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3Rd Person View Feedback


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#681 B0oN

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:32 PM

Spoiler


Gotcha for good, fellas ...
You guys at PGIGP rather get that so called "HARDCORE" server queues running asap ( meaning: NOW)
or you are going to lose another customer that WILL get every €-cent invested into this back on his way out and thinking about filing a lawsuit for time invested and emotional damage.

I´m pissed off and sick of getting lied to the face, in fact so sick and pissed off I´m not even gonna get creative in regards to swearwords.

This is a threat, served in icecold anger to you, MOVE IT.
N O W !

#682 repete

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:32 PM

View PostCael Voltek, on 20 August 2013 - 12:42 PM, said:

And really, when ~.011% of the community is complaining, PGI should take notice,


Let me give an example from my perceptive:

I have gone from a series of tweets one week ago telling friends why they should play MWO instead of Hawken, to now telling those same people I've left MWO and they shouldn't consider it. I hope PGI enjoys whatever this debacle brings them.

#683 Desdain

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:32 PM

View PostIhasa, on 20 August 2013 - 03:26 PM, said:

With this move, PGI has finally become worse than Cryptic Studios.

QFT.

I'm beginning to wonder if Bill Roper is at PGI now.

#684 Homeless Bill

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:33 PM

View Postetnycs, on 20 August 2013 - 06:29 PM, said:

You added in an aimbot with 3rd person!!! Everyone is a perfect shot. Btw who the heck wanted a 3rd person view on a FPS anyway? Unfortunately i am out on a game i was playing pretty much every day until you guys take that aimbot out.

It's not an aimbot. It's because when the targeting ray goes out directly from your viewpoint, it doesn't look like it's moving, but it is. It's getting closer and farther away based on what you're looking at.

In 3PV, the ray still goes directly out from the cockpit - not your view. It looks like it's snapping on targets, but it's not doing what you think it is.

#685 Corwin Maxwell

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:33 PM

this pretty much sums up all the white knights and pgi



#686 Butane9000

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:34 PM

This is Paul's response:

Addendum to Bryan's Post:

I've seen the screencap of the spider at the top of River City. I want to say thanks for finding a bug. If you go up there, you can tell it's a bug. If you look up slightly, or to the left or right slightly, the camera crashes back in and you can't see much at all.

To recreate, take a Spider in River City - Training Grounds. Get to that spot and jam your face directly into that corner (still doesn't happen yet). Now look down as far as the Spider can look. Bam! It happens. The raytrace for the camera is breaking through that particular spot in geometry. We are having an engineer look into why this is happening. Again. While there, look away in any direction just SLIGHTLY and the camera returns to the position it's supposed to be in. Very nice bug find and as mentioned, we will look into what's causing this.

My response:

Even if it's a bug that's exactly how 3PV is supposed to work. It gives you an advantage. I took a picture and I could see around a corner in 3PV when in 1PV I could not. Now you kind of balance it with the loss of the minimap but the serious issue at hand is the fact that you explicitly stated that we'd NEVER have to play with people who use 3PV. You did not deliver on that statement and you took our money. Now you're saying you're looking for a solution. The solution is to stand by your word and implement separate ques.

Also this raises the concern of why didn't you separate the ques? Do you not have enough players? Because that's the fastest and most probably conclusion just about everyone has come to. You're meager responses aren't helping things either.

#687 Lugh

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:38 PM

View PostHomeless Bill, on 20 August 2013 - 06:33 PM, said:

It's not an aimbot. It's because when the targeting ray goes out directly from your viewpoint, it doesn't look like it's moving, but it is. It's getting closer and farther away based on what you're looking at.

In 3PV, the ray still goes directly out from the cockpit - not your view. It looks like it's snapping on targets, but it's not doing what you think it is.

Tell that to my perfectly converged lasers ...

Quote

"Addendum to Bryan's Post:

I've seen the screencap of the spider at the top of River City. I want to say thanks for finding a bug. If you go up there, you can tell it's a bug. If you look up slightly, or to the left or right slightly, the camera crashes back in and you can't see much at all.

To recreate, take a Spider in River City - Training Grounds. Get to that spot and jam your face directly into that corner (still doesn't happen yet). Now look down as far as the Spider can look. Bam! It happens. The raytrace for the camera is breaking through that particular spot in geometry. We are having an engineer look into why this is happening. Again. While there, look away in any direction just SLIGHTLY and the camera returns to the position it's supposed to be in. Very nice bug find and as mentioned, we will look into what's causing this."


The spectacularly funny thought that occurs to me is this bug wouldn't need investigation if you HADN'T WASTED TIME IMPLEMENTING A FEATURE NO ONE WANTED. (Oh sorry, 143 of of 7200 or so in a poll right here wanted it but .2% of your playerbase is clearly a majority)

#688 Fetladral

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:39 PM

Eaither get rid of third person, seperate the queues, or at least make it so you can't switch between the views in the middile of a match. Maybe everyone who does go to the launch party for that tourney should not play in 3rd person ever.

Edited by Fetladral, 20 August 2013 - 06:43 PM.


#689 N0MAD

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:39 PM

All in all this patch seems a great addition to the game right? It will enhance PGIs reputation no end.
As my friend suggested this will be great news to the gaming community (the silent majority).
He is so pleased he is going to link this thread (announcement and feedback) to every game review site he knows and point it to game magazines etc.
It will be a great way to advertise PGI and MWO to the gaming community world wide.
Perhaps some of you may want to help him out, show your appreciation to the work PGI is doing.
I myself wont participate as i haven't played in many months and this patch has not done anything that will change that.
GL.

#690 UberPotato

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:40 PM

Ok, I will say that visually 3rd person is neat. Realistically, people mainly want it to exploit it by being able to look around corners they would not be able so see around normally. So you say it is a drone giving them the ability to do so? Ok, let the enemies see the drone. Hell, let the enemies be able to shoot the drone down and kill their vision. Who can complain? They got the view they so desired, but they better be careful or they will lose it.

#691 Antagonist

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:41 PM

View PostVictor Morson, on 20 August 2013 - 06:27 PM, said:


Because clearly, 3rd person view was the way to handle this instead of.. oh, I don't know.. adding a little 'mech facing / legs facing set of icons to the HUD or cockpit screens?

You know, something that'd actually be helpful to graphically depict to new people which thing is pointed where, instead of a 3rd person view that you can't even see your legs in.



This amazes me. I mean, how do these people do it when they play Battlefield 3? IMO one would have to be lobotomized not to figure out torso/leg facing in the first 30 seconds of playing the game.

That said, I'll give 3PV the benefit of the doubt until I've tested it. I haven't played in a while, first because of the emergent PPC/sniper meta, then because the heat hack broke my suspension of disbelief when there were several proposals how to go about balancing weapons made by the community.

Now? Let's just say if it really is as stupid as I suspect it is you might see me again in 2014. Then again, X Rebirth and around three other games that are bound to have better and more immersive gameplay than the current iteration of MWO.

#692 repete

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:44 PM

View PostVorpralmar, on 20 August 2013 - 01:06 PM, said:

THIS IS A ALL CALL BOYCOTT not a dime should be spent untill they provide us with what they promised us


#goodbyemwo

...Make it trend and CC @Paul_Inouye @russ_bullock @pgi_thegarth @bryanekman @mechwarriorf2p @infinitegamespub so they get the message.

Edited by repete, 20 August 2013 - 08:50 PM.


#693 Tribe

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:44 PM

Okay...First: Thanks for starting to work on this! Means a lot to those of us that have enjoyed it in past games!

But:

What those of us who really wanted a 3rd person view wanted was a free-cam view like what nearly every 3rd person mode has been in most games that have come out w/ the option have.

What has been implemented needs a bit of work. Here's a few issues.

1) The Z axis arm articulation doesn't seem to work.
2) The targeting retical jumping along it's own Y axis at really sharp intervals due largely to the Z axis locked drone/cam (an x axis off-set would greatly help in perceiving the depth of field for objects in relation to current retical position).
3) Drone/cam zoom options aren't in at all it seems.
4) The targeting retical shows no indication of arm/torso mounted weapons LOS loss in relation to targeted object.
5) free-look does not work.
6) HUD is gone (really?).
7) Even with the option to Que matches that don't have the 3rd PPOV enabled, Those of us that have been pushing for this option, now feel like its a useless implementation of it. This is broken. It feels more like a punishment/half-measure rather then a full bodied, robust system.



Thanks again.

#694 Bernard Matthaios

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:45 PM

Well just played a few matches and... 3PV actually helps me with my inability at jump jets and understanding some maps better. I also like seeing my camo lol. However I'm only gonna use it as a training tool for testing grounds.

I don't care if it shouldn't be in the game because other MW titles had it. I'm not a fan of it personally just because I lose too much info. Also my piloting "feel" is lost. I think this is the best version of 3PV because there are disadvantages to it...

1) Aiming is more difficult. The cross hair jumps around when moving, and my mech sometimes gets in the way.
2) Arms are locked. Disadvantage to mechs that have arms.
3) Loss of mini map, such a valuable information tool, and no, I don't use seismic.
4) Missing lance Info. I don't know where my lance is, if they are hurt and need assistance, or dead.

The disadvantages above should stay. It feels like I'm looking through a drones perspective. In fact make the drone light brighter! or add a buzzing sound to it. Increase the fade in/out of 3PV. Give it a static effect of turning a old monitor or TV on.


There was a video in another post about how 3rd person view shouldn't be in games. The ending line of the video is perfect. "If I can see you, you can see me" and that is how 3PV should be. The red light on the drone IMO achieves this. It just says "I'm here".

Edited by Bernard Matthaios, 20 August 2013 - 06:47 PM.


#695 ManDaisy

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:47 PM

Exploiting 3rd person so much right now in my commando. Hill humping, especially on frozen city.... laser dodging... pff. So EASY!

#696 Cael Voltek

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:48 PM

View PostRad Hanzo, on 20 August 2013 - 06:32 PM, said:

Spoiler


Gotcha for good, fellas ...
You guys at PGIGP rather get that so called "HARDCORE" server queues running asap ( meaning: NOW)
or you are going to lose another customer that WILL get every €-cent invested into this back on his way out and thinking about filing a lawsuit for time invested and emotional damage.

I´m pissed off and sick of getting lied to the face, in fact so sick and pissed off I´m not even gonna get creative in regards to swearwords.

This is a threat, served in icecold anger to you, MOVE IT.
N O W !


Would someone from PGI please start wielding a ban hammer around here? This is getting so far out of hand it's becoming comical. I've always wondered just how thick and chunky the Brown Sea as become, and I think this answers it.

#697 Wolfaith

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:49 PM

Ive bin playing this game and now you go and make it 3rd person and say there's no advantage with 3rd are you kidding me !!! Put your first person back and stop trying to appeal to the kids that play something easy. If you don't put in a 1st person option only in I will be requesting a full refund.

#698 repete

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:49 PM

View PostNicholas Carlyle, on 20 August 2013 - 01:35 PM, said:

Are you really surprised? This is why I didn't purchase the Phoenix Package.


I love how this comes out AFTER the closing date for the Phoenix early bird. Almost like it was planned or something.

#699 Homeless Bill

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:49 PM

View PostTribe, on 20 August 2013 - 06:44 PM, said:

Okay...First: Thanks for starting to work on this! Means a lot to those of us that have enjoyed it in past games!

But:

What those of us who really wanted a 3rd person view wanted was a free-cam view like what nearly every 3rd person mode has been in most games that have come out w/ the option have.

What has been implemented needs a bit of work. Here's a few issues.

1) The Z axis arm articulation doesn't seem to work.
2) The targeting retical jumping along it's own Y axis at really sharp intervals due largely to the Z axis locked drone/cam (an x axis off-set would greatly help in perceiving the depth of field for objects in relation to current retical position).
3) Drone/cam zoom options aren't in at all it seems.
4) The targeting retical shows no indication of arm/torso mounted weapons LOS loss in relation to targeted object.
5) free-look does not work.
6) HUD is gone (really?).
7) Even with the option to Que matches that don't have the 3rd PPOV enabled, Those of us that have been pushing for this option, now feel like its a useless implementation of it. This is broken. It feels more like a punishment/half-measure rather then a full bodied, robust system.



Thanks again.

Pretty much everything you said there is working as intended. You'll be delighted to know that you don't get the robust implementation of 3PV you want because they're trying to please the anti-3PV half of the playerbase by giving 3PV various disadvantages (forced arm lock, no free look, lack of HUD info, etc.).

In reality, their implementation only serves to gimp new players by having the camera too high to see legs and the lack of a map. It also ****** off the rest of us, because 3PV still offers massive advantages that many of us don't want to play with or against.

#700 White Panther

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:52 PM

Posted Image I can see everyone and line up my shot without them even being able to see me

Edited by White Panther, 20 August 2013 - 06:53 PM.






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