1105 replies to this topic

[Pezzer]

dangerzone, on 27 August 2013 - 02:46 PM, said:

I know people are upset about them saying they would not add 3PV. Most of us are. Nobody likes being told one thing and then something else happens. However, as they said, this game is forever changing. Give it a month or two. I wouldn't be surpised if in that time 3PV gets updated or we get 1PV games (Hardcore). The queue option for Hardcore is in game, just not active. That right there tells you they will probably add it in at somepoint. They could be waiting for launch. You never know.

PGI does understand that we are not a community to be trifled with. If we feel we have been wronged, we are very sure to let them know. Perhaps if we all didn't claim the game is dead or how PGI and IGP ruined X and Y or even how the game is screwed or insult them, perhaps they could read these topics and get the good out of them. Rather than insult them and QQ, have you ever thought to make topics VOICING your opinions and ideas? There is a subforum for suggestions for a reason. Just because they may not respond to your topic does not mean they did not read it or do not care. If enough people make the same suggestion on something with GOOD reasons as to why it should be changed, I'm pretty sure PGI will get the message.

People have provided amazing suggestions in the past, are still doing so, and will ALWAYS do so. Problem is, the PGI staff never listen. No matter how many people like a post, or post the same rational threads about the same thing being implemented into the game, the never seem to respond or even acknowledge the idea. They only seem to listen to forum rage, sadly enough...if they listen at all. That's how we've gotten to this point in the game.
Noone listen to the Stat Warriors, or Homeless Bill's amazing intellectual pursuits into the game's balance, or any post that is more than 4 or 5 paragraphs long tbh. Someone can write an EFFING ESSAY ON HERE, backed by FACTS and NUMBERS, and you know who reads it? You know who listens? Only the community, if they don't just say TL;DR like an immature kid. Never PGI.

That's why I say, you are wrong sir. I admire your desire to defend the game, and I wish I could feel the same way, but you are utterly wrong. It's true that people could QQ less, be nicer people, etc., but they could be MUCH worse. Just go over to the Steam forums and you'll see. In comparison to many other forums, this is a very nice community, actually. And people would be nicer if PGI didn't give them so MANY reasons to complain, I assure you. I was there in Closed Beta, back when even the noobs loved MWO simply because it was amazing and everything but LRMs was balanced/super playable and fair, etc.
People wouldn't be so ragey if there wasn't a reason for it. People are demanding change, and PGI just keeps saying "What's that? Could hear you over the mute community! Oh, and all this money!!!". Ofc they are gonna be mad.

[Zolaz]

Summary of Post: We are doing GREAT!!! The people on the forums dont know what they are talking about. Stuff is in the works and will be coming soon. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

[Chronojam]

EmCeeMendez, on 27 August 2013 - 02:36 PM, said:

I was really happy when disconnect and suicide farmers were cracked down on back in the transition between Closed/Open Beta. Being one or more teammate down tended to lead to a steamroll, and after that pattern became apparent, you had a domino effect after one player suicided. The team would notice, 4 or 5 players would quickly leave because they knew it was going to be a loss, and you were left with 1 or 2 teammates vs 8 enemies.

"If your Mech is destroyed to a roaming band of Jenners early on, you can jump out of that match and into a new one right away – potentially doubling your C-Bills to 1.2 million per hour! This cuts down your time to purchase new Mechs and equipment."

That sounds like official approval to resume suicide farming. The player can now argue, "I wasn't suicide farming PGI! I made a tactical mistake and died early, a Jenner caught me by surprise. I'm just trying to earn 1.2 million C-bills an hour like the average player!"

I hope that is not the case.

There a problem with that?

~*~They changed their position~*~

[Chavette]

Quote

[color=#CCCCCC]There are vocal minorities and silent majorities on all subjects and we always have to balance between these groups. [/color]

How do you know the silents disagree with the vocals if you don't ask them? How do you know if the vocal minority isn't a vocal part of the majority? I'm talking about things unmeasurable by metrics, like features and game mechanics, I don't think there is a metric that helps you evaluate ghost heat for example.

Put a "poll of the day" on the launcher, most won't go out of their way to post here, but they still have an opinion, be it positive or negative. Results can be redacted to prevent drama.

[Kaiser Thermidor]

Disclaimer: I’m mad. Partly because everyone else seems to be mad, and the anger is just going to keep feeding into a cycle. But also because…

This post tells me nothing.
It starts by lying to me: “3PV is a huge success!” No, no it’s not. It’s idiotic. People who like 3PV games don’t like it (I’m one of them). People who like MechWarrior/mech sims don’t like it. New players cannot possibly like it, because in order to maybe show them how to move in the most incredibly roundabout fashion, you’ve gimped them in nearly every other possible manner.

Then it belittles me: “immediate improvement in our target demographic” – Who is this? I thought it was me, a long-time MechWarrior fan willing to pumps literally hundreds of dollars into your game. Maybe I’m misunderstanding. What is an “improvement”? Because I don’t feel improved at all. I’m still seeing Snipelanders, or other PCC/Gauss builds that seem to endeavor to remove any fun to be had in matches where they appear (personal issue, maybe, but it’s shared). I’m still seeing rolf-stomping as the norm in most of my matches, with one team getting creamed, which Elo was supposed to fix (but we all knew it wouldn’t). I’m still not seeing the hot and heavy weapon balancing that was implied at the end of July in your afterthought of a Creative Update. I still don’t feel like you’re trying to communicate with me on an adult level.
The post goes on to talk about things I don’t really care about, and/or already knew: Your charity thing was a success, congrats on that; HSR is getting fixed, yes it’s about time I’m tired of hitting people in the front when I’m shooting their rear CT, it wasn’t like you could get away without doing that. The economy, blah blah blah, this is not EVE I would be hard pressed to care less about it (though those new players you’re trying to attract and retain probably care a great deal).

Then you say something silly. Something very, very, very silly that I am going to jump all over you for. You say, “We’ve seen these type of words frame our messaging in a way that some community members either see this as a promise, or guarantee.”
Now, I want you to go back and read what you posted. It’s right here. I’ll wait.
Did you read what you said? Good. We read it too. You said ‘never’. This is not nitpicking. This is not ‘reading between the lines’, this not ‘framing a message’. This is you telling us we will never have to do something – it doesn’t matter what it is, or how trivial. We are not privy to your internal meetings, or your design documents, or even your goals for the game (which, according to what a lot of Founders are saying, have changed). We have only what you say to go on: that is all we know for certain. You are Word of God for MechWarrior Online. When staff post something, we have no choice but to believe it. When we hold you to the words you wrote, it is not OUR FAULT if you don’t deliver. If you don’t like that, be responsible and make sure you know what is happening before you post something. Now, things change. Most people get that. When things that people feel strongly about don’t match up between what happened and what you said, and you know they feel strongly about it, you had better damn well tell them if you’re changing your minds about something you couched in absolute terms.
Why am I hung up on this? Because I feel like you’re trying to dodge it, and sit back and let it all blow over. I seriously doubt it will, if that is your hope: look how long people have been bitching about ECM.

Okay, that’s out of my system. Maybe I can be constructive for the rest of this post. I don’t know.

Let’s talk about MWO’s beta, for a minute. It’s been Open Beta for over a year now. There’ve been a lot of things pushed back, for whatever reason. People are kinda mad. The game is already stagnating. And something that has bugged me for forever is getting dragged to the fore: your community doesn’t feel involved. I have never once felt like a Beta Tester in this game. I have never felt like the community is shaping PGI’s decisions, not even in terms of weapon balance, which I would think would probably be the most responsive thing. In fact, your game feels done, minus all the missing features that are promised.
I’m going to do something silly, now: I’m going to compare this game to Warframe. Warframe is also being developed by a small developer. It, too, is Free to Play. Their community feels a lot more listened to. The developers feel very much in-touch: they answer PMs, they have a community manager who regularly goes around and gathers feedback into bi-weekly hot topics that addresses the community’s concerns. They involve the community directly with game design, asking our opinions on X, or seeking solutions on Y. Their game feels a lot rougher than MWO; you can tell it’s under development and they are feeling their way through it.

MWO on the other hand, feels… mostly finished. You’ve got some bugs in the system, but they are within the realm of what I’d expect to see in a recently shipped title. You seem loathe to throw weapon balance out of whack with experimentation. In fact, you seem to have a very rigid idea of how you want to do this game. You’ve been introducing new systems into play, like Ghost Heat and the new(ish) mech movement, but the former aside, they seem like a pre-planned feature and were slotted in as they were done.
In other words, this feels like Early Access, not Beta. Personally, I would blame this on how remote PGI seems to be. I can go days without an Announcement, months between Command Chair posts. This latest shitstorm is the most activity I’ve seen out of PGI on their own forums in months. It’s far too late to say this now, since Beta is ending in what feels like moments, but in the future, I’d suggest more direct links between the gamers and the game-makers.

I’ll finish with: yeah, I’m mad about 3PV, but not because 3PV sucks or because I have to play with it. I’m mad because you’ve had 8 months since I first mentioned it to get a REAL New Player Experience in here and there’s been little headway. The same {s}crappy Trial Mech system is here, New Players are still getting zero instruction on mech piloting, the MechLab/Frontend UI is still a first draft (but at least that is changing, I’m thankful for that), and there is still no teamwork on these teams beyond my pre-made lance (i.e. voice coms). Honestly, your existing playerbase HAS to be bringing in all their friends, because if I didn’t know anything about MechWarrior, and I took my first step in your game as it is, I’d likely quit after the third match. I would have no idea what I’m doing. And it feels like you are killing your game when you don’t address the issue properly and use this gimped 3PV instead.

And that’s it, I’m done. I’ve got more to say, but it’s just retreading what others have said, and if it hasn’t sunk in by now, it’s not going to. Sorry I got belligerent, but that’s what I feel on the matter and I might as well throw my opinion on the matter around while I’ve got the chance.

[Kunae]

Chronojam, on 27 August 2013 - 03:15 PM, said:

There a problem with that?

~*~They changed their position~*~

Yep... to this:

Druidika, on 27 August 2013 - 03:02 PM, said:

[Mr Rulle]

If it was possible i would demand my money back from the purchases ive done but it wont work.
Had the game been in the state it is now back then when i was tipped by one of your big founders i wouldnt given it much more then the install time and no! money thats for sure.
Havent started the game for a few weeks now and i have no interest of doing it in the future, you sir can keep this sorry looking heap of simplified mw2 "mech" game for dummies.
You should be ashamed for crossing your founders the way you have.
Lets hope people remember the company name and employes when their next project starts.
Im sure that there wont be any founders for that.

/"silent minority"

Edited by Mr Rulle, 27 August 2013 - 03:23 PM.

[Kunae]

Mr Rulle, on 27 August 2013 - 03:22 PM, said:

If it was possible i would demand my money back from the purchases ive done but it wont work.
Had the game been in the state it is now back then when i was tipped by one of your big founders i wouldnt given it much more then the install time and no! money thats for sure.
Havent started the game for a few weeks now and i have no interest of doing it in the future, you sir can keep this sorry looking heap of simplified mw2 "mech" game for dummies.
You should be ashamed for crossing your founders the way you have.
Lets hope people remember the company name and employes when their next project starts.
Im sure that there wont be any founders for that.

/"silent minority"

It is still "Beta", by their own statements, even the banner at the top of the website.

You can ask for a full refund of all of your "pre-orders", as the game hasn't "launched" yet.

Just because they let you use your pre-orders during the beta-test, doesn't mean they've actually "delivered" them yet. You were just testing.

Edited by Kunae, 27 August 2013 - 03:25 PM.

[ChargerIIC]

So bottom line:

Does our opinion matter or not?

[Oderint dum Metuant]

ChargerIIC, on 27 August 2013 - 03:25 PM, said:

So bottom line:

Does our opinion matter or not?

You still have to ask?

No obviously it doesn't.

They have your founders money, your no longer relevant.

[CG Oglethorpe Kerensky]

Is it just me or can I sum up this entire post by just saying...

"If you get blown up change mechs and launch a new match, we are doing stuff, stop being mean."

[matux]

ChargerIIC, on 27 August 2013 - 03:25 PM, said:

So bottom line:

Does our opinion matter or not?

It hasn't for a long long time.

[Mr Rulle]

ChargerIIC, on 27 August 2013 - 03:25 PM, said:

So bottom line:

Does our opinion matter or not?

Is this something you are unsure of?
Clearly not.

[Ryvucz]

I'm sticking around, can't wait to see UI 2.0.

I was hoping it would be tossed out today.

[Chemie]

Always nice to hear we are not their target demographic. Funny...I thought by definition founders were the target demo.

Can someone explain why they need to pay less because there are more players? Shouldn't per player be the same? They seem to think rewards should be per game (split 24 ways now instead of 16) vs per player. Weird.

This whole post is twilight zone. There is no way they can tell they are getting better new player retention in 1 week...just how quickly did people quit before? And lower CB will kick in after 25 games and then....

Edited by Chemie, 27 August 2013 - 03:34 PM.

[Bhael Fire]

I won't pretend to like many of the design choices implemented in the last few patches, but I will admit that I have been a little hot-tempered about it in some of my posts lately. For that, I apologize.

Think I'll just step back from a lot of the controversial topics until things get sorted out.

[CG Oglethorpe Kerensky]

Ryvucz, on 27 August 2013 - 03:28 PM, said:

I'm sticking around, can't wait to see UI 2.0.

I was hoping it would be tossed out today.

You just keep following that carrot, I am sure you will get it sometime.

[Mr Rulle]

Ryvucz, on 27 August 2013 - 03:28 PM, said:

I'm sticking around, can't wait to see UI 2.0.

I was hoping it would be tossed out today.

"But do not trust to hope. It has forsaken these lands" movie quote that fits perfectly.

[Chronojam]

Ryvucz, on 27 August 2013 - 03:28 PM, said:

I'm sticking around, can't wait to see UI 2.0.

I was hoping it would be tossed out today.

See that yellow badge below your name? Because it means you got tossed out today.

[Nauht]

Why don't I believe a word you say Brian?