833 replies to this topic

[mack sabbath]

Russ says they're "looking at UAC/5's." They start butchering the remaining ballistic options, I'm pulling the plug I fear.

[TheSteelRhino]

I guess what i dont get here is what is wrong with autocannons and large lasers? I am a very old tabletop player and most of the weapons damage, heat values are pretty close to tabletop (with solaris rules for heat)

I thinks it is closer to TT than it has been in a long time. Not sure how this is bad for old school players. And i've played all the MW and battletech game titles (except mechassault and mech commander). My first tech readout was 3025 and i remember 3039, 3050, etc....

If your builds no longer work I would suggest getting back to a "near stock" loadout and redesigning. No I dont mean remove your double heat sinks, endo, etc. Try something a little different. (Chain fire). I am sorry but th ppc/erppc/gauss meta was not even CLOSE to battletech. Inner sphere combat has alway been short range and brutal. This is not the clans
There were very few mechs with 2 ppc'c. (Marauder, whammy, thug come to mind). And the awesome with 3 was a big deal and alpha striking was rare due to overheating. Gauss charge fits lore and while i don't love it at least it stops that 1 shot kill meta garbage. With weight limits medium mechs might even be viable. This makes heavy and assaults even more valuable assets and not the "base requirement" for most players to even contribute. I am sorry this game has long favored heavy metal (no not the highlander only)on the field.

As far as the game changing they have always maintained it is Beta and this is part of life in a Beta. They can and will change stuff. PGI (or any dev) decides when Beta is over, not the players. It even says Beta in the upper left corner of the screen.

And if you argue "they took my money"...you gonna donate to a kickstarter lime Star Citizen and tell them its not an Alpha or Beta because you donated?

I for one am looking forward to this. I am sorry for those that are not, but personally I have been a long suffering medium pilot so it is about time.

Edited by Rhinehardt Ritter, 04 September 2013 - 01:18 PM.

[WarHippy]

Fenris, on 04 September 2013 - 11:22 AM, said:

PPC heat and speed is back to normal so large lasers, ac10, ac5, ... all viable once again :-). Gauss is tricky to use but cooler once you get it done. Zoom is friggin' WORKING after.. ah well.. it is working :-)

Sorry, but this is a silly statement to me. They didn't do anything to large lasers, ac10, ac5 so if they are viable now, then they were viable before. Perhaps they were overshadowed and this lead to people thinking they were not viable, but it could just be that they are now perceived as being viable since other weapons have now been made less viable.

[Mechsniper]

Again, if you want TT values, cut the current armor in half please. There is no excuse at all for the gauss mechanic, it is horrible and ruins every gauss armed mech in the game for multiple reasons. You put a gauss in the arm of a highlander or victor so you can use it during a brawl, which requires a weapon able to fire instantly. Now it does not. GENIUS! They are worthless in that spot now. Wanna snipe in a map with cover. Tooo bad!!!! I will just pop in and out of cover with mediums, alpha you with the overheat PPC and hide before you are charged. GENIUS! I am close to stopping charges on the Pheonix package. The sad thing is I actually logged in to the site yesterday to buy the reinforcement package on top of the Overlord and find this B*S. The square kick in the pants to all guys running any PPC or gauss mechs is that they fix the Long range zoom ( of which I bought 3 of before trying waaay back in closed beta). So many lies, so little leadership, and no clue about Mechwarriors history or past games(which is why most guys are here, NOT because of the Tabletop game, sorry fan*boys).

[TheSteelRhino]

Mechsniper, on 04 September 2013 - 01:16 PM, said:

Again, if you want TT values, cut the current armor in half please. There is no excuse at all for the gauss mechanic, it is horrible and ruins every gauss armed mech in the game for multiple reasons. You put a gauss in the arm of a highlander or victor so you can use it during a brawl, which requires a weapon able to fire instantly. Now it does not. GENIUS! They are worthless in that spot now. Wanna snipe in a map with cover. Tooo bad!!!! I will just pop in and out of cover with mediums, alpha you with the overheat PPC and hide before you are charged. GENIUS! I am close to stopping charges on the Pheonix package. The sad thing is I actually logged in to the site yesterday to buy the reinforcement package on top of the Overlord and find this B*S. The square kick in the pants to all guys running any PPC or gauss mechs is that they fix the Long range zoom ( of which I bought 3 of before trying waaay back in closed beta). So many lies, so little leadership, and no clue about Mechwarriors history or past games(which is why most guys are here, NOT because of the Tabletop game, sorry fan*boys).

I am an old TT and an old MW gamer. So. I can tell you that in TT the gauss had a minimum range as did the regular ppc. And this game is a lot closer to TT than mechwarrior 4 was. And if you ever paid attn to PGI's early commentary I think it is safe to say this was always the intent.

I personally am glad to see this because it will hopefully lead to less overspecialization in chassis's and will make something besides the gauss/erppc (and I like both weapons) dominan in 12 man drops. Perhaps give it a chance before ranting about it? I realize that sniping is probably your "thing" based off your name..... But what do you plan to do when weight restrictions come in as well? You just not going to drop if you cannot run your poptart cataphract/victor/highlander sniper?

Edited by Rhinehardt Ritter, 04 September 2013 - 01:50 PM.

[WarHippy]

Rhinehardt Ritter, on 04 September 2013 - 01:08 PM, said:

I guess what i dont get here is what is wrong with autocannons and large lasers? I am a very old tabletop player and most of the weapons damage, heat values are pretty close to tabletop (with solaris rules for heat)

Nothing wrong with them other than only being able to fire 2 large lasers without ghost heat. In fact I prefer them most of the time, but it doesn't mean I have to like clunky mechanics for other weapons like what they did with the gauss rifle. It feels unresponsive and for me that takes away a lot of the fun.

Rhinehardt Ritter, on 04 September 2013 - 01:08 PM, said:

If your builds no longer work I would suggest getting back to a "near stock" loadout and redesigning. No I dont mean remove your double heat sinks, endo, etc. Try something a little different. (Chain fire). I am sorry but th ppc/erppc/gauss meta was not even CLOSE to battletech. Inner sphere combat has alway been short range and brutal. This is not the clans

No, this is not the clans but we will have the clans and these changes are going to carry over to them. They needed to find a better way.

Rhinehardt Ritter, on 04 September 2013 - 01:08 PM, said:

As far as the game changing they have always maintained it is Beta and this is part of life in a Beta. They can and will change stuff. PGI (or any dev) decides when Beta is over, not the players. It even says Beta in the upper left corner of the screen.

These are changes they needed to try out months ago not two weeks before the game goes live and out of beta, and it would be nice if they actually make use of the test server for some of this stuff before diving head first into it. I'm sorry, but at this point the "it's beta" argument falls flat. The Devs have decided that beta is over, and this release candidate is severely lacking.

[Mechsniper]

Fix the problem by instating the hardpoint size restrictions that should have been in game from the beginning. An ERPPC should never fit in a 3d's arm point where a medium laser was meant to go. The gauss cat was a harbinger of bad things to come, and those of us that foretold that were ignored. Now the wonky and desperate changes to fix balance are being made, but the core problem was never addressed, yet remains the same.

[DirePhoenix]

Mechsniper, on 04 September 2013 - 12:58 PM, said:

If you want to give us tabletop heat, cut the bs and give us tabletop armor, then listen to you cry about dying too quick.

If we had tabletop heat and tabletop armor, we would also need tabletop weapon cycle times of 10 seconds.

Alternatively, we could have tabletop armor with faster weapon cycling and be just fine, if they would scale the weapon dps and heat accordingly instead of having 3 different shifting scales for each weapon.

IE: standard (non-doubled) armor: PPC recycle time = 10 seconds; PPC = 10 damage /shot;heat = 10/shot.

Is 10 seconds is too long for you to hold your breath without passing out? Ok, let's take it down to 5 second recycle times:

standard (non-doubled) armor: PPC recycle time = 5 seconds; PPC = 5 damage/shot; heat = 5/shot.

etc., etc. for every other weapon.

[TheSteelRhino]

I like hardpoint sizes in addition to types as well, but who is going to tolerate reworking the system again. Not to mention, if they become even more restrictive some other group will start complaining. At some point you just have to accept a game for what it is.

And then maybe you get lucky if you lay off the ranting and provide positively oriented but well thought out feedback (even criticisms).
I mean if somebody walks up to you screaming at you are you going to just sit there being yelled at? Probably not. You might try to reason, and then you give up and walk off. ( or some might pop em one in the jaw.....)

[TheSteelRhino]

WarHippy, on 04 September 2013 - 01:26 PM, said:

Nothing wrong with them other than only being able to fire 2 large lasers without ghost heat. In fact I prefer them most of the time, but it doesn't mean I have to like clunky mechanics for other weapons like what they did with the gauss rifle. It feels unresponsive and for me that takes away a lot of the fun.
No, this is not the clans but we will have the clans and these changes are going to carry over to them. They needed to find a better way.

These are changes they needed to try out months ago not two weeks before the game goes live and out of beta, and it would be nice if they actually make use of the test server for some of this stuff before diving head first into it. I'm sorry, but at this point the "it's beta" argument falls flat. The Devs have decided that beta is over, and this release candidate is severely lacking.

Of course they should have tried it earlier. But netcode had to be fixed and HSR added. (And fixed again). I think they are trying to keep dates from slipping any more. Shrug. So you want to keep delaying? Not much of a choice....

[Wolfways]

Flavious59, on 04 September 2013 - 12:44 PM, said:

Hawken is too fast so it doesn't feel like a simulator

That's exactly how i feel about MWO

[Roadbeer]

Just like with the 3PV threads.... same 10 people QQing and calling it community outrage.

Lulz.

[Morlokk]

Mycrus, on 03 September 2013 - 04:53 PM, said:

Pee pEe cee and gooserifle noobs - cry moar plz!

Pee pEe cee and gooserifle noobs - cry moar plz!

Ya know I was mad at this comment and comments like this, trolling with nothing better to do. But then i realized that people like this obviously have no standards and will just take anything that comes along. So i realize this doesn't bother me at all. I have standards and I want to make something i like and am passionate about better. Sure there is some whining over changes, but there are also some legitimate concerns and gripes and if we didn't ever say anything how would they know what we liked or didn't like, they would just give us whatever they wanted to and we would have to just deal with it, which in reality is the case unless we say something with our mouths, as long as its constructive and with our wallets by not buying what we don't like until things improve.

Edited by Morlokk, 04 September 2013 - 05:44 PM.

[Wolfways]

Rhinehardt Ritter, on 04 September 2013 - 01:08 PM, said:

If your builds no longer work I would suggest getting back to a "near stock" loadout and redesigning.

Because of the extreme heat system, and non-DHS, you can't play anything remotely like a stock mech.
PGI increased the weapon fire rates by various amounts but didn't reduce the heat by an equal amount (or any amount) so weapons fire increases your mechs heat massively. Add to that DHS only increase heat dissipation by 1.4.
Also, as ballistics are firing much faster than TT (and armour is twice as thick in MWO) they need more ammo added to last a whole battle.
Since hearing about MWO i've wanted a Mad Dog (and a Stone Rhino but that's unlikely) with the standard weapons of 2xLRM20's, 2xLPL's, and 2xMPL's but with the way heat works in MWO i'd probably have to drop the weapons down to 2xLRM10's and 4xMPL's...and i'm not even sure cramming the mech with as many DHS as i can will even handle that.

That's the biggest problem with the game, to me at least.

Edit: I also want to add, i understand not having hardpoint sizes early on in the game when there were few mechs, but even now people are saying "What's the point of mech X when mech Y does it better?". Hardpoint sizes would create mechs with variety for different purposes.

Edited by Wolfways, 04 September 2013 - 03:38 PM.

[Wolfways]

Roadbeer, on 04 September 2013 - 03:04 PM, said:

Just like with the 3PV threads.... same 10 people QQing and calling it community outrage.

Lulz.

Do you just spend your time looking for threads you don't agree with so you can post some inane {Scrap}?

[BillHones]

anyone else wish they stuck to the way orion looked in the teaser pic? head centered on torso, missile torso looked better, had an overall more gritty look. i wanted to pull the trigger on it until i saw the mech bay picture...

Edited by BillHones, 04 September 2013 - 03:52 PM.

[Spleen5459]

well this has about done it for me .........months and months of forum warriors and bad press........starting to jump on the bandwagon myself.... gauss is useless....PPC annoying . been fun till now

[TheSteelRhino]

Wolfways, on 04 September 2013 - 03:29 PM, said:

Because of the extreme heat system, and non-DHS, you can't play anything remotely like a stock mech.
PGI increased the weapon fire rates by various amounts but didn't reduce the heat by an equaul amount (or any amount) so weapons fire increases your mechs heat massively. Add to that DHS only increase heat dissipation by 1.4.
Also, as ballistics are firing much faster than TT (and armour is twice as thick in MWO) they need more ammo added to last a whole battle.
Since hearing about MWO i've wanted a Mad Dog (and a Stone Rhino but that's unlikely) with the standard weapons of 2xLRM20's, 2xLPL's, and 2xMPL's but with the way heat works in MWO i'd probably have to drop the weapons down to 2xLRM10's and 4xMPL's...and i'm not even sure cramming the mech with as many DHS as i can will even handle that.

That's the biggest problem with the game, to me at least.

Edit: I also want to add, i understand not having hardpoint sizes early on in the game when there were few mechs, but even now people are saying "What's the point of mech X when mech Y does it better?". Hardpoint sizes would create mechs with variety for different purposes.

.

@Wolfways

Your post is utter rubbish. You took what I originally said and changed to fit what YOU wanted to say.

The original excerpt from my post read as:

Begin excerpt
"If your builds no longer work I would suggest getting back to a "near stock" loadout and redesigning. No I dont mean remove your double heat sinks, endo, etc. Try something a little different. (Chain fire). I am sorry but th ppc/erppc/gauss meta was not even CLOSE to battletech. Inner sphere combat has alway been short range and brutal. This is not the clans"
End excerpt
As far as your mad dog/stone rhino go... Try not using alpha strike every time you pull the trigger for 1 thing. Maybe they make it in eventually. But dont corrupt the entire system because you want 1 mech (or two mechs). You can still have your mech. Or how about seeing how things evolve. Clans are delayed until next year.

But taking the comments of others, taking them out of context or editing them is PATHETIC.
Learn to make a case. As of right now you have zero credibility. I would say go find another game but if you cannot handle this you should be easy pickings in game.
Time to unsubscribe b/c crying here has sunk to a new low.

Edited by Rhinehardt Ritter, 04 September 2013 - 05:46 PM.

[Wolfways]

Rhinehardt Ritter, on 04 September 2013 - 05:41 PM, said:

.

@Wolfways

Your post is utter rubbish. You took what I originally said and changed to fit what YOU wanted to say.

The original excerpt from my post read as:

Begin excerpt
"If your builds no longer work I would suggest getting back to a "near stock" loadout and redesigning. No I dont mean remove your double heat sinks, endo, etc. Try something a little different. (Chain fire). I am sorry but th ppc/erppc/gauss meta was not even CLOSE to battletech. Inner sphere combat has alway been short range and brutal. This is not the clans"
End excerpt
As far as your mad dog/stone rhino go... Try not using alpha strike every time you pull the trigger for 1 thing. Maybe they make it in eventually. But dont corrupt the entire system because you want 1 mech (or two mechs). You can still have your mech. Or how about seeing how things evolve. Clans are delayed until next year.

But taking the comments of others, taking them out of context or editing them is PATHETIC.
Learn to make a case. As of right now you have zero credibility. I would say go find another game but if you cannot handle this you should be easy pickings in game.
Time to unsubscribe b/c crying here has sunk to a new low.

Okay...i have no idea what you're talking about.
I quoted a line from your post (and didn't edit anything) where you mentioned "getting back to a near stock loadout" and i said why it's impossible to play a near stock mech. I didn't change anything you said or even mention anything else about your post. I actually agreed with the rest of your post as far as i remember and no, i wasn't part of the 2xPPC/gauss players.
Oh, and i think i might have used alpha strike once in CB.

I'm not sure how saying you can't play stock mechs in MWO is trying to "corrupt the entire system".
I have no idea what you're so angry about...

Edit: Yeah, just checked your post again and i did agree with everything you said...so i really have no idea why you're upset.

Edited by Wolfways, 04 September 2013 - 06:03 PM.

[Viper69]

Mutaroc, on 04 September 2013 - 06:47 AM, said:

No... they have mentioned that already on a previous post....
Why do you keep on complaining about 3PV?!

Does it affect you?! it should not... In fact it affects people who use it, since they dont have map and sensors.

Are you forced to use it?! Ofc NOT.

Now my question...

WHY DO YOU KEEP ON CRYING?!!

Because sir, their whole flippin reason for having 3pv was to help new people learn how to pilot (dont know what mental midget cant figure out how to walk and turn left at the same time). They even said in their patch notes the tutorial now will help people to control their legs and torso. Also I am not crying at least that I can tell, my tear ducts are not purging any liquid and my nose is not running. If you are too dense to see why people are upset about it being in the game then there is no point in trying to pound it through your cro-magnon skull.