74 replies to this topic

[F lan Ker]

S!

Slimebucket, if using an El Cheapo stick for aiming that is exactly what you get. Cheaper sticks use not so good potentiometers that are inaccurate causing "spiking" and other things while the Thrustmaster Warthog uses Hall sensors that are extremely accurate. Sure it takes a lot of practise to get good in aiming with a stick, but when you learn it then not any harder than with a mouse I think.

[Ozric]

WASD is OP.

[slimebucket]

Buddahcjcc, on 04 April 2013 - 09:21 AM, said:

reminds me of a friend who gets flack for being a vegetarian and an atheist but has the necessity to tell everyone that he meets up fronrt that he's a vegetarian and an atheist

The situation is more closer to your Vegatarian friend is in a restaurant ordering food. HE HAS to tell the worker "I am a vegetarian, do not put meat in the meal" - Not telling the person jsut for the sake of it, but because the information is important to whats going on.

Then the worker, and everyone in the restaurant starts insulting the person for it. I don't go telling everyone I use a joystick!

I made a couple of posts talking about BUGS, BUGS DEALING with JOYSTICKS. SO I HAD TO TELL PEOPLE I used joysticks...


You people act like I am jsut going around yelling to everyone I USE A JOYSTICK!, then getting upset when they make fun of me.


Why does soooo many people assume this thread is JUST ABOUT QQ'ing about the people who make fun of it?

The tread is clearly for talking about IF joystick instead of keyboards gimp.


oh and Alexii I would suggest you re-read the post you made. I honestly hope it was a intentional troll post, because if it wasn't, you have a serious hard time understanding the meaning of what people are saying.


You say im ungreatful because I am not listening to e-therapi$ts and accepting all there "great" tips? yeah I guess I am ungrateful to e-therapi$ts because they honestly are not trying to help, they are selfishly trying to just make themselves feel better by thinking they "helped" someone. But they are not helping anyone. In fact, they make things worse.

You don't want to ignore bullies. That makes the problem get worse, and also shows you are a coward. You need to deal with your problems.

If you think I am ungreatful and all that, why would you even try and contribute to my thread? If that is how you feel, screw off please.

FunkyFritter, on 04 April 2013 - 06:55 AM, said:

If I understand your setup correctly, wouldn't it be uncomfortable to turn and switch vision modes at the same time?

No it isn't I hold the bottom of the stick and my pinky finger or thumb can touch all the base buttons while in the middle of combat.

Edited by slimebucket, 04 April 2013 - 02:20 PM.

[xhrit]

slimebucket, on 04 April 2013 - 03:09 AM, said:

Why does using a joystick with my left hand, and my mouse in my right hand GIMP ME, or screw myself over?

It screws you over, because then you have no hands left to use your trackball.

[TheRulesLawyer]

I think some people don't understand the difference between using a left hand stick and using a stick to replace a mouse. Left had stick is fine (I use throttle/pedals, but same idea) using a stick for aim is difficult though.

[Roadbeer]

Low351, on 04 April 2013 - 04:25 AM, said:

Any way you play better can't be bad. Thanks to the OP for making me think about how I'm playing. With all these new keys coming in for the new features I'm starting to get muddled.

I was hitting "F" the other night wondering why my coolant flush wasn't happening. Duh! it's default mapping is the "Delete" key. Someone mentionned that may be retained muscle memory from MW2 in my case.

Anywho, after reading your post I wondered if I should get a dedicated periperhal for my left hand, after all I bought a 6-button gaming mouse for my right.

I like the look of the Razor Nostromo. Is anyone using that with MWO? It appears to have enough keys to map to things like coolant flush and air strike etc. If I can configure them to my liking I might manage to use the features when I need them rather than fumble.

I use this with my Joystick. I have the thumbpad set for turning and the JS for pitch/twist.

Just a bit of advice, if you can get your hands on a reasonably priced Belkin model, not the RAZER one, you'll be better off. From what I understand, the software is better with the Belkin one. I've been using it for over 10 years and I think it'll be like loosing my dog if it should ever die.

[Sgt Disciple]

Ive been driving with the stick in left hand since MW3 mouse in right. I love it push foward go foward push left go left great tactile feedback and lots of buttons for weapon groups hat to target ect ect. Use it love it!

[Dirkdaring]

People say it gimps you - you say it doesn't. You come on here defend it. Put your money where your mous... err joystick is and post a video of you in game with it. Lets see how good you are.

[Tempered]

I'm guessing that they can not afford a joystick.

[Cest7]

The only way a JS would gimp you over a keyboard would be if the JS had <5 buttons.

[DirePhoenix]

I use one of these for my left hand:



That's right, an ancient 1990's era ORIGINAL 10-button Nostromo n50... It still works!

I use D-Pad up/down for turn left/right, and the wheel maps to the throttle. Buttons are weapon groups 3-5 (I don't have 6 mapped), nightvision, thermal, HUDinfo (Q), freelook, and jumpjets. I would also have Center torso to legs mapped, but that action doesn't seem to actually map to joystick buttons, despite what the UI says.

On the right hand, I use this:



My friends call me a weirdo for preferring trackballs to mice, but I feel like I'm more precise with a trackball, and I don't need to take up a lot of desk real-estate and move my arm all over the place to move the pointer, which leads into another "weird" thing I do... I don't play with either of these controllers on a desk. The Trackball and Nostromo sit on my legs. I play like I have my hands resting on my knees. I feel this is a pretty comfortable way to play and doesn't seem to build up a lot of stress in my shoulders that I normally would get from intense gaming sessions.

Now, even though this works pretty well for me right now, I would say that if I had a left-handed joystick (or even an ambidextrous joystick), I would be using a joystick in my left hand for throttle, turning, and other functions I could assign to buttons. For my right hand, while I really like the trackball movement, this Logitech is woefully short on buttons. I always feel like I really need two more buttons to the right of the main two so I have one for each finger (actually, take the extended 4 buttons, then split them into upper and lower sections so my four right fingers have two buttons each), and then maybe change the thumb trackball into an analog joystick nub like on the 360 and PS3 controllers.

Actually... this is sounding a whole lot like a right-handed Nostromo... hrm... I wonder what playing with Nostromos on each hand would be like...

Edited by DirePhoenix, 04 April 2013 - 03:20 PM.

[cyberFluke]

To simply answer the original post properly, (and essentially end the thread) now I have the time;

Arguably the most comprehensive, complete and most competitive setup possible for MWO is a set of decent rudder pedals, a solid throttle with plenty hats and switches and a high DPI mouse with scaleable on-the-fly sensitivity and at least 4 buttons.

The rudder pedals control your 'mech's feet/leg direction. With the recent control upgrade they now perform better than a keyboard as you have analog control over turning rate, rather than full left/right or nothing.

The throttle controls the machine's speed. There are two ways of doing this, The first; the throttle controls speed with a button to reverse direction, and the second; the throttle directly sets the direction and speed, stationary being near the centre of the throttle (ideally about 1/3 of the way from whichever end you would consider backwards"). The hats and switches on the throttle can be set to the other controls you need access to instantly, like vision modes, target switching etc.

Finally, the mouse controls the 'mech's torso, arms and firing weapon groups. This is where the joystick argument silliness comes begins....
The key assumption to be aware of which here which essentially determines your options is this; You are sat at a stationary desk which is not subject to the same forces as the 'mech cockpit.
From this we can determine that:
1) You *have* a flat surface, so a mouse is an option. (Most console users don't use a mouse, as there isn't a great scope for using a mouse very well in front of the television, for example.)
2) You are not subject to forces that would affect your ability to hold the mouse and use it accurately. (This is partially why planes, tanks and anything else you care to name in the real world (with a pilot inside it, before someone pipes up with *drones*...) aren't controlled with a mouse.)

Combine this with the *fact* that a mouse is more versatile and more accurate than a joystick when not needing to give constant directional output^*1, then you have a deciding factor for primary control input. The part people pointlessly argue is that a joystick can be as accurate as a mouse. The mouse can take acceleration of the device into account and scale the input appropriately, allowing large inputs and tiny, single pixel corrections in times measurable in sub-seconds. The joystick and whole arm movement required simply cannot keep up with that level of input without milspec gear *and* training.

Xander "Fluke" Dent

*1 (Meaning, if you have to keep picking up the mouse and "cycling" it across the mat/desk, a joystick is better)

EDIT: One improvement, which I'll point out was more than strongly alluded to by Devs early on in the whole process, is TrackIR support. I can already hold control and move my pilots head, please, for the love of all that is sacred, drop in TrackIR support. I'm quite sure NaturalPoint will be more than helpful, as it's in their best interests to have their product supported by as many games as possible.

Edited by cyberFluke, 05 April 2013 - 02:13 PM.

[GRay111111]

NinetyProof, on 04 April 2013 - 11:25 AM, said:

Don't know ... that's just the throttle right? where is the *left/right* controls?

I am starting to not like the keyboard for piloting the mech so I have been giving this some thought lately. In the old Mech Warrior games (and I mean really old) you just used the joystick, and that was fine ... back then. Now I am so used to using a mouse, I would not want to change that ... so mouse = aim with basic firing attributes.

So that leaves movement. What I used to like about the joystick was "torso twist" ... but that is now under the control of the mouse. What I don't like about the JS is throttle decay when returned to center. So that really doesn't leave much for the JS to do ... so I guess JS is out for me.

So if a keyboard is out, and a JS is out, what does that leave? a Gaming Pad with a HAT? The idea of a hat switch for left / right I think would work ... as well as forward / back being on the hat as well.

I really miss having keys/buttons for 1/3 and 2/3'rd speed settings ... as well as full throttle / full reverse keys / buttons and a good PAD with programmable keys could possibly take care of that? Is there a way to program in 33% throttle / 66% throttle?

The rudder control is used for the steering (legs left and right). The rudder is at the finger tips when holding the throttle on the x45.
You can see the rudder paddle in the second photo. Not sure if you missed that, or if I missed your point. Either way the x45 throttle (when modded) works superb as a throttle, steering, button array for MWO, just add a mouse for aiming and firing.

Edited by GRay111111, 18 April 2013 - 11:51 AM.

[GRay111111]

p.s.

When will they fix the button binds not working ingame . . . its tedious having once working buttons no longer function.

[Echo6]

I like OP's control method, but my left hand is more or less useless. Long years have given me the ability to type with it and use it on keyboards to play games, but not much else. I usually keep it in a pocket so I don't accidentally hit things with it while I'm walking around.