67 replies to this topic

[Sybreed]

And instead of Stalkers plaguing the fields, it'll be Victors, Miseries and Highlanders. This shows that the real culprit, the real villain that is making balance impossible is convergence.

Also, the Awesome will remain a tier F mech as long as a hardpoint rework isn't implemented.

Let's hope they use the test servers to test these ideas, even if they're against it at first.

Edited by Sybreed, 11 July 2013 - 03:49 PM.

[Mister Blastman]

They just don't get it. Or maybe they do and they are lazy.

Convergence is and has been the problem ever since closed beta started an entire year ago.

[Lugh]

I already run this way because it's the maximum efficiency between firepower and sustainability for most of my mechs....

So...yeah...

[Sybreed]

Lugh, on 11 July 2013 - 01:38 PM, said:

I already run this way because it's the maximum efficiency between firepower and sustainability for most of my mechs....

So...yeah...

mathematically, it's quite possibly one of the best combos, but with the heat penalties incoming, it'll be the new meta.

[FupDup]

A very halfassed one at that.

[Ozric]

2xERPPC, 1 Gauss is actually the old meta, before the current meta, so does that really make it the new meta?

[Sybreed]

Ozric, on 11 July 2013 - 01:41 PM, said:

2xERPPC, 1 Gauss is actually the old meta, before the current meta, so does that really make it the new meta?

[GingerBang]

Ozric, on 11 July 2013 - 01:41 PM, said:

2xERPPC, 1 Gauss is actually the old meta, before the current meta, so does that really make it the new meta?

YEEEEEEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!! MEET THE NEW BOSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SAME AS THE OLD BOSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



man, what was the name of that song.... I swear it is on the tip of my tongue... OH YEAH

DON'T GET FOOLED AGAIN

Edited by GingerBang, 11 July 2013 - 01:45 PM.

[Lykaon]

Convergence mechanics (and group fire) are only features that allow for exploiting the actual problem.

Undesireably short time to kill ratios caused by the following.

The issue is MWO uses the armor mechanics pulled directly from Battletech table top.We have mechs with distinct armor values for each seperate body location just like the table top game however MWo lacks any of supporting mechanics the table top game had in place to prevent exploiting the armor mechanics.

In this video game a player can with little effort consistently hit a desired body location on a target mech.By using group fire and only weapons that front load their damage in one instant we have a situation where damage is applied with high effect on the most vulnerable body location excluding the defences of all other armored body locations.

This means that 18 tons of armor is as effective as the 4 tons covering the CT or in the most extreme cases no better protection that a half ton on the head.

Essentially when the table top game was converted to a video game the mechanics selected improved applied firepower of mechs (group fire,faster weapon recycle times and convergence) and vastly reduced defences (distinct armor values for seperate body locations with no supporting mechanics to mitigate pinpoint targeting of vulnerable locations)

We could call for the root causes to be handled or seek an alternative means of increase survival times of mechs under fire either could solve many of the gripes we hear about "balance" or "meta".

[Homeless Bill]

They'll probably lump Gauss in with PPCs eventually, but it doesn't solve the problem: you're still able to put ridiculous amounts of damage on a single component in a single shot. Until they prevent it from happening, the game will remain broken regardless of how fiercely it punishes extreme, pinpoint damage.

[Deathlike]

Someone forgot the Cataphract. It was already just fine before, and still fine after. Congrats PGI... nothing will change.

[Homeless Bill]

FupDup, on 11 July 2013 - 01:40 PM, said:

A very halfassed one at that.

That's all it needs. 'Tis but a flesh wound.

[Splitpin]

Big mechs carry big weapons. At some stage you have to let them do their job. Yes it may well be the new meta, as though that's a bad thing, no matter how much the whiners get weapons nerf'd there will always be a 'most potent build' the way to deal with that is NOT nerf shooting. There's nothing more frustrating in a shooter than to legitimately hit your target and it not register. We have that now. The way to deal with any and every FOTM builds is to enforce a mix of mechs on the battlefield, weight/BV balance is the missing piece at the moment.

[MaxStr]

Ozric, on 11 July 2013 - 01:41 PM, said:

2xERPPC, 1 Gauss is actually the old meta, before the current meta, so does that really make it the new meta?

See first they get you hooked on Meta™ then they stop making it and introduce New Meta™. Nobody likes new meta and everyone complains that things used to be better. Thats when they introduce Classic Meta™, and everyone says "take my money!".

[UPnADAM]

Jesus Christ I wish ppl would ****....Oh NoOOOs 35 damage! Get over it play the game or don't get in there face and there done.

[Steel Claws]

Homeless Bill, on 11 July 2013 - 01:45 PM, said:

They'll probably lump Gauss in with PPCs eventually, but it doesn't solve the problem: you're still able to put ridiculous amounts of damage on a single component in a single shot. Until they prevent it from happening, the game will remain broken regardless of how fiercely it punishes extreme, pinpoint damage.

Actually thre already is some lack of convergence. Most of youy don't see it because you don't drive mechs that show it. Drive a Victor for a while and you'll know what I mean. Any mech with arms that can move horizontally already has a lack of convergence.

As for huge amounts of damage - I don't really think it's that much - you can get that much and more with other mechs. 6 mediums is 30 yet no one has ever said it was OP. No for my dollar the new meta is going to be LRMs. Brawlers might come back but I'm betting on a huge resurgence of LRMs. This has actually already started but since they did not lump LRMs into one pile like PPCs there is nothing to stop someone from say loading a LRM 20, 2 LRM 15s and 1 or 2 LRM 10s.

Quite frankly I was so tired of seeing 4 - 6 PPC stalkers (and no I never drive them) anyway so I welcome the change.

Edited by Steel Claws, 11 July 2013 - 02:06 PM.

[Unbound Inferno]

UPnADAM, on 11 July 2013 - 02:02 PM, said:

Jesus Christ I wish ppl would ****....Oh NoOOOs 35 damage! Get over it play the game or don't get in there face and there done.

Get a clue please?

35 Damage still means you core any mech in 3 shots or less.

Edited by Unbound Inferno, 11 July 2013 - 02:04 PM.

[Steel Claws]

Unbound Inferno, on 11 July 2013 - 02:04 PM, said:

Get a clue please?

35 Damage still means you core any mech in 3 shots or less.

Only if you stand there and let them do it.

[Rashhaverak]

I don't see how the 2PPC/gauss build is that much of a problem.

Is the gauss rifle so OP that it should not be combined with any other weapon? Or is it that 2PPCs is so OP that it should not be able to be combined? Or is there some following that thinks that there should be no sniping what-so-ever? Snipers should only be able to fire a maximum of 20 points in any one shot?

I don't know about the rest of you, but it is the 60 point one-shots that I have a problem with. Two PPCs and a gauss rifle is hardly what I would call "boating".

Given that a standard Alpha strike on a jenner is 30 points, I don't really understand how a 35 point alpha on a heavy or assault mech is that overpowered.

[Unbound Inferno]

Wouldn't need any standing. Have a 4-man run with it odds are 2 or 3 will shoot you on sight - dead. Not a very fun match.

Edited by Unbound Inferno, 11 July 2013 - 02:13 PM.