342 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

Koniving, on 19 July 2013 - 11:28 AM, said:

[/size]

I'm confused as to the hitboxes you suggested. I can understand the CT one. As I'm reading I think you mean the side torsos will encompass that huge area of the front akin to how it works with the Stalker? If so then yes XL engines would definitely be a no-no.

(The way you did the outlines on the arms are what threw me off.)

Okay, yes that'd be the basic way PGI would likely do it if they just said "okay give it hitboxes." It'd be akin to the Stalker in how difficult it is to destroy. Easy to get rid of side torsos, but then doing so makes it harder to take out the core.

But you do realize how easy it is to destroy side torsos? You're counting on the 50% damage reduction to the destroyed side torsos to protect your center torso, without looking ahead to whether or not PGI will implement complete removal / destruction of side torsos with exposed internals? I like to think ahead for what PGI might do to the future (it keeps me sane).

Btw: Those are some massive side torsos!

Personally I favor my more creative ideas, though I confess while one of my ideas would allow you to allocate lots of armor to the CT (top/bottom of the shell; assuming a more saucer-shaped crab), and however much to the RT (mech's front/back) as you please, the LT (mech's left / right) armor would be very limited (since you'd have to balance it to equally protect left and right) but the hit boxes fairly small for the actual 'front / back' and 'left/right' weakpoints. But this is mainly because the Crab would be a lot more like a Crab with a shell to crack or small spaces to cut into.

Yes. They can destroy a side torso.

(Which happens ANYHOW. See the Atlas, Centy, Hunch, Stalker, etc, all regularly seen wandering around half missing.)

Of course, from the side the arm absorbs 102 pts of damage first. (68 armor/34 internal). Pass thru damage is halved (hence the Zombie toughness of Centys). The Side torso themselves are possessed of 84 armor (probably 70 front in most cases) and another 42 Internal.so approximately 112-126 MORE damage absorption.

So from the sides, or with any reasonable amount of twisting, that one side can reasonably absorb 200+ damage before popping. All the while it is lashing out with 2 AC20, a Large Laser (or ER PPC in my version) and missiles. (1 LRM15 or 2 SRM6). Even caught flat footed it absorbs over 100 damage to that torso.

BANG. Congrats, now it's off. And you are facing a STILL massively armored, heat efficient mech that still has either an AC20 and heavy energy weapon, or and AC20 and a Heavy Missile port. Not unlike an Atlas, except that when "halved" the KGC STILL has massive weapons.

I don't get the Lose the torso argument, mainly because that happens to every mech ANYHOW, eventually. And on a mech about as tall as a Jagermech, as wide as a Victor and deep as a Catapult, it's not like one is getting that much easier a target to hit. And while you are working off that torso, (solo, with "LEET skills" 2-3 alphas, at least) IT's pummeling you back. And even as half a mech, it's more dangerous armament wise than most. So your torso issue has me totally perplexed.

Also, I am working with the system we HAVE, not trying to re-invent the wheel.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 19 July 2013 - 11:58 AM.

[Chavette]

Bishop Steiner, on 19 July 2013 - 06:24 AM, said:

about as much trash as 85 tons with Static Arms has proven to be I suspect.


sorta kinda, And now I need to find Metal Slug 3.

No. Ever tried to hit a light with atlas torso weapons? The stalker can do it so-so, but the crab would have problems with anything under heavy.

85 =/= 100

And that stalker has max engine or 10 less than max, how many atlas run standard max engine?

[blacklp]

Ever try to hit a light with atlas torso weapons? Yes, most of my lights kills are from the AC/20 or the 3 SRM 6s.

[Bishop Steiner]

Chavette, on 19 July 2013 - 12:14 PM, said:

No. Ever tried to hit a light with atlas torso weapons? The stalker can do it so-so, but the crab would have problems with anything under heavy.

85 =/= 100

And that stalker has max engine or 10 less than max, how many atlas run standard max engine?

since most of my Atlases only have 2 medium lasers as arm weapons, yeah, I kinda have to use my torso weapons. AC20, 2 Medium pulses and 2 SRM6.

[Darzok]

I would kill to see the Crab and King Crab added.

The KC if added will be a mech to avoid if you are not able to flank or in a light as it will rip you a new one in the blink of an eye why been able to take what ever you throw at it.

It has to be added its just to awesome to be left out.

[Thundercles]

SgtMagor, on 18 July 2013 - 03:32 PM, said:

aww man, now you got me on the Crab train. count my vote for King Crab yup yup!

-To the tune of Love Train-

People all over the sphere...
Join in...
Start a crab train, crab train...
People all over the sphere...
Join in...
Start a crab train, crab train...

[Chavette]

Bishop Steiner, on 19 July 2013 - 01:04 PM, said:

since most of my Atlases only have 2 medium lasers as arm weapons, yeah, I kinda have to use my torso weapons. AC20, 2 Medium pulses and 2 SRM6.

So how'd it work out? And do we need another mech like that, when even its arms behave the same way?

Its pretty pointless for us to argue though as I have reasonable faith they won't go full static arms, or it will have other respectable variants.

[Bishop Steiner]

Chavette, on 19 July 2013 - 03:06 PM, said:

So how'd it work out? And do we need another mech like that, when even its arms behave the same way?

Its pretty pointless for us to argue though as I have reasonable faith they won't go full static arms, or it will have other respectable variants.

what I am wondering about is where the "full static arms" thing started in the first place. Not with me.

[Yiazmat]

Chavette, why are you talking? PGI already gives full arm articulation to the ac/20 Victor, Highlender and Yen-low. They'd give it to the KGC too. Anything else unconstructive to add?

Also, read the whole bloody thread. We've already covered this.

[Ialdabaoth]

Note, again, that this would be the *first* Mechwarrior game to let anyone pilot a King Crab.

I *need* my King Crab fix.

[Ragnar Darkmane]

Well, piloting a King Crab for once would be a nice change...

[SgtMagor]

...posted wrong thread my bad!

Edited by SgtMagor, 21 July 2013 - 05:33 AM.

[OuttaAmmo NoWai]

It would have a very low profile (neat-o) And the dual AC20s would be balanced by the current heat limitations.

Why the heck not, people want to buy an Urbanmech ffs

[Anyone00]

OuttaAmmo NoWai, on 21 July 2013 - 08:47 AM, said:

It would have a very low profile (neat-o) And the dual AC20s would be balanced by the current heat limitations.

Well I think a better way to balance the dual AC20s than the heat (hey it's the base configuration and intended to be fired together) and to make it more distinct is it to have the torso vertical vertical angle be small, make the arms only to be able to move in horizontal (due to the one of the arm actuators having to be removed to fit the AC20), and limit it to one missile hardpoint (no stacking SSRMs). Making the King Crab devastating against ground bound assaults and heavies but very poor at taking on lights and JJ equipped mechs.

Also instead of missile doors, gunport doors for the arms: pinch, pinch.

[OuttaAmmo NoWai]

Anyone00, on 21 July 2013 - 09:00 AM, said:

Well I think a better way to balance the dual AC20s than the heat (hey it's the base configuration and intended to be fired together) and to make it more distinct is it to have the torso vertical vertical angle be small, make the arms only to be able to move in horizontal (due to the one of the arm actuators having to be removed to fit the AC20), and limit it to one missile hardpoint (no stacking SSRMs). Making the King Crab devastating against ground bound assaults and heavies but very poor at taking on lights and JJ equipped mechs.

Also instead of missile doors, gunport doors for the arms: pinch, pinch.

I don't know why, but some part of me *wants* to see the king crab fire both those AC20s simultaneously. It should be a mech that you don't want to get in front of.

I can understand the AC20 nerf, but they're supposed to be low heat weapons, you're paying a substantial investment in tonnage, crit slots, and ammo in order to even field them! Boomjaegers were a one-trick pony anyway, they weren't really overpowered.

[SgtMagor]

Big fat mech, that will have limited arm movement , nerfed ac20's, slow, and it will probably have a torso twist even more limited than a Stalker. What's the point just saying!

Edited by SgtMagor, 21 July 2013 - 09:52 AM.

[Ragnar Darkmane]

SgtMagor, on 21 July 2013 - 09:44 AM, said:

Big fat mech, that will have limited arm movement , nerfed ac20's, slow, and it will probably have a torso twist even more limited than a Stalker. What's the point just saying!

Driving something that is unique for a change?

[blacklp]

Another 100 ton mech. Please show me a fast atlas...

[Ozric]

SgtMagor, on 21 July 2013 - 09:44 AM, said:

Big fat mech, that will have limited arm movement , nerfed ac20's, slow, and it will probably have a torso twist even more limited than a Stalker. What's the point just saying!

I think that is the point.


Bring on the King Crab!

[SgtMagor]

ok! got it, but I hope the Crab makes it in too, KC needs a wingman, do I hear a special sale!

Edited by SgtMagor, 21 July 2013 - 01:44 PM.