833 replies to this topic

[Quardak]

for useless weapon i still see it somehow often...

A lot of of DAKKA with little damage but damn annoying.

I like that PATCH. A good step in the right direction, maybe some of the cryìn players can calm down.

[Straften]

Ellen Ripley, on 03 September 2013 - 08:34 AM, said:

Totally overnerfed sniping.

This patch just killed the (ER) PPC:
- Bump of base heat for both PPCs
- reduction of projectile speed
- PPC damage under 90m has been reduced to 0
You effectively reversed every buff for PPCs since closed beta
PPCs are back to closed beta levels aka. ERs are unusable and standard are actually even worse now with the removal of damage below 90m

The balance wasn't far off prior to this patch, a little buff for brawling and then sniping as well as brawling would have been equally viable.

Instead you decided to kill sniping and make brawling the way to play.


I don't understand why you are not aiming at making both playstyles viable at the same time. If you in fact did aim for that, then you failed horribly - again.


You don't hit a waepon system with 3 big nerfs in one patch guys, you just don't.
When people asked for more frequent game balance changes, gradual & small adjustments where meant, not the biggest sledgehammer you could possibly come up with.

As a player who rarely fielded guass or PPCs, I have to say you are spot on.

I already see the consequences of the removal of PPC as a viable weapon. People are not supressed at all. You have entire lances of mechs going wherever they like. The games I played yesterday felt sloppy, with very little strategy (if any) involved.

Garth Erlam, on 03 September 2013 - 08:26 AM, said:

Much love to those who know patience and understanding. This patch is dedicated to you.

You helped no one with this patch. Why on Earth would you change 2 variables on the PPC at the same time? We could have been behind a heat increase or a projectile speed decrease; but, both at the same time is just careless work. You have no control from which to accurately observe the balance changes now. The game just had a critical strategic aspect removed, and got a lot less interesting.

Again, I have never been a sniper pilot, and I got bored within 5 drops last night. I'm not uninstalling, but this game is on the back burner until this is fixed. It just isn't interesting with two weapon systems removed from play.

Let me just finish with this. Why in the hell did you ruin a weapons system, instead of buffing one of the many in your game that never see the light of day because they are so under powered? You could have buffed pulse lasers and had a much more interesting game. Instead, pulse lasers still suck, and now another weapon sucks too. ****'s sake.

Edited by Straften, 04 September 2013 - 08:10 AM.

[Nebuzaar]

Worst patch ever. I really see no sense in derving the PPC that way. Gauss changes are just stupid.

[Straften]

The Faceless, on 04 September 2013 - 07:27 AM, said:

Yes it can and does affect everyone. However, I don't believe that the impact is as great as what a lot of the people are complaining that it is. I say this after watching the results of 3 weeks of play and not seeing anyone really using it to great affect. I will concede that I'm not part of a group that is hitting the competitive 12 mans so it is possible that there are some folks that have found a way to really use it to effect.



Your argument here is suspect. You claim that you have to use it every game when you can simply check a tick box in the setup to turn it off as the default starting view and then you claim that everyone else can use it to see over hills when you cant when you clearly can by just turing 3pv on to do so. If you choose to not use something because you don't like it that's your choice. Your not being forced to use it or not.

I understand that you don't like it in the game and feel that you were lied to about it being put into the game when they said that they wouldn't. Welcome to the world of online games. I've not played in an online game yet where something like this hasn't happened to some extent.

The CHOICE you now have is do you support this game or not. If you feel that the devs have been dishonest, and have made the game unplayable in your view then show them. Leave the game or stop paying for anything within the game whatever you feel is appropriate.

Please note that I am not trying to tell you to actually leave the game and I'm not trying to hate on you. I for one am waiting to see how they use 3pv where CW is concerned. My hope is that they will not allow it for CW and let that stand as the "Hard Mode" that everyone wants.

Fair enough. Though, let's not forget that just because you choose not to use an advantage,it is still an advantage some find worth using. Case and point is that the 3PV drone is more powerful than any purchasable module for intel gathering. That is not arguable at this time. Some people neglect to invest in or field a seismic. Some people neglect to press F4 twice.

Too often I see this argument devolve into "well just turn it off then it's your choice". The people asking for the removal or segregation of 3PV don't have a problem turning it off. The problem is that it coexists with 1PV. Because it is toggle-able, you can use the advantages of 3PV to gather information, and switch to 1PV to actually fight.

[qki]

Sully, on 04 September 2013 - 05:45 AM, said:

My gauss rifles don't fire anymore. What happened?

you don't have teh skillz to fire a gauss rifle, that's what happened. Read first post.

[Jakob Knight]

The Faceless, on 04 September 2013 - 07:27 AM, said:

Please note that I am not trying to tell you to actually leave the game and I'm not trying to hate on you. I for one am waiting to see how they use 3pv where CW is concerned. My hope is that they will not allow it for CW and let that stand as the "Hard Mode" that everyone wants.

I understand your points, and appreciate what you are saying. I have not withdrawn from this game because, as you, I still have some hope it will turn out okay. Based on the comments of the Devs, which have pretty much indicated that 3PV is going to be considered 'the game', I don't think there is any cause for hope it will not be used for CW (that idea was part of the same pledge that there would be seperate queues and no one would be forced to play in games featuring it, both of which the Devs chose willingly and with full knowledge to make lies), especially when the target playerbase the Devs are considering mainstream for this game cannot play without it.

However, I always reserve the right to bring those who post the kind of mindless egoism of the poster I replied to to task when I find them. I also don't believe in letting the Devs off the hook when they still don't acknowledge that breaking a promise to the playerbase was in any way a wrong thing that needed to be compensated. As long as the promise remains broken and the break unapologetic, I'll keep on regarding anything they say or do the way I would a known and unrepetent liar, not giving them or their statements worth beyond the gum on my shoe (which is what they are worth). I am not going to let them get off easily just by ignoring what they did in hopes it goes away.

On that basis, I will continue to use their product without supporting it any further, and testify to those who inquire as to the actions of PGI and IGP and what those indicate about the likely outcome in any dealings with people of such lacking character. Should the Devs offer a sincere apology for what they have done (not false excuses about the wrong issues) and follow through on their promises, that may change, but to date it seems they honestly don't think lying and hypocracy are anything wrong.

Makes you wonder what kind of example they are setting for their children (if any).

Edited by Jakob Knight, 04 September 2013 - 08:25 AM.

[Kunae]

Nebuzaar, on 04 September 2013 - 08:08 AM, said:

I really see no sense in derving the PPC that way.

The PPC hasn't been "derved". It's been returned to what it was in December. But now it has better hit detection.

[DirePhoenix]

Garth Erlam, on 03 September 2013 - 08:26 AM, said:

Gameplay

• PPC damage under 90m has been reduced to 0.
  
• Gauss Fire Delay:
  
  • The Gauss Rifle requires a 0.75 second charge before it will fire.
    
  • Once charged, the shooter has 1.25 seconds to fire the round.
    
  • If not fired during the 1.25 second charge, the Gauss Rifle will instantly dissipate the charge and require another charge to fire.
    
  • Both the cooldown bar and the weapon group ready light will turn green when the Gauss is ready to fire.
• PPC base heat increased to 10 (up from 9).
  
• ERPPC base heat increased to 15 (up from 13).
  
• PPC/ERPPC projectile speed slowed to 1500m/s down from 2000m/s.
  
• Gauss projectile speed increased from 1200m/s up to 2000m/s, internal health increased to 5 (up from 3).

Can someone explain to me how a stream of charged particles is barely traveling at supersonic speeds? PPCs are supposed to be man-made lightning. Lightning is an occurrence that happens frequently enough around us that we should all have a pretty good idea how fast it moves. And how fast does it move? (HINT: it's in the name)


Ok, while it doesn't go exactly at the speed of light, lightning still travels on average about 6,000,000 m/s. A far cry from 1,500 m/s and effectively instantaneous on the scales that we're playing at and for the maximum effective range of a PPC anyway.

I agree that PPCs and Gauss should be de-synced. But this is in the complete opposite direction from anything that makes sense. A PPC bolt should be instantaneous, an arc that spans its effective range (or to its target, whichever is closest). However, making the PPC instantly hit, on-demand would make it extremely OP and far too easy to wield its power. So you put a firing delay/charge mechanic on the PPC. Add delay/charge time, remove travel time.

(NOTE: by 'charge' mechanic in this instance, I mean you click 'fire' and the weapon charges and discharges. Not the current Gauss charge mechanic of holding the button down to charge and release the button to discharge)

A Gauss Rifle, despite its non-combustive means of firing projectiles, is still for all intents and purposes a conventional projectile cannon, firing a physical solid slug of nickel at its target. It needs no additional mechanics. It can be instant-fire, as the slug still has to travel at less than instantaneous speeds from its firing point to its target.

Garth Erlam, on 03 September 2013 - 08:26 AM, said:

• Small changes to the third person camera position and angle to better show off the lower half of the 'Mech.
  
  • Known issue: The tops of the following 'Mechs partially obscure the player's view of where the crosshairs are aiming. A fix is currently being worked on.
    
    • Cataphract
      
    • JagerMech
      
    • Orion

How about just removing 3PV? It's clearly not working, and not going to work the way anyone could have reasonably intended.

Edited by DirePhoenix, 04 September 2013 - 08:30 AM.

[Straften]

Kunae, on 04 September 2013 - 08:19 AM, said:

The PPC hasn't been "derved". It's been returned to what it was in December. But now it has better hit detection.

It's been completely derved.

[Stingr4y]

Ahem........may I?


I think I will drop the mic over here.

[Kunae]

Straften, on 04 September 2013 - 08:31 AM, said:

It's been completely derved.

Well... derve you, man!

[Nebuzaar]

So lightning is now slower than Gauss, Gauss is further more just stupid and PPC's heat is increased even more. Sooo stupid changes at all!

[AntzRevenge]

Ill put it this way. Your not totally in my good graces PGI. But you moved a lot closer. Great patch, not crazy about the gauss mechanic, but great patch nonetheless.

Edited by AntzRevenge, 04 September 2013 - 08:40 AM.

[Esarai]

At first I was a little miffed about the chargeup mechanic, but then I tried it and it takes about the same time to charge the weapon as I do to aim, and lets me not fire if the enemy takes cover or a friendly gets in the way, leading to greater ammunition efficiency. At first I was all 'Oh god it's terrible,' but experience has proven me wrong. A good patch, PGI. More patches of this or greater quality and I might actually get all up in some Phoenix 'Mechs.

[Roland]

Mutaroc, on 04 September 2013 - 06:47 AM, said:

No... they have mentioned that already on a previous post....
Why do you keep on complaining about 3PV?!

Does it affect you?! it should not... In fact it affects people who use it, since they dont have map and sensors.

Are you forced to use it?! Ofc NOT.

Now my question...

WHY DO YOU KEEP ON CRYING?!!

You are essentially forced to use it, because otherwise you are handicapping yourself since your opponent can use it.

Note, effective use of 3PV does not mean running in 3PV for extended periods of time. This seems to be the major thing that less advanced players can't grasp.

Effective usage of 3PV means that you flip it on to peek over and around obstacles, and then turn it off immediately.

[Kaarde]

DirePhoenix, on 04 September 2013 - 08:26 AM, said:

How about just removing 3PV? It's clearly not working, and not going to work the way anyone could have reasonably intended.

I was introducing a co worker to the game last night and let him drive my Atlas around Frozen Colony Snow in the Test Lab.
When he asked to see the 3pv he'd read so many people "discussing" on the boards I told him how to toggle it.

Upon seeing it I was surprised at the changes. The camera is lower and seems further back. You could see the upper thighs on the mech and a noticably wider FOV.

First buff of 3pv already. Wonder what's next.

Edited by Kaarde, 04 September 2013 - 08:51 AM.

[Thuzel]

Jakob Knight, on 04 September 2013 - 06:56 AM, said:

Why do we keep complaining about it? Because it was never supposed to be in the game, was specifically pledged never to be in the game, and was promised never to be forced upon the playerbase who didn't want to play in the environment it caused.

Does it affect me? Yes, it does. By saying it does not, when you know full well that -every- game is one where it is used by those with and against me, offering advantages that should never have been granted and which then alter the fight I am engaged in, you are merely showing how little you think before trying to sound grown up.

Am I forced to use it? Considering everyone has to start with it engaged before they can turn it off, the answer to this should be self-evident. Am I forced to use it in every game? I am being forced to deal with it every game, so it is the same thing...yes, I am being forced to fight in a battle environment where people can look over hills that I cannot, so again, you aren't considering your question. As long as I enter any MWO game, I am being forced into a battle where 3PV is enabled.

If anyone is crying, it seems like it is you, afraid your new crutch will be taken away. Compared to the broken commitment and promise that was made multiple times by the Devs, that is the truely childish part of your post. Go back to school and get educated.

This is the target player the Dev's wanted to attract with 3PV? Not worth the trouble, if you ask me.

This.

In addition, PGI should know this is costing them money and players. A lot of people won't buy anything until the top PGI people get their act together. Things that would help:

1. Actually address grievances. Just man up and do it, it's not difficult. Don't half-*** it with a non "apology" as you tried to do earlier.
2. Tell us what's going on. You've obviously had a drastic change in direction since CB, so just tell us what it is. Stop making us guess what kind of game this is going to be. You've made a lot of statements and you've changed your mind too much. At this point, nothing is a given.
3. Be consistent. Stick to what you say. The content of the message doesn't matter so much as much as following through with it.

That's it. Do those three things and most of your customer problems will go away.

Note that I didn't mention anything about the actual game in there. That's because most people don't care about that as much as we care about the company we do business with. Most of the disgruntled people I know aren't nearly as upset about 3pv as they are about "you" (Russ, Paul, Bryan, etc...) and the way you treat your customers. It's quite honestly a very easy fix and your investors and ourselves would be extremely happy to see it.

[Wolfways]

Hugh Fairgrove, on 04 September 2013 - 05:53 AM, said:

-Increased lava damage seems good though I haven’t seen its effects yet.

It was decreased.

[ShinVector]

Kattspya, on 04 September 2013 - 05:09 AM, said:

I live in Sweden you insensitive clod.

No game has reasonable hit detection at 350-400 ping with added packetloss. There is nothing to do but add regional servers and that will never happen. Sucks for me and sucks for you.

So just because he lives in Austrailia... You assume he has 350-400ms ping with packet loss ??
Never hear or people overseas having 250ms latency.. low jitter and packetloss ?

[Teferi]

Kunae, on 03 September 2013 - 12:39 PM, said:

Nah... gotta get R. Lee Ermey.

I would love to see R. Lee Ermey do the voice-over for the tutorial.

Edited by Teferi, 04 September 2013 - 09:28 AM.