257 replies to this topic

[Volthorne]

Strum Wealh, on 03 August 2013 - 02:58 PM, said:

While the example shown in the GIF may or may not be load-bearing, the ones used in the NAO's hip assembly (and, as is the point of the discussion, in the hip assemblies of at least some BattleMechs) clearly are both load-bearing and still sufficiently streamlined to maintain the humanoid form.

You know how some things work BECAUSE they're small? Ex. Bugs work because they're small; Upsizing them to be as long as a human is tall would result in their knees being broken and their carapaces being cracked open under the weight of their internal... organs?

That hip assembly works on the NAO because the NAO is relatively light. Upscaling that to be on a 20+ ton machine would mean lots and lots of scrap metal before the 'Mechs even step out of the factory. That, or you super-size it to be able to withstand the burden of the 'Mech and suddenly you've got the classic "need a bigger engine" scenario (you know, the one where your vehicle needs a bigger engine to move, but putting on a bigger engine means it weighs more which results in needing a bigger engine yet again... etc, etc).

[IrrelevantFish]

Trying to make BattleTech realistic is like trying to dissolve Crisco in water. Stop it.

As for why I voted no, it's because it would look silly, be a total pain to implement (just the animating would be nightmarish, not to mention all the bugs and edge cases you'd inevitably run into), and wouldn't do much for gameplay aside from add more buttons to keep track of.

Besides, the only times I've ever wished I could sidestep is when I've parked my giant, metal butt somewhere stupid and didn't bother to point my legs toward somewhere smart, and quite frankly, those are the times when I deserve to get hit.

[blinkin]

i think something like sidestep movement at 25% of your max speed could add to the game.

[Lord of All]

blinkin, on 20 August 2013 - 04:05 PM, said:

i think something like sidestep movement at 25% of your max speed could add to the game.

Bored? not enough action in the p3v for you? Bump dumb necro threads much?

[Tombstoner]

IrrelevantFish, on 04 August 2013 - 12:14 AM, said:

Trying to make BattleTech realistic is like trying to dissolve Crisco in water. Stop it.

interesting challenge. .. BT realistic and crisco in water.... dissolving..... no but i think i would start with heat melt the crisco use pressure cooker if needed, then add in a surfactant and definitely some high rpms.... i bet ya i could get something dispersed into a nice liquid....

Nothing wrong with trying to make SCI FI a bit real. it adds to the immersion factor and for some that's a nice bit of the fun factor.

i'm willing to bet ya i can do both.

[blinkin]

Lord of All, on 20 August 2013 - 04:17 PM, said:

Bored? not enough action in the p3v for you? Bump dumb necro threads much?

someone had already vote bumped it i merely responded.

make moronic accusations much?

Tombstoner, on 20 August 2013 - 04:18 PM, said:

interesting challenge. .. BT realistic and crisco in water.... dissolving..... no but i think i would start with heat melt the crisco use pressure cooker if needed, then add in a surfactant and definitely some high rpms.... i bet ya i could get something dispersed into a nice liquid....

Nothing wrong with trying to make SCI FI a bit real. it adds to the immersion factor and for some that's a nice bit of the fun factor.

i'm willing to bet ya i can do both.

you might be able to homogenize it like they do milk. (any form of milk beyond skim uses a process that mixes the fattier cream that normally floats into the mix.)

Edited by blinkin, 20 August 2013 - 04:26 PM.

[Lord of All]

blinkin, on 20 August 2013 - 04:23 PM, said:

someone had already vote bumped it i merely responded.

make moronic accusations much?

ALL the time when I pissed off!

[Johnny Z]

Not sure, but it is a realistic advantage over treaded movement.

Leaning towards yes.

[Shibas]

Pretty sure mechs already have the ability to strafe; turn torso left or right and keep moving forward -> congrats strafing!

[ShotgunWillie]

Just found this thread, and I get the OP's point. I disagree with it, but I get it. In the novels, mechs make all sorts of movements that they just can't in the games. At one point, a mech actually does a somersault (I think it was Arden Sortek piloting it in Sword and Dagger, but it's been so long since I've read that particular book and that particular act that I may be remembering incorrectly.

I'm pretty sure that in one of the early Grey Death novels (might have even been the first one), a mech that has its legs shot out from under it keeps fighting by laying prone and firing its arm mounted weapons.

There's a Raven pilot in the 17th Recon Regiment (conveniently named Raven, no less), who can make her Raven move around like a real bird, including short hops in all directions.

The reason I don't support the OP's suggestion and have voted "no" in the poll is not that I HATE the suggestion. And it's not because "it's not canon" or because "it's fluff in the canon lore, but since it never made it to TT mechs can't actually do it". It's because of the way it's established as canon. Specifically, all of the extreme movements mechs make in the novels are made either as lucky acts of desperation and never duplicated, or, if they are duplicated, especially with any regularity, it's because they're performed by an elite pilot.

Take Raven's Raven as an example. The 17th Recon Regiment is full of mech jocks with amazing mech piloting skills but mediocre gunnery skills. No one in the 17th other than Raven (the pilot) can make a Raven (the mech) move like Raven (the pilot) can. It's not that she's a better pilot in general than the rest, but she is a better pilot with that mech than the rest of the regiment.

[General Taskeen]

The female pilot that used the Awesome known as "Pretty Baby" from canon could "side-step" her Mech, which is apparently how she avoided LRM volley's as they almost hit her Mech at the last moment.

[Capt Cole 117]

Fierostetz, on 26 July 2013 - 02:04 PM, said:

out of curiosity, why? I'd honestly like to hear various viewpoints on it. It would be handy for scouts, that's for sure. Or even the ability to lean to peek around corners.

Well I voted no because mechs don't move like people, and keeping your legs in the ideal position is part of being a good pilot.

[Marmon Rzohr]

I know this is MW but i still voted yes. I think it would be cool to be able to do one step to each side by double tapping A or D for instance. No MW game had this, but then again, no MW game had melee combat, doesn't mean that's a good thing.

I think it would be more immersive. Your mech could do more things it should be able to do, which would make it feel less like a game with arbitrary limitations, and more like piloting it. It would also add another degree of skill to piloting itself. More amazing maneouvers and close calls, more of a skill contest.

[Clit Beastwood]

I think it's less relevant now that you can just turn on 3pv and see around things :shrug:

[MONEY SHOT]

go play hawken.......

[Clit Beastwood]

Read the prior 6 pages, then edit your post to avoid looking like an *****.

[tucsonspeed6]

No. I think the control scheme would get too confusing. If I'm already circling an enemy the normal way and then hit strafe, do I start walking toward/away from the enemy? And if so, doesn't that negate the whole "Anchor turn" thing? I mean, part of the strategy is making sure you're not pointed in the wrong direction when a baddie shows up. There have been many times when I've been caught looking in the wrong direction and take a lot of damage while slowly turning to get behind cover. If you took that away, it wouldn't be the same game.

[Johnny Z]

Although voted not sure and leaning towards yes, it could be mostly cosmetic in nature, maybe ment for drop ship loading navigation and so on.

[ICUBurn]

the only mech in TT than can side step are quads. and theyve already stated that they arent puting quads in game. its a shame they arent. but give em 3 months and they might say mabe give em 6 and they may say were looking into it give em 9 and its gonna be were working on it and a year from now it will be surprise some poorly implements and ruind quad mech.

[TheBossHammer]

Fierostetz, on 26 July 2013 - 01:54 PM, said:

[edit: when I say side-step or strafe, I'm talking about 1-2 steps, not running around sideways. I don't know if I can edit the thread title, so, sorry. I believe that, though I clarified this point in a subsequent post, since nobody reads anything before replying, this message is best placed at the beginning of the first post. Again, sidestepping, as in someone throws a baseball at you and you can step out of the way. Not talking about running around sideways, that's accomplished with torso twist. This is, while stationary, taking a single shuffling step to the side, ideally as a perk to help mediums survive a little better. They're too lightly armored to take some of the high alphas, but not fast enough to get out of the way. I don't have any issues maneuvering, I simply see it as a "perk" for an underplayed class that could perhaps bring more of them back onto the field.]






They've got legs, no reason the mechs shouldn't be able to dodge sideways. I know it's not part of the movement mechanic at this time, but I think it'd do a great job of further mitigating snipers. True, sniper to sniper combat would still be a pair of mechs 2-steppin' 1200m apart, but other than that, lighter mechs could better dodge high alphas. Fat mech = slow sidestep, faster mech = faster sidestep. Thoughts?

Also, it really wouldn't hurt to let humanoid mechs either crouch or go down on one knee...

Sorry bud, half the point of mechwarrior is that your mech can't hop to the side. It prevents shenanigans like the "flutterstep" from Mechassault 2, which allowed players to dodge like 90% of incoming fire if they were good.