one another. So it isn't usually recommended.

Also, CASE is fairly pointless on a light mech - or any mech with an XL engine, really. If it gets to the point where you are taking critical hits in a side torso with XL CASE doesn't save you. The ammo explosion is still enough to kill you.

The other thing is that the Raven 3L is generally the best of the Ravens because it can go so much faster - almost as quick as a Jenner. It's a bit of a shame not to go for the big engines.



If you want to go for regular SRMs, then this is generally the optimized Raven 3L: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b5329a201891f58
This is a mech that is even common in competitive play. If you really want that Beagle Probe, you can drop the engine down to about a 270XL, but you will lost around 10kph. (Alternatively, you can drop the engine heatsink and then strip a little armour - probably from the head). The reason an SRM2 in the Narc tube works better is because one missile comes out at a time, but also because SRM2s recycle just a little faster than SRM6s, so the extra missile tube time is just enough for the SRMs to all stay in synch.

Alternatively, you can go with the "standard" Streak Raven - the single most common light mech in competitive play: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5d958e50edcb4b8
It's a real hassle to deal with, although you will often see it with +1 or +2 heatsinks instead of a BAP, or with an AMS, to shoot down LRMs and enemy Streak SRMs.

[SoldierHair]

What would you do with my MarauderBack?

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7a799001553fbd0

[Protection]

SoldierHair, on 26 March 2013 - 09:48 AM, said:

What would you do with my MarauderBack?

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7a799001553fbd0

Not a whole lot I can do here. It's a little slow, but with that much weapon payload it's to be expected. I can make you about 15kph faster for only 3-4% heat efficiency, but in an already very hot mech that might be too much for your taste.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7a799001553fbd0

Other than that, there's not much to be done. The arms have too much firepower to risk lowering armour, legs are good where they are, and crits are all uses effectively.

[Mechteric]

SoldierHair, on 26 March 2013 - 09:48 AM, said:

What would you do with my MarauderBack?

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7a799001553fbd0

What I would recommend is drop the SRMs in favor of 2 extra double heat sinks and a slightly larger engine (otherwise you end up with about a half ton of unusable space due to using up all crits with max armor)

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...61df7407ead753a

Edited by CapperDeluxe, 26 March 2013 - 10:09 AM.

[Protection]

CapperDeluxe, on 26 March 2013 - 10:07 AM, said:

What I would recommend is drop the SRMs in favor of 2 extra double heat sinks and a slightly larger engine (otherwise you end up with about a half ton of unusable space due to using up all crits with max armor)

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...61df7407ead753a

It's up to you - I get what your design is out to to -- PPCs at long range, then go to MLas and SRMs in the brawls. SRM2s aren't much, but every little bit can help - so it's really your decision.

As for the build - I can offer pretty much the same deal -- lose about 3-4% heat efficiency but gain about 15kph.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...02c452938b66e66

[EmperorMyrf]

Kurkotain, on 26 March 2013 - 04:53 AM, said:

This build is my baby, but i feel like im too vulnerable during the approach (especially when my LLas become too hot to reliably keep ups their dps, and im too far to facehug the enemy and let the mediums and the srm4s do their job)

double ams kept me and my team alive through those random weeks of LrmWarrior:Online so i'm quite fond of them

still, i feel like i'm not considering something. any problems i'm criminally missing?

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...c23910bcc8641df

Nice builds and Thread by the way.

No glaring issues really, and props on filling every slot.

I would change it up only slightly, because right now your long range group is more hot than your short range group. Simply drop both medium lasers and one large laser, and add a large pulse laser. Medium lasers are less damage efficient in the field; a pair will do 10 damage for 8 heat, while the LPL does it for 7.3 heat on top of the small boost in range. The LL that has been dropped will not effect your sustained DPS for your large lasers, only your maximum. So:

Previous:
Long Range HPS: 6.59
Long Range maxDPS: 8.47
Long Range susDPS: 3.65
Short Range HPS: 5.2
Short Range maxDPS: 10.18
Short Range susDPS: 5.56

New:
Long Range HPS: 4.94 (decreased)
Long Range maxDPS: 6.35 (decreased)
Long Range susDPS: 3.65 (same)
Short Range HPS: 5.03 (decreased)

Short Range maxDPS: 10.18 (same)
Short Range susDPS: 5.75 (increase)

So, a drop in maxDPS for your large lasers gives you a longer endurance overall. You have max armor, so you now have a payload that keeps up with it.

Edited by EmperorMyrf, 26 March 2013 - 10:20 AM.

[SoldierHair]

I like the ideas you gave me.I think i will go for the 220-230 std engine.

Now , what can you do with my 2X.I actually don't have trouble with the heat.It has an efficiency of 1.18.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...53f1646862f73f9

Edited by SoldierHair, 26 March 2013 - 11:34 AM.

[Protection]

SoldierHair, on 26 March 2013 - 11:31 AM, said:

I like the ideas you gave me.I think i will go for the 220-230 std engine.

Now , what can you do with my 2X.I actually don't have trouble with the heat.It has an efficiency of 1.18.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...53f1646862f73f9

Since you are not using the arms, I stripped a good chunk of the armour off - it't not really protecting anything, and Cataphract arms aren't all that great for meat shielding, either. And 14 points is still enough to soak a couple shots.

And I was able to get up to a 300 engine keeping everything else the same: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...16d89451324dfdf

If you really like the arm armour, then your old build is fine, but it seems like it's not offering much benefit.

[Just wanna play]

two more questions, first, remember how you said my ctfs rockets will go out as 8 then 4?? do you think srm 4s will make a noticeable difference? i might be able to get more ammo if i switched? and should i put more armor on the front of my ctf, to help the armor keep up with the weapons?

ok one more, does that atlas build i have shoot all 12 srms out of its missile tubes at once, or is it limited in how many it can launch at once like my ctf, that can shoot up 2 8 at once

remember, heres my set-up http://mwo.smurfy-ne...76ee267421c53cb
btw kept the pulses because they are better at hitting lights, and my main task is assault support, do to lack of armor