83 replies to this topic

[Tennex]

tribes was a grind.

but that wouldn't have been much of an issue if there wasn't such glaring balance problems. I can deal with a grind if i'm having fun. but grinding an unfun unbalanced game isn't really worth it.

Edited by Tennex, 25 March 2013 - 01:27 PM.

[Parnage Winters]

Captain Stiffy, on 25 March 2013 - 01:14 PM, said:

LOL I just like mechwarrior, they're going to license that IP put up an MMO and make it F2P they're going to get some people that don't care for the pricing model.

I'm a way-beyond-paid player and I wish I could have just bought the game once. It's both a greedy-as-hell model and a long term one.

I hope they find the middle line, but that's eventually (like almost every other F2P game) going to lead to them selling starting packages, which really isn't any different than what EA does selling you a game and making you buy an expansion ON RELEASE DAY.

F2P isn't going away. It offers constant content, constant updates and the idea of a long term product. Instead of buying a game and then it being over in a week you throw a few bucks into a game here and there and the game that you enjoy gets better and more stuff is added over the years. Can it have negatives? Of course but so can full priced games(HI SIMCITY 5) the payment model is moot so long as the product is good.

So the question you have to ask is, do you think MWO is a good product? I do. It's only getting better.

[Oni Ralas]

Tennex, on 25 March 2013 - 01:21 PM, said:

tribes was a grind.

but that wouldn't have been much of an issue if there wasn't such glaring balance issues.

tribes was a grind.

but that wouldn't have been much of an issue if there wasn't such glaring balance issues.

(((ECHO)))

[Adridos]

Tennex, on 25 March 2013 - 01:21 PM, said:

tribes was a grind.

but that wouldn't have been much of an issue if there wasn't such glaring balance issues

They simply created a game inferior to that from 1998 in just about any aspect.
And if you think PGI doens't listen to the community, you should've seen their beta forums...

[Tennex]

Adridos, on 25 March 2013 - 01:25 PM, said:

They simply created a game inferior to that from 1998 in just about any aspect.
And if you think PGI doens't listen to the community, you should've seen their beta forums...

haha thats one thing PGI has that Tribes doesn't. while it doesn't seem like PGI respect us and closes threads any chance they get, at least they seem to listen to us.

[MadPanda]

Lyteros, on 25 March 2013 - 01:19 PM, said:

I really liked the part where the board was talking about publishers runing a game and when brian / russ were grabbing the microphone in response, the IGP domina was lashing her whip out at them, yelling "RUSS AND BRIAN DON'T ANSWER THAT".

Probably tells a lot why things are going like they are.

If you want to enjoy it too, its on 25:35 roughly.

Lol I thought you were joking but damn that really happened . I'm lost for words...

[Chavette]

One thing that struck me, the Tribes game has a one time $30 fee you can pay, and you will unlock everything other than cosmetics, essentially making it a box game if you don't like micro-transactions.

[Captain Stiffy]

Parnage, on 25 March 2013 - 01:21 PM, said:

F2P isn't going away. It offers constant content, constant updates and the idea of a long term product. Instead of buying a game and then it being over in a week you throw a few bucks into a game here and there and the game that you enjoy gets better and more stuff is added over the years. Can it have negatives? Of course but so can full priced games(HI SIMCITY 5) the payment model is moot so long as the product is good.

So the question you have to ask is, do you think MWO is a good product? I do. It's only getting better.

Yes... however... I feel like there's not much to EARN now. I spent what is really a tiny amount of real money (compared to buying a 50 dollar game and paying 15 a month) and now I have basically everything - and will for some time based on the content cycle.

The only barrier now is getting MC which at 200-250k a match (sometimes more), in a hero mech is almost nothing. Now I'm NOT ASKING FOR A GRIND! what that means depends on the player, but to me it means having to spend a huge amount of time on something in order to get it AT ALL.

So why am I not in love with the F2P model? Well, one thing we lost with letting players just outright BUY everything was a sense of accomplishment. I obviously have a lot of fun in individual matches, but the mechanics of earning something long term just don't seem to be there... I've mastered many mechs that I don't even own anymore because the only sense of accomplishment remaining after double convert weekend is mastering yet another.

More than anything I wish that I could convert EXP into CBILLS... I converted over 100k exp on my DDC and still have 46k exp and many mechs with elite trees besides.

[Tennex]

i had my doubts at certain points in this game's development.

but after playing it for this long and seeing some of the features and problems I wanted to be addressed when i started playing finally be addressed, I have no doubt that PGI will deliver.

Though i'm still skeptical about whether they can do it in a timely fashion.

[Parnage Winters]

Captain Stiffy, on 25 March 2013 - 01:39 PM, said:

Yes... however... I feel like there's not much to EARN now. I spent what is really a tiny amount of real money (compared to buying a 50 dollar game and paying 15 a month) and now I have basically everything - and will for some time based on the content cycle.

The only barrier now is getting MC which at 200-250k a match (sometimes more), in a hero mech is almost nothing. Now I'm NOT ASKING FOR A GRIND! what that means depends on the player, but to me it means having to spend a huge amount of time on something in order to get it AT ALL.

So why am I not in love with the F2P model? Well, one thing we lost with letting players just outright BUY everything was a sense of accomplishment. I obviously have a lot of fun in individual matches, but the mechanics of earning something long term just don't seem to be there... I've mastered many mechs that I don't even own anymore because the only sense of accomplishment remaining after double convert weekend is mastering yet another.

More than anything I wish that I could convert EXP into CBILLS... I converted over 100k exp on my DDC and still have 46k exp and many mechs with elite trees besides.

Yeaup, having xp on mechs you mastered just pile up is kind of annoying I'd like to see more use for mech xp. For what? Not sure but when my poor muromets has something like 60k+(last time I checked months ago) I want to do something with it all.

Anyway it's a panel about f2p games. I have no problem paying a company for things I like and honestly I like it over the old ways of buy a product, hope it doesn't suck hope they patch any problems and support it for awhile.

Edited by Parnage, 25 March 2013 - 01:46 PM.

[armyof1]

Lyteros, on 25 March 2013 - 01:19 PM, said:

I really liked the part where the board was talking about publishers runing a game and when brian / russ were grabbing the microphone in response, the IGP domina was lashing her whip out at them, yelling "RUSS AND BRIAN DON'T ANSWER THAT".

Probably tells a lot why things are going like they are.

If you want to enjoy it too, its on 25:35 roughly.

That was like the perfect moment for someone to use the whip app.

[Captain Stiffy]

I mean, could we get achievements with big c-bill bonuses or something? That would be really cool... for me at least that would add a huge amount of fun to the game.... the point shouldn't always be to win and it obviously isn't since you can earn way more money by wrecking a team than by capping a base and damage nobody.

Names right off the top of my head;

Arms Race: Destroy 7 enemy arms in a single match.
Combo Meal: Destroy a leg, arm and torso on the same enemy 'mech.
High Five: Get 5 kills in a single match.
Present and accounted for: Damage every member of the enemy team within at most 10 seconds of their death.
Oops, You dropped something: Destroy 10 enemy components in a single match.

It's easy to imagine them. Why can't we?

[Warlune]

Captain Stiffy, on 25 March 2013 - 01:51 PM, said:

I mean, could we get achievements with big c-bill bonuses or something? That would be really cool... for me at least that would add a huge amount of fun to the game.... the point shouldn't always be to win and it obviously isn't since you can earn way more money by wrecking a team than by capping a base and damage nobody.

Names right off the top of my head;

Arms Race: Destroy 7 enemy arms in a single match.
Combo Meal: Destroy a leg, arm and torso on the same enemy 'mech.
High Five: Get 5 kills in a single match.
Present and accounted for: Damage every member of the enemy team within at most 10 seconds of their death.
Oops, You dropped something: Destroy 10 enemy components in a single match.

It's easy to imagine them. Why can't we?

I really like the idea of having C-bill bonuses for fun objectives like this

[Chavette]

Captain Stiffy, on 25 March 2013 - 01:51 PM, said:

I mean, could we get achievements with big c-bill bonuses or something? That would be really cool... for me at least that would add a huge amount of fun to the game.... the point shouldn't always be to win and it obviously isn't since you can earn way more money by wrecking a team than by capping a base and damage nobody.

Names right off the top of my head;

Arms Race: Destroy 7 enemy arms in a single match.
Combo Meal: Destroy a leg, arm and torso on the same enemy 'mech.
High Five: Get 5 kills in a single match.
Present and accounted for: Damage every member of the enemy team within at most 10 seconds of their death.
Oops, You dropped something: Destroy 10 enemy components in a single match.

It's easy to imagine them. Why can't we?

Yes, achievements are coming, and its been said you can get stuff like free mech bays for them.

[Adridos]

Warlune, on 25 March 2013 - 01:54 PM, said:

I really like the idea of having C-bill bonuses for fun objectives like this

Basically like badges in Tribes, medals in Star Conflict/War Thinder?

[Duncan Longwood]

Captain Stiffy, on 25 March 2013 - 01:39 PM, said:

So why am I not in love with the F2P model? Well, one thing we lost with letting players just outright BUY everything was a sense of accomplishment. I obviously have a lot of fun in individual matches, but the mechanics of earning something long term just don't seem to be there... I've mastered many mechs that I don't even own anymore because the only sense of accomplishment remaining after double convert weekend is mastering yet another.

If you had bothered to watch the video, Chris Roberts addresses that sense of accomplishment by stating that he knows there are fans of Wing Commander that have jobs and kids and don't have all the time in the world to play games. He doesn't want to give an advantage to those that have all the time in the world, nor those that have all the money in the world.

I don't think older fans with more money than time should be closed off from what the game has to offer because they don't have 40 hours a week to play.

[shihku7]

hard to listen to the video.. too much reverb/echo stuff

[Lyteros]

Thontor, on 25 March 2013 - 02:23 PM, said:

Clearly it was a joke on her part. Especially obvious since Russ did answer the question quite thoroughly anyway.

Yeah of course. Clearly. Absolutely.
How's your pay btw? Is it worth jumping on the train?

[Magitek]

The Tribes guy says, 'People buy the power items, also known as pay to win items, the most, even if they complain about them.'

Here is some information about my F2P gaming and spending habits:

I don't play Tribes Ascent, because I think it's has a unreasonable grind and is generally a pay to win game.

I did not, and will not, spend any money on Tribes Ascent.

I do play Mechwarrior Online, because I feel it's a better game than even the older Mechwarrior titles. It has a very reasonable grind for free to play accounts. MWO does not make use of 'power items', or unbalanced pay to win weapons/ammo/mechs.

I have bought around 4 weeks of premium time and the Flame hero mech.

Tribes Ascent may very well sell many P2W weapons, but because they do I do not play their game. I'm not there for the over powered guns to have something to shoot at. Tribes Ascent isn't F2P, it's P2W. Players have to buy these weapons and classes to stay competitive. So with that in mind, Tribes Ascent is just a crappier, less balanced, version of the old Metaltech based Tribes games released for $30. The $30 is the package deal that includes said overpowered weapons/classes.

IGP has made it clear that they don't want that for Mechwarrior Online, with their changes to the planned consumables. Players can still get in-game currency consumables to the same effectiveness as the paid consumables, but only after a grind that's reasonable. That's what real money in F2P games is for, cut the grind to reach the same end. Now, if you want to look hawt, use unique variants with in-game currency boost, or (by the what we are seeing the latest trailer) play the latest mech chassis early players have to pay for it. IMO that's reasonable and I'm sure many here agree.

[Jetfire]

Magitek, on 25 March 2013 - 03:05 PM, said:

The Tribes guy says, 'People buy the power items, also known as pay to win items, the most, even if they complain about them.'

Here is some information about my F2P gaming and spending habits:

I don't play Tribes Ascent, because I think it's has a unreasonable grind and is generally a pay to win game.

I did not, and will not, spend any money on Tribes Ascent.

I do play Mechwarrior Online, because I feel it's a better game than even the older Mechwarrior titles. It has a very reasonable grind for free to play accounts. MWO does not make use of 'power items', or unbalanced pay to win weapons/ammo/mechs.

I have bought around 4 weeks of premium time and the Flame hero mech.

Tribes Ascent may very well sell many P2W weapons, but because they do I do not play their game. I'm not there for the over powered guns to have something to shoot at. Tribes Ascent isn't F2P, it's P2W. Players have to buy these weapons and classes to stay competitive. So with that in mind, Tribes Ascent is just a crappier, less balanced, version of the old Metaltech based Tribes games released for $30. The $30 is the package deal that includes said overpowered weapons/classes.

IGP has made it clear that they don't want that for Mechwarrior Online, with their changes to the planned consumables. Players can still get in-game currency consumables to the same effectiveness as the paid consumables, but only after a grind that's reasonable. That's what real money in F2P games is for, cut the grind to reach the same end. Now, if you want to look hawt, use unique variants with in-game currency boost, or (by the what we are seeing the latest trailer) play the latest mech chassis early players have to pay for it. IMO that's reasonable and I'm sure many here agree.

Yeah, they can go the Tribes route if they really want, but I'll take my oodles of money elsewhere, namely to Chris Roberts. For now they are treading the line conciously... despite their terrible communication styles at times . They would be really dumb to try and cash out with P2W right now, on the birth of the game.

The devs obviously care, but aren't the most seasoned in dealing with a community. They really need to hire some professionals to represent them online or take some communications courses some weekend. The difference between the face Chris Roberts has put out to the fans and the PGI team is glarring to say the least. I mean SC could turn out to be vaporware, but I really trust him a lot so far. PGI has me on edge, but cautiously optimistic.

Edited by Jetfire, 25 March 2013 - 03:13 PM.