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#7341 Rogue Jedi

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Posted 14 February 2017 - 03:08 PM

View PostAmatsukaze, on 14 February 2017 - 01:13 PM, said:

Can someone explain how ghost heat works?

I think I read somewhere you need to wait 1/2 a sec or so between shots to keep ghost heat from appearing. What I have done to minimize this little understood concept is break my laser vomit mechs weapons into 2 or more groups firing 1 then what a split sec after the beam fades to fire the other. I think this works?? I generally don't have a problem with heat management except on terra therma,
The tips as the map loads say to use chain fire but I think that creates to much face time & using my technique seems to work fine.

the way Heat Scale, more commonly known as ghost heat, works

each weapon has a threshold after which firing more than a certain number within 0.5 seconds of the previous one causes additional heat, if you wait 0.5 seconds or more before firing the next you do not generate the additional heat, if you fire at 0.49 seconds that resets the timer, the games inbuilt chain fire feature automaticly fires the next shot at 0.5 seconds.

the AC20 has a threshold of 1, so fire 2 at once and you get additional heat
IS Small class lasers and machine guns do not have a threshold (and as the extra heat is measured in % it would not affect MGs anyway because a trillion percent of zero is still zero
all medium class lasers and clan small class lasers have a combined threshold of 6, so fire 7 or more medium IS lasers or small and/or medium clan lasers and you will get more heat, and the further over the threshold you are the worse penalty you get.

here is an example using the stock Nova Prime,
it comes with 12 ER Medium Lasers, if you fire one arm then the other for 6 and 6 ER Medium Lasers, half a second or more apart, then fire again as soon as they cycle you will overheat, if however youf first shot fires all 12 you will overheat during the first shot (as in before the lasers finish discharging) and remain shutdown for about 30 seconds, weather of not your Mech blows up depends on your heat level when firing the first shot and the map temperature (a cool map you will most likely survive an alpha strike, a warm map you will not, a neutral map you have about a 70% chance of powering back up.

it was highly amusing when the stock Nova Prime was a trial Mech, about 1 game in 5 I would literaly see a "player1 has killed player1" type notification, about 30 seconds into the match when someone took the trial Mech out and decided to test the heal level from an alpha strike

or for more visual examples


the Dire Star exploited a bug in ghost heat calculations which has (apparently) been fixed, so would blow up on the Alpha strike now, you may have a few seconds so if you override shutdown you may survive long enough to get off a second shot, but you would not get a third


Edited by Rogue Jedi, 14 February 2017 - 03:17 PM.


#7342 Amatsukaze

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Posted 14 February 2017 - 08:40 PM

I appreicate the detailed reply Rogue Jedi! That cleared it up for me. Thx!

#7343 Koniving

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Posted 15 February 2017 - 10:05 AM

Before the "fix" of the bug the Direstar exploited, if given enough time to cool (30 seconds) between each shot, you could fire infinitely (since for some reason if you're past 250%, it only removed a percentage of health [99%] instead of a solid number... 99% of 99% of 99% of 99% of 99% of 99% of 99% of 99%...still never hit zero); my personal record was 7 shots before a stray shot got me.

Now even if you wait a full 2+ minutes to try and cool, you'll still die even while shut down.

Definitely beats the pre-ghost heat. Note, it isn't the macro that made it possible to do 30 PPCs in 18 seconds (PPC recharge time was shorter back then), if anything that macro cost me maybe 5 more PPCs that I could have shot. Macros just make things look and sound cooler by firing in sequence rather than all at once.

Though before the current actual heat system (my first video with it; standard heatsinks in a stock Dragon hero... I was still very used to the days of repair and rearm), you used to be prone to going boom if you kept riding 80% heat, or if you managed to get 110% heat. The Fang I was using in that video would have easily blown up with the way I was fighting (since heat was prone to destroying internal equipment, including ammo and your engine; though actual engine destruction didn't actually do anything but give you a huge repair bill) So after they made it so that override did something besides "start you back up quicker", ghost heat was naturally something 'required' so that this was no longer possible without punishment.

My personal advice...

In many situations (but not SRMs these days)... just ignore ghost heat (within reason) if you have about 13 DHS or greater. Don't go out of your way to push it or you'll end up like this...

(In the video I didn't realize a patch had just changed the SRM limit and made it ghost-heat enabled for the way I used it).

But in general... don't fret about it unless vomiting rainbows.

#7344 Tier5 Kerensky

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 04:43 PM

How does the 360 degree target retention module work, does it allow you to keep a lock on enemy?

#7345 Roughneck45

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 06:05 PM

View PostTeer Kerensky, on 17 February 2017 - 04:43 PM, said:

How does the 360 degree target retention module work, does it allow you to keep a lock on enemy?

Yes, up to 200m

The best application is streak boats, so you don't lose your lock with lights circling you.

#7346 Tesunie

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 06:15 PM

View PostTeer Kerensky, on 17 February 2017 - 04:43 PM, said:

How does the 360 degree target retention module work, does it allow you to keep a lock on enemy?


For clarity, you will maintain normal locks, but not missile locks.

Otherwise, everything Roughneck stated. (I didn't know it had an affect of 200m... I've actually never used it before.)

#7347 DavidStarr

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 01:04 AM

Which clan medium and heavy mechs are best for brawling?

#7348 Rogue Jedi

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 02:23 AM

View PostDavidStarr, on 18 February 2017 - 01:04 AM, said:

Which clan medium and heavy mechs are best for brawling?

that is highly subjective, but I would say;
for mediums Stormcrow, Hunchback IIC and Huntsman
for the heavies, Timber Wolf, Orion IIC, Summoner

#7349 Audacious Aubergine

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 03:10 AM

I have the base pack for the Cyclops and am somewhat intrigued by Sleipnir. Is there any benefit to buying it for MC versus upgrading the pack through the store?

#7350 Rogue Jedi

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 07:35 AM

View PostAudacious Aubergine, on 18 February 2017 - 03:10 AM, said:

I have the base pack for the Cyclops and am somewhat intrigued by Sleipnir. Is there any benefit to buying it for MC versus upgrading the pack through the store?

unless you already have enough MC then no, there is absolutely no advantage from buying for MC, to buy with MC would cost $36.90 for 7,750 MC, you would have 1,000 MC left over, which could be spent on paints, cammo, decals or Mechbays.
as opposed to buying the Slepnir for $15, even if you did not already have the base pack it would be cheeper to buy the pack + hero addon.

if you can get the MC on offer (happens about 3 times a year, the MC remains the same price but you get something extra with the packages, could be a Mech, some other ingame items or upto 30% extra MC) and get the Mech on sale (most Mechs go on sale at 30-50% off a few times a year) using that discounted MC it may work out cheeper, otherwise do not bother

#7351 DavidStarr

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 09:38 AM

What about Hellbringer? Tough or squish?

#7352 TercieI

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 09:40 AM

View PostDavidStarr, on 18 February 2017 - 09:38 AM, said:

What about Hellbringer? Tough or squish?


Middlish. Does best exploiting its ECM and being s sneaky edge-poker.

#7353 Leone

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 12:53 PM

If you want brawling, the Cauldron Born (Ebon Jaguar,) is better at the tonnage than the Loki (Hellbringer.) That said, I feel the Loki pokes better, despite it's slightly more squishy nature.

As for Brawling clan Mediums, I'll swear by my Blackhawks, (Novas), which are one of two mechs that hits the game's 16 weapon limit. Sure, tonnage requirements means their all light an in close, but hey.. Brawler. Also, I've heard many a folk who prefer the Hunchback Mark Two, Clan Edition or the Ryoken (Stormcrow). The hunch benefits from being a battlemech, so full customization, whilst the Ryoken has a high speed with a decent payload, and great hitboxes, but no Jump Jets. The Huntsman is relatively new, but so far folk seem to be enjoying it as well.

As for Heavies, well, it's hard to argue with the small pulse an srm Madcat (Timberwolf.) The Cauldron Born is a bit more vicious, but despite being able to spread damage better, can't take quite as much of it. The Vulture (Mad Dog) doesn't seem as good in a brawl, despite the higher srm count, and as mentioned, the Loki seems better suited to mid-ranged gameplay. Haven't seen enough of the Linebacker or Night-Gyr to place em.

~Leone.

Edited by Leone, 18 February 2017 - 12:59 PM.


#7354 DavidStarr

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 02:42 PM

SPL is not something I thought of putting onto my Timberwolf, thanks for the idea (as well as for the detailed rundown).

#7355 Koniving

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 03:03 PM

View PostTeer Kerensky, on 17 February 2017 - 04:43 PM, said:

How does the 360 degree target retention module work, does it allow you to keep a lock on enemy?

Combine with the module that lets you maintain your lock for a few seconds... and you will have the ability to fire streaks at enemies directly behind you for brief periods of time. Helps if you also have Artemis (lock exploit accelerates lock ons by 25%).

#7356 Audacious Aubergine

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 03:30 PM

View PostDavidStarr, on 18 February 2017 - 02:42 PM, said:

SPL is not something I thought of putting onto my Timberwolf, thanks for the idea (as well as for the detailed rundown).

Last time I tried that I got torn a new one in an awful hurry. It's too much of a priority target for getting right up close, and also too large and slow to get back out again. It does better with ERML for the same tonnage, but that could just be me being awful at everything?

EDIT: Then again this was a while back when it really WAS the #1 priority target, so I dunno

Edited by Audacious Aubergine, 18 February 2017 - 03:36 PM.


#7357 Koniving

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 03:39 PM

View PostAudacious Aubergine, on 18 February 2017 - 03:30 PM, said:

Last time I tried that I got torn a new one in an awful hurry. It's too much of a priority target for getting right up close, and also too large and slow to get back out again. It does better with ERML for the same tonnage, but that could just be me being awful at everything?

Could it be that you're using the SPL exclusively?

Something like a few SPL or a few MGs on a Timber Wolf are meant to be an emergency low heat secondary or tertiary weapon, not your main guns.
Unless you're the sneakiest Timber Wolf you can possibly be, there's nothing practical about an SPL only Timber Wolf... or any heavy/assault mech set up this way for that matter.

Even my 95 ton Banshee isn't set this way.

I do use a lot of SPLs on it, but they are NOT the main weapon.

#7358 Audacious Aubergine

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 08:22 PM

I don't remember the build off the top of my head but I think it was the -A ST pod with the shoulder lasers? They weren't the main weapons but I felt compelled to try and get at least some use out of them so I got reckless. It was a weird time for me

#7359 DavidStarr

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Posted 19 February 2017 - 11:53 PM

View PostKoniving, on 18 February 2017 - 03:39 PM, said:

Even my 95 ton Banshee isn't set this way.

LOL, that video Posted Image

Are you guys familiar with the situation when you play assault on Frozen City, and your team decides to "defend the base" (as in, hide an wait)? Or even worse, both teams decide to do just that? What can I do in that situation when both teams are happy to trade PPCs and ERLLs for 10 minutes straight (and I'm not exaggerating)?

#7360 Leone

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Posted 20 February 2017 - 12:01 AM

Learn to manouver, sneak around, brawl someone whose a bit further away from the team, or just ambush em all from behind an get as much damage in as you can. Then leave match, grab a fresh mech, an requeue.

View PostRogue Jedi, on 20 February 2017 - 05:55 AM, said:

it should go without saying but, just in case, do not leave the match until your Mech is dead.


Map Provided by Smurfy
I find D4-D5 (Usually angling for or from E4) or G5-G6 (Along the H line almost,) the best approaches for brawling.

~Leone

Edited by Leone, 20 February 2017 - 07:37 PM.






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