1251 replies to this topic

[Heffay]

Badconduct, on 26 September 2013 - 05:47 PM, said:

They would really need to build a game from the ground up if they wanted to do something new. If they're just tinkering with the Crysis engine, this is it's limits.

That doesn't bode well for Star Citizen. It uses the exact same engine.

[FactorlanP]

Heffay, on 26 September 2013 - 05:50 PM, said:

That doesn't bode well for Star Citizen. It uses the exact same engine.

I'm not a big SC promoter. Don't know if I will play it. But isn't SC working closely with Crytek engineers?

[Lukoi Banacek]

Johnny Z, on 25 September 2013 - 11:42 PM, said:

Agreed, any score below a 5 for this game is considered invalid anyway by definition. So wont be counted in any totals that matter to anyone.

By definition a score of 5 means it is playable, below 5 means its has no appeal and things like the launcher and controls are buggy. Again anything below a 5 means it is broken, which Mechwarrior is not.

A score of 7 means the game is stable and has appeal.

10 means the game has broken ground in mechanics and appeal.

Who defines this 1-10 standard besides you?

I gave it a thorough review, generally received as objective by most and used all 5000 characters with still more thoughts to add and gave it a 5/10. It has plenty of bugs, balance issues and play issues (disconnect lately? plenty have) but that doesn't mean it doesn't have appeal. Additionally, it sells itself as a big, enterprising MMO when in fact it lacks any of the things that would make it so (lobbies, CW). Might as well be minecraft for all of the point there is to grinding the same two modes over and over. It's got its fun factor to be sure, but a 5/10 is a very reasonable ranking for it atm.

I made a distinct point of NOT addressing any of the drama of the game's development up to the point of launch day and simply commented on the game for it's worthiness on the day it launched.

Your scale is YOUR scale. Saying anyone else's version of that same scale is simply argumentative for the sake of being a tool. You want to dismiss reviews objectively given, go right ahead. I don't think most would agree with you though.

[Deathlike]

Heffay, on 26 September 2013 - 05:50 PM, said:

That doesn't bode well for Star Citizen. It uses the exact same engine.

Just because they use the same engine, doesn't mean one can't make magic, and the other can downgrade it into poo.

I watched a Star Citizen video and I was blown away at the mere difference between that "non game" to this game. It made me think, "CryEngine 3 could do this?!?!" The sad reality that even a non-game is an order of magnitudes better what they did with the engine, compared to this game.

Edited by Deathlike, 26 September 2013 - 06:11 PM.

[Badconduct]

Heffay, on 26 September 2013 - 05:50 PM, said:

That doesn't bode well for Star Citizen. It uses the exact same engine.

The guy who is making Star Citizen is the same guy who tried to finish Freelancer and couldn't. The Grand Space Sim has been a dream for decades, but the hardware required just isn't there.

X3 has a lot of trouble, and it just lacks in reasons to play. It's just not very exciting and it takes forever to really get into.

Battlecruiser 3000AD tried everything and flopped horribly.

Have you seen any real game play? It's just a bunch of 3d rendered pictures with some catchy slogans and music. There's no substance, yet again. They are going to start building it, realize that it can barely run on their hardware and than just start cutting the incomplete ideas to hit the target release date. And you get FF14 again.

That game will not live up to the hype, and anyone who is pouring money into that guys retirement fund is an *****.

I work 9 - 5, I'm not going home to work another 8 hours in Star Citizen. This game is targeting Eve and Second Life players. Star Citizen is the day dream of people playing games at home, living off Welfare and people with too much free time and money.

Quote

Just because they use the same engine, doesn't mean one can make magic, and the other can downgrade it into poo.

I watched a Star Citizen video and I was blown away at the mere difference between that "non game" to this game. It made me think, "CryEngine 3 could do this?!?!" The sad reality that even a non-game is an order of magnitudes better what they did with the engine, compared to this game.

Pictures are just pictures. The core of CryEngine is a 3d shooter you can hop into Vehicles. It's not designed for space physics or MMO layouts.


Stop believing all the hype. Games are worse than religion at sucking you into them. Everything mentioned in Star citizen has been tried and failed. From Allegiance to Angle of Attack; the game play just doesn't hold up well.

Edited by Badconduct, 26 September 2013 - 06:26 PM.

[Nekki Basara]

Star Citizen basically has a mechlab at the moment, where you can walk around and get into your spaceships. Dogfight is supposedly "coming soon" and it looks to basically be where MWO is now. Not enough to get me to drop money on it.

[N0MAD]

Destined, on 25 September 2013 - 03:34 PM, said:

That's a lot of space in your post, guy. It looks like a post-modernist interpretation of the content quality of this thread.

You could of also said this..
That's a lot of space in your post, guy. It looks like a post-modernist interpretation of the content quality of this game,
and be totally correct.
You have listed your opinion we can list ours.

[Sandpit]

There's a lot of space between feature announcement and implementation also

[N0MAD]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 26 September 2013 - 01:11 PM, said:

Well, PGI made the game in only 2 years on a shoestring budget of 5 million.

Well lets clear that up as its a point often made.
The game was basically already made, as in they didnt need imagination, the story line was there, the weapons, the mechs, it was all provided. The time Developers need in creating a game is actually creating, you know imagining a universe a concept, creating New vehicles, weapons, scenarios, art. None of this was required, hell even the art, Mechs were already pre designed, the artist really only needed to copy existing ideas and models.
So as far as time goes they were able to bypass the time thats called the concept stage.
They had the concept, the story, the art, the engine, and over 2 years, and this is what we have.
Great job.

[Sandpit]

Oh and it was announced tonight, cw will be here soon

[Gaden Phoenix]

Sandpit, on 26 September 2013 - 06:58 PM, said:

Oh and it was announced tonight, cw will be here soon

I wish i was in USA. I really want to go to one of their event and ask them a really simple question...

Please define in a specific dd/mm/yyyy format the defination of " S O O N ".

Because Soon and PGI have a really interesting relationship, that might not always be based on the general and agreed upon reality.

Edited by Gaden Phoenix, 26 September 2013 - 07:20 PM.

[Sandpit]

Gaden Phoenix, on 26 September 2013 - 07:19 PM, said:

I wish i was in USA. I really want to go to one of their event and ask them a really simple question...

Please define in a specific dd/mm/yyyy format the defination of " S O O N ".

Because Soon and PGI have a really interesting relationship, that might not always be based on the general and agreed upon reality.

that's the info we were given. We weren't given a date as usual

[Archon Adam Steiner]

It's abundantly clear to anybody with any experience in reading for bias that a great deal of the negative views are written by very angry people who take such massive offense at one or two issues as license to pan the entire game. 3PV and no Community Warfare do not equate with a zero, which is an indicator of absolutely no redeeming features whatsoever. I get it, you're angry/disappointed, but you expected a hell of a lot out of an F2P game from a minor studio that probably had little more than five million to develop a game in only two years. The fact that we have a game that is more balanced and stable than ever is worth something, even if you feel personally wronged by PGI.

Edited by Arrachtas, 26 September 2013 - 07:29 PM.

[Heffay]

Sandpit, on 26 September 2013 - 07:21 PM, said:

that's the info we were given. We weren't given a date as usual

Within 6 months for all 3 phases.

[MischiefSC]

Heffay, on 26 September 2013 - 05:50 PM, said:

That doesn't bode well for Star Citizen. It uses the exact same engine.

Whole different ball of wax. How familiar are you with the gaming industry? He's pulled a pretty comprehensive All-Star Globe Trotters team of folks together (he's got the money and connections to do so) that include a couple of folks from Crytek, including Paul Reindell who was a lead programer on Cryengine 2 and 3 both. The people who know as much about Cryengine as him could comfortably sit at the same table. Also on the list is a member of the MW:LL team - which was essentially created in Cryengine 2 and repeatedly heralded as one of the best Cryengine mods ever done.

Here's a link to the whole dev team - who, by the way, consistently and regularly answer questions on the forums. Pick a name off that list and go over their LinkedIn account or just read through their responses.

SC has had a community drama. Right before Labor Day content was released that felt like a cash grab. A lot of people were upset. Literally less than 2 hours afterwards on Labor Day Saturday the community manager popped in on the forums (while at a game convention) and made a couple of excellent posts to clarify some stuff. About 24 hours later Chris Roberts made a competent, well thought out apology and fixed everything. Then on top of that put a poll up about several solutions (take the feature out for now, put it in as a test version early or leave it as is and just cut all prices in half so pretty much every backer can buy everything in the store with in-game credit that he'd already given everyone for free). Everyone was happy with the response, he didn't need to change anything but he still put the poll up and executed the results of the poll (keep it but cut prices) less than a week later, even though it was not the one that put the most money in his pocket but the one that best satisfied the community.

Something similar happened when the community was arguing with each other over PvP vs PvE. Their development team and community management is brilliant, honest and transparent. It'll take years I have no doubt to finish coming to fruition but I trust them to do so because they've given me reason, time and again, to trust them.

The result being a community that's throwing about $1 million a month at them. Not because of the content they are providing but because they are making promises and keeping them in addition to showing (not occasionally abstractly telling) what that money is doing.

Apples to oranges though. CR had bullet-proof credentials, numerous contacts and a {Scrap} ton of successful experience. The only issues anyone has had with what he did was Freelancer - which he left half way through because of issues with the publisher (which was doing exactly what created issues with Freelancer. 3PV focus, no Joystick support, etc). He's also got some experience in Hollywood on selling ideals to people. He came to the table with money in his pocket, the right skill set, the right people, the right pitch and the right timing. Also didn't hurt that he had publishers and VC waiting in the wings.

Result? SC is going to end up as the first crowd-funded AAA game title. It's not a reasonable comparison to put it up against MW:O. There's also no reason to feel a need to; any successes or failures of one don't compete with the other. Given the money that SC is pulling in and the quality of their community (go read the forums. One of the best game forums on the net, hands down) there are probably some useful lessons that PGI or any other developer could take from there. Conversely PGI, in the road to taking a quasi-live game through closed beta, open beta and live (congrats PGI) undoubtedly has some lessons to share as well.

Games are never an 'us vs them'. Success for one game is not a loss for another, generally that success drives other successes. You want SC to do well, it will drive interest in sci-fi multiplayer games that will certainly drive traffic to MW:O. The only real question to ask is what will their expectations be in return for their money and how do you meet those.

Edited by MischiefSC, 26 September 2013 - 07:29 PM.

[Sandpit]

Arrachtas, on 26 September 2013 - 07:25 PM, said:

It's abundantly clear to anybody with any experience in reading for bias that a great deal of the negative views are written by very angry people who take such massive offense at one or two issues as license to pan the entire game.

The game has problems, and yes, there has been disappointment, but the amount of 'zeros' (or close to it) who practically yell obscenities at the game and PGI cannot be taken seriously, yet unfortunately mar the mark.

Meta-critic is a pretty poor and extremely biased gauge by which to evaluate anything.

It' isn't like the professional reviews were stellar. It's a mediocre game with stagnant content and boring replay value with a mediocre score

[Gaden Phoenix]

Arrachtas, on 26 September 2013 - 07:25 PM, said:

It's abundantly clear to anybody with any experience in reading for bias that a great deal of the negative views are written by very angry people who take such massive offense at one or two issues as license to pan the entire game. 3PV and no Community Warfare do not equate with a zero, which is an indicator of absolutely no redeeming features whatsoever. I get it, you're angry/disappointed, but you expected a hell of a lot out of an F2P game from a minor studio that probably had little more than five million to develop a game in only two years. The fact that we have a game that is more balanced and stable than ever is worth something, even if you feel personally wronged by PGI.

The main issue for me is that the make promises after promises that they constantly broke or did not fulfill. they communication with customers is horrible and they seem to keep on trying to offend their loyal customer base especially those that bought into MWO due to promises made and directions giving. Etc, etc, etc.

Basically they broke faith, time and time again. At this point in time, to honestly say that they will keep us informed and make good on their promises is really hard.

[Archon Adam Steiner]

Star Citizen makes promise after promise.

What's going to happen when they break one (or more)? They will.

Star Wars: The Old Republic had nearly $300,000,000 in funding, BioWare, and the Star Wars IP. It had fantastic interviews, updates, information, trailers, and made a TONNE of promises that looked like they would be supported.

The game went F2P within months and was hemorrhaging tens of thousands of people per week.

Let us not point to games that make flashy promo vids and promises and believe with utter conviction that they will come true. I dearly hope that nobody is so naiive.

[Sandpit]

Arrachtas, on 26 September 2013 - 07:42 PM, said:

Star Citizen makes promise after promise.

What's going to happen when they break one (or more)? They will.

Star Wars: The Old Republic had nearly $300,000,000 in funding, BioWare, and the Star Wars IP. It had fantastic interviews, updates, information, trailers, and made a TONNE of promises that looked like they would be supported.

The game went F2P within months and was hemorrhaging tens of thousands of people per week.

Let us not point to games that make flashy promo vids and promises and believe with utter conviction that they will come true. I dearly hope that nobody is so naiive.

So that makes this case ok? Just because it happened in another game or might happen in a coming game?

[Nekki Basara]

Star Wars has a long history of being dissapointing.