230 replies to this topic

[Psikez]

So as far as its worded...anything doing 10 or more damage will still be vastly superior to any kind of crit seeking weapon? Given most things have 10 HP...

[DisasterMedic]

Because this was edited in to a post on the first page, and a lot of people may have missed that:

Edited by DisasterMedic, 30 July 2013 - 02:13 PM.

[FiveDigits]

Quote

Feedback can go here.

-Paul Inouye

"... I don't care anyways. I'll stay here on my island and wait for the noise generated by my heat neutral Three Second Jenner to die down."

[BlueSanta]

Paul, in your ever increasing silly heat scale, could you at least up the LL number to 3 or 4 instead of 2? I don't believe that lasers should be on that table at all, but if you insist on that, you should allow a good number of them because it is almost impossible to hold multiple beams on a single body part for their full duration against a moving target.

Glad to see a heat increase to PPC and decrease to ERLL. Could you also consider a reduction to LPL?

Beam duration reduction for pulse lasers makes them more attractive, but why not apply to SPL as well?

Please increase all 90m maximum ranges to 120m, at least.

[Suri Curume]

Arbalister, on 30 July 2013 - 12:37 PM, said:

This beta test stopped being about actually testing changes the moment they transitioned to open beta. Now it's not about a dedicated group of people welcoming changes, testing them, and providing feedback. Now it's all about criticizing every single change even before they are implemented. That's not testing.

It's not testing because we're not given anything to test. I'm saying what should be done. There is still just as much whining now as there would be if they had changed values every week. There is going to be whining either way, but imagine if there were whining AND stuff was getting done.

The difference is, right now, they are using their internal test team to take 4 months to revert a change to PPCs. 1 value. That internal test team could have been dedicated to helping with testing and fine tuning gameplay mechanics changes. While we could be playing with the numbers.

Remember when they did this whole spiel about raising SRM damage to 2.5 would be game breaking. We could have done that legwork for them. We could have said, "Man, 2.5 damage is nuts! Drop it to 2.0." Then the next round begins. What if 2.0 damage is too little still or has become too much. How much longer will it take for their internal team to figure it out? How long did it take us to find the OMGBROKENOP PPC/Gauss combo after they implement HSR? They could have gone through countless iterations of heat values and projectile speeds and everything. We could have been done with the "PPC issue" a long time ago, or at the very least, a whole lot closer to the solution.

I understand that they are a small company. But they do have a major asset. The MechWarrior IP brought a lot of people to them. They should be USING us. Give us the aggressive changes and let us show you how we'd break the game. Hell, people who are bored with the stagnant gameplay options would at least be able to log in and see "What's broken in a funny way this week?" and enjoy making crazed builds that should never work. That would keep a lot of the momentum going through the beta and lead us into launch.

Supposedly, this is still beta. This is the time to break the game. This is the time to fiddle with the numbers wildly, because after "launch", such wild changes will be beyond unacceptable. You think the whining is bad now? Imagine what it will look like when people are handed this game in September and are told it's complete.

They have a basic game that has great potential to be fun. I just want them to let us help them. Please, I love this game. PGI, let us help you.

[Corvus Antaka]

Please clarify what you mean about the % chance on internals and if this means mechs will die faster...what is going on here.

[Deathlike]

Here is my worst case scenario (in my mind) about what Paul means about the extra damage:
http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__2605596

I assume it is meant to buff MGs, Flamers, and LBX.. in the sense that most that have argued against the crit system state that blowing out the entire section is far more valuable. Even if the target is not using an XL engine, removing the arm weaponry from an Atlas by blowing out a side torso is a lot more viable and valuable.

I'm thinking that a portion of the damage to an exposed section will INCREASE more damage to that section when the components are blown out. Since weapons like MGs, Flamers, and LBX have more chance to crit, this will allow the aforementioned issue to "be resolved". However, if it is not limited to those three weapons, weapons of high destruction (PPCs, AC10s, AC20s... anything that can one shot a component in the section, like DHS) will further magnify in damage occasionally. This means that 3 PPCs to a torso section could deal MORE than 30 pts of damage. This is very undesirable.

Edited by Deathlike, 30 July 2013 - 03:16 PM.

[Huntsman]

Everything else looks ok save for the pulse laser changes which are but a single step away from meaningless compared to what really needs to happen to make the weapons viable, particularly regarding the LPLs.

I hope this isn't the extent of what they intend for pulse lasers because if so, the devs are clearly out of the loop on the enormity of what needs to happen to salvage these two weapons.

Edited by Huntsman, 30 July 2013 - 03:27 PM.

[BR0WN_H0RN3T]

Excellent balance suggestions. I support the proposed changes. Just be careful how much u reduce the beam duration of MPLs. For 2T they r pretty much ok where they are. Now, pls consider removing armlock or reducing convergence speed and we should be on par.

Edited by Brown Hornet, 30 July 2013 - 03:44 PM.

[Salient]

The higher the heat, the more cool shots they can sell!

[Thuzel]

I'm really starting to wonder what "aggressive" means to PGI.

Seriously, game balance is in shambles right now and we're about 7 weeks from release. 7 weeks. 7 freaking weeks. We need to see changes like this every other day, not a couple of times a month. What the heck is going on over there anyway? All of my friends imagine a lot of beer pong and fussball, and as much as I'd love to argue otherwise I can not.

By the way, that's not even considering the fact that there are at least 4 major features that are supposed to be rolled out before release. Not that anyone really believes that will happen, but this game desperately needs new features. Glorified deathmatch got old 8 months ago. Now its just equivalent to Vogon poetry.

PGI, if you've never listened to anything I've said, please listen to just this one thing:

STEP IT UP.

[Pyrrho]

Comic Sans is OP.

[FupDup]

Pyrrho, on 30 July 2013 - 04:14 PM, said:

Comic Sans is OP.

It needs a max alpha of just 1. 2 would be allow for too much pinpoint damage.

[Dark Ally]

Horrace, on 30 July 2013 - 03:52 PM, said:

You have 8 players per team, soon to be 12 which should be awesome. I don't understand how people think the game is unbalanced, everybody can fit ppc's, er ppc's or gauss rifles and if you try wandering around on your own or look around a corner and get shot, it's your own fault.

You need to take it slow and get a good sniper spot, if you have any lights on your team they should be communicating the best places to setup and snipe from.

I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not, I hope you are. Because what you said pretty much sounds like that any mech other than lights should not get within like 600 meters from another. So if you are serious why even bother with other weapons, should just call this Mech Snipers Online and remove anything that has a range of less than 600m. .

[Wintersdark]

Dark Ally, on 30 July 2013 - 04:46 PM, said:

I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not, I hope you are. Because what you said pretty much sounds like that any mech other than lights should not get within like 600 meters from another. So if you are serious why even bother with other weapons, should just call this Mech Snipers Online and remove anything that has a range of less than 600m. .

Comic Sans is - or should be anyways - the sarcasm font.

[Lyoto Machida]

Horrace, on 30 July 2013 - 03:52 PM, said:

You have 8 players per team, soon to be 12 which should be awesome. I don't understand how people think the game is unbalanced, everybody can fit ppc's, er ppc's or gauss rifles and if you try wandering around on your own or look around a corner and get shot, it's your own fault.

You need to take it slow and get a good sniper spot, if you have any lights on your team they should be communicating the best places to setup and snipe from.

[Znail]

PPCs aren't the problem as it's obvious that they will be common with the current mech line ups. There is fairly limited number of ballistic slots on mechs and that means that Energy is the weapon system that most have to use as main weapon system. Then LL was pretty much killed as alternative with the way the heat scaling works. Thus leaving PPCs as the only functional large energy weapon.

The problem with the heat scaling is fairly obvious if you look at the following example of using either 6 LL or 6 PPCs. You can fire 6 Large Lasers, keeping your aim at a location for 1 second and do 54 damage to that location while getting 72 heat or you can stagger fire 2 PPCs at a time with 0.5 seconds in between to get 60 damage and 54 heat. Both options will deal it's damage over the time of 1 seconds, but one is clearly supperior to the other. Now I am aware that the PPCs will weight more, but that is far from balancing out the diffrence.

Lasers comes with a large oppertunity cost as you have to hold your aim at the target for a while and thus naturally favors boating in some form to make sure that the time spent aiming have some noticable effect. The duration also means that Lasers already have a built in counter to pinpoint damage and the heat scaling was not needed for them. If you want less PPCs on the field, then Large Lasers needs to be viable as alternative and they wont be that as long as they are affected by the heat scaling.

[aseth]

I finally got to play my first match in Terra Therma. Really awesome looking map.

I have one problem though - I know you're planning for 12v12, but that map is too damn big. We ran around for several minutes just trying to find the other team.

Please make another version of the map that's like one quarter the size, and I'll love you forever.

[Asmosis]

Thorqemada, on 30 July 2013 - 10:41 AM, said:

"A % of critical damage done to the internals of a component will be applied directly to the inner structure of that component."

Scratches Head and looks confused...

Seems pretty straight forward. Whenever you deal a critical hit currently (against weapons, heat sinks, engine etc) you deal ZERO damage to the actual structure in say, CT.

what that means is that MG's deal piddly damage to real structure, but this is a big buff to them depending on what the % transfer is.

So, what % are we talking about here?

[Warge]

For Pulse Lasers would be enough to reduce shot from 3 pulses to 2 pulses, imho.