575 replies to this topic

[DemonRaziel]

Rushin Roulette, on 04 October 2013 - 02:02 AM, said:

To be honest. I have not played any game in the last week or so with more than one Streaktaro on the opposing side (Cant comment on my own side, as we cant see our teammates loadouts). I saw a Streakapult about 3 Weeks ago and was seriously surprised that they still existed, the last one before that was quite a few months back.

So I really dont get your point about being forced to avoid half the enemy team in a match.

The part with Heavies and Assaults equipping them in addition to their direct fire weaponry to fend off lights...

[Vassago Rain]

DemonRaziel, on 04 October 2013 - 02:10 AM, said:

The part with Heavies and Assaults equipping them in addition to their direct fire weaponry to fend off lights...

Oh my god, your 35 ton robot can't fight my 100 ton robot and expect to win 95% of the time! Whatever shall we do? It's not like I'd blow you up in one 66 damage alpha if hit detection worked, or anything.

Best remove streaks instead. That 15 damage blast from my DDC is totally unfair.

[Cybermech]

So I started to play the kintaro yesterday and today.
I'm going to stop now.
Its not OP in anyway what so ever.
You can get high enough damage out of it however that damage is spread all over the place.
Even stealing kills is a hard enough thing to do.

Hit detection is not great with missiles and even streaks are effected by it.
When you use streaks as a prime weapon you really notice how much they miss (not including buildings).
From different heights to bumpy terrain, all effect how much streaks hit.

I'm sorry Kunae, was a great topic and needed to be looked at to make sure.
But the OP is wrong 100%.
Again ty for taking the time and putting a lot of effort into this thread.

[Imperius]

DemonRaziel, on 04 October 2013 - 02:10 AM, said:

The part with Heavies and Assaults equipping them in addition to their direct fire weaponry to fend off lights...

God forbid the come prepared. What do want heavys and assaults to drop weapon less while you prance in a 6 laser Jenner?

[Kaijin]

DemonRaziel, on 04 October 2013 - 01:56 AM, said:

please note that Jenners with 6 lasers and Spiders with moody hitboxes are not the only light 'Mechs in game. Relegating all of these to long range snipers (or LRM support in case of some Commando chassi, I guess?), as proposed earlier in this thread, is far from the problem solving answer, too.

My ER LLas builds were provided solely for such light drivers as insist on engaging SSRM-boats mano-a-mano. My Jenners rarely carry anything but MLas because I know how to hit 'R' and thus allow someone else who's got more armor execute the streak-boat.

Too, I am content to do drive-bys on bigger enemy mechs - put some damage on them, get 'em distracted, and then make a quick exit, only to re-appear somewhere else (after I've made sure everyone is where they ought to be and nobody is where they shouldn't). I don't give a damn if someone else gets the kill. My self-worth is not tied to my KDR in this game or any other game.

The only mechs I will get into a drawn out fight with are my opposite numbers on the other team, because obviously there are some light drivers who don't see the role the same way I do - They see it as a license to kill everything, and it really is. If KDR is important to you, drive light mechs, as MWO seems largely designed to make them shine. Many light drivers I encounter though - They don't want to stick around, because it's not so easy to fight a mech that is just as fast and maneuverable as they are. They'd rather be plugging away at some poor Atlas' backside.

Skill? Nah. Ludicrous advantage is what's at work here. SSRM-boats are like bulls on the gravy train.

[Rushin Roulette]

DemonRaziel, on 04 October 2013 - 02:10 AM, said:

The part with Heavies and Assaults equipping them in addition to their direct fire weaponry to fend off lights...

Yup.. and for those 1 or 2 Streaks that they can fit they are sacrificing the possibility of a SRM6 or a LRM20 launcher.
If they use up a wepaon slot in an Assault or Heavy for a SSRM2 launcher, then they are causing a lot less damage to your team than they theoretically could be doing... Congrats your job of causing your opponents to deal less damage to the rest of your team has been accomplished even before the match started.

[Flyto]

Meh. I have a Kintaro 19 that I designed to kill lights. It carries 4 pairs of streaks and some pulse lasers, and it moves at a little over 100kph.

Is it good for killing lights? Yes, if they choose to engage. But most things that it's a major threat to still have enough of a speed advantage to keep away if they want to. That means that it's good for killing overconfident lights, and for keeping lights away from the rest of my team. Which was sort of the point. And it isn't a guarenteed win. Sometimes I meet a light pilot who is simply better than me.

It hurts lights, but it's not a scary mech in general, to anything with a significant amount of armour. The recent Streak changes have put them in quite a good niche there, I think.


(Killing things with armour is what the *other* Kintaro is for, with the 28 SRM tubes :-))

Edited by Flyto, 04 October 2013 - 04:00 AM.

[dario03]

Cybermech, on 04 October 2013 - 03:00 AM, said:

So I started to play the kintaro yesterday and today.
I'm going to stop now.
Its not OP in anyway what so ever.
You can get high enough damage out of it however that damage is spread all over the place.
Even stealing kills is a hard enough thing to do.

Hit detection is not great with missiles and even streaks are effected by it.
When you use streaks as a prime weapon you really notice how much they miss (not including buildings).
From different heights to bumpy terrain, all effect how much streaks hit.

I'm sorry Kunae, was a great topic and needed to be looked at to make sure.
But the OP is wrong 100%.
Again ty for taking the time and putting a lot of effort into this thread.

And on the flip side I rebuilt my streakmando to compare to my srm commando (and to finish mastering commandos) and I would say they are OP (ssrm, not commandos). Probably averaging about 60% more damage with the streakmando since they don't seem to suffer from hit detection or at least no where near as bad as srm does. Also have no issues with the ssrm auto hitting unless I take a shot right before the enemy rounds a corner. And I will take those shots since you get so much ammo and generate so little heat it doesn't really matter. And really, why exactly does the auto hit weapon need a 25% damage bonus compared to the bugged slow aimed weapon?

Edited by dario03, 04 October 2013 - 04:09 AM.

[Imperius]

dario03, on 04 October 2013 - 04:08 AM, said:

And on the flip side I rebuilt my streakmando to compare to my srm commando (and to finish mastering commandos) and I would say they are OP (ssrm, not commandos). Probably averaging about 60% more damage with the streakmando since they don't seem to suffer from hit detection or at least no where near as bad as srm does. Also have no issues with the ssrm auto hitting unless I take a shot right before the enemy rounds a corner. And I will take those shots since you get so much ammo and generate so little heat it doesn't really matter. And really, why exactly does the auto hit weapon need a 25% damage bonus compared to the bugged slow aimed weapon?

Peef how many accounts do you use and have to back yourself up with? Or maybe this is an stjobe alt account. We need ip listings on the forum.

[DemonRaziel]

Imperius, on 04 October 2013 - 03:21 AM, said:

God forbid the come prepared. What do want heavys and assaults to drop weapon less while you prance in a 6 laser Jenner?

Again, you are responding to something else than what the point is. But I will patiently respond to your snarky comment: It's not a problem they use streaks, the problem is how streaks behave in relation to Lights and the implications of this, which I mentioned in earlier.

Rushin Roulette, on 04 October 2013 - 03:27 AM, said:

Yup.. and for those 1 or 2 Streaks that they can fit they are sacrificing the possibility of a SRM6 or a LRM20 launcher.
If they use up a wepaon slot in an Assault or Heavy for a SSRM2 launcher, then they are causing a lot less damage to your team than they theoretically could be doing... Congrats your job of causing your opponents to deal less damage to the rest of your team has been accomplished even before the match started.

Yes, they need to dedicate their missile slots for SSRMs to gain this advantage. Though the tonnage saved by using these instead of multi-tube short-range/long-range launchers can than be used on better engine, more armor and/or (and this is the most important part regarding the matter of dealing less damage, in my opinion) more and heavier energy and ballistic weapons. Weapons that work just as fine (or better, in fact) on lightest of 'Mechs as they work on the heaviest ones, provided you land a hit with them.

Kaijin, on 04 October 2013 - 03:26 AM, said:

Many light drivers I encounter though - They don't want to stick around, because it's not so easy to fight a mech that is just as fast and maneuverable as they are. They'd rather be plugging away at some poor Atlas' backside.

Skill? Nah. Ludicrous advantage is what's at work here.

I sincerely hope this is not meant seriously.

[dario03]

Imperius, on 04 October 2013 - 04:19 AM, said:

Peef how many accounts do you use and have to back yourself up with? Or maybe this is an stjobe alt account. We need ip listings on the forum.

Oh you caught me. Yeah I'm peef and stjobe! I just made this account 3 months and 10 months before my mains so that I could post in a manner completely different than how I usually do. I also like to post randomly between the accounts which is why my oldest account has much less posts. I know people usually make second and third accounts after the primary account but I just wanted to be different You see in reality this forum only has like 10 people on it, Most of us just have a ton of aliases and we argue with ourselves. It helps to have split personalities

Edited by dario03, 04 October 2013 - 04:44 AM.

[Imperius]

DemonRaziel, on 04 October 2013 - 04:20 AM, said:

Again, you are responding to something else than what the point is. But I will patiently respond to your snarky comment: It's not a problem they use streaks, the problem is how streaks behave in relation to Lights and the implications of this, which I mentioned in earlier.


Yes, they need to dedicate their missile slots for SSRMs to gain this advantage. Though the tonnage saved by using these instead of multi-tube short-range/long-range launchers can than be used on better engine, more armor and/or (and this is the most important part regarding the matter of dealing less damage, in my opinion) more and heavier energy and ballistic weapons. Weapons that work just as fine (or better, in fact) on lightest of 'Mechs as they work on the heaviest ones, provided you land a hit with them.


I sincerely hope this is not meant seriously.

I say it again learn your place. If you see SSRM boat don't engage if you do then accept the fate you chose. It's no different then me rushing a brawler in my sniper... The only difference is I don't make a post that he needs nerfed cause I should be able to play at all ranges... I know my place in the mech kingdom learn yours.

/END THREAD

[-Natural Selection-]

I don't think the ssrms ore op, nor the streak boat builds. They only put a hurt on you if you get jumped. We only built them to begin with to counter the 6 lights on the other team we were dealing with game after game.

[Rushin Roulette]

dario03, on 04 October 2013 - 04:37 AM, said:

Oh you caught me. Yeah I'm peef and stjobe! I just made this account 3 months and 10 months before my mains so that I could post in a manner completely different than how I usually do. I also like to post randomly between the accounts which is why my oldest account has much less posts. I know people usually make second and third accounts after the primary account but I just wanted to be different You see in reality this forum only has like 10 people on it, Most of us just have a ton of aliases and we argue with ourselves. It helps to have split personalities

Yup. thats the absolute truth there. Sometimes the only way to have an intelligent conversation here is to argue with yourself.

[Aym]

Imperius, on 03 October 2013 - 02:49 PM, said:

Ok I'll hold you hand

Scouting – Gathering information as a reconnaissance/stealth unit that gets relayed back to the rest of the friendly force.
Defense – The defender holds the ground gained by the offensive forces and protects those in need.
Assault – The assault role is for the tactical forward units whose primary role is to seek and destroy.
Command – The command role is split into two different levels, lance and company. Lance command falls to those in charge of up to 3 other players and assist in coordinated attacks on key targets. The company commander utilizes the 2 other lance commanders and all information being relayed back to him to make global calls on the battlefield.

Look at the word SCOUT ready to have your mind blown!

Scouts
Scouts are the main source of information on the battlefield. It is their utilization of Information Warfare that is the key to the success of a team. Scouts need to get to the front lines as soon as possible in order to gather information as fast as possible. They should utilize fast moving BattleMech which allow them to do so and at the same time allow them the opportunity to escape should the need arise. Advanced scout players will need to use scout Modules to enhance their abilities to detect enemies and relay information.

Suggested BattleMech Class: Light/Medium
Suggested Modules: Radar and Detection enhancements
Suggested Pilot Skills: Scout class skills

Don't see brawling (assault) listed hmm

If you still don't understand after that I suggest you get a scooby-doo lunch box, and apply for a disability sticker.

This went out the window when they designed ECM as the Be-All-End-All of Information Warfare. The old Pillars are dead, long live the Position at the time!

Edited by Aym, 04 October 2013 - 05:02 AM.

[Aym]

Rad Hanzo, on 03 October 2013 - 04:04 PM, said:

Spoiler

Dear Krivvan, did you ever see me pilot my Jenner lately ?
Not?
Hmmm ...

Just to get that out :
I´ve taken down 5 mechs as last Mech standing with a crit CT on Terra Therma in my Jenner (luckily none of them were Streaktaros, and 3 of them were already badly damaged)

I´ve eluded 9 Mechs on Frozen City for long enough to get my enemies bored and start a cap all the while I took down 4 of them (heavy and above class, medium to heavily damaged) AND survive that round because I couldn´t get back to the cap fast enough.

*More bragging and tralalala could be following, but ain´t nobody got time fo´ that, quiaff?*

I´ve driven people mad (hey there, Lokust Davion, ye olde Streak-kittie^^ ) with my Light piloting (except against those guys with pings below 70ms... HSR just doesnt register my shots properly and makes the battles go lopsided for me most of the time) and I´m mostly not a bad pilot and an above average shot, so please do not presume to lecture me about driving Light mechs, since I did this for as long as I was driving mechs (MW2 to clearly start with) and done so in this game since CB, not to mention my never strongly pursued FPS career which topped out as being training partner for one of Europe´s CS:S EPS team.

I love Light mechs and I think I know most of the time what I´m doing, when and how, except when I´m derping out and/or doing silly stuff

Greetings.

Red Hanzo,
You and I face off in matches. Krivvan is a GOD compared to you in a Light Mech.
Thank you,
"Atlai" Aym

[Kaijin]

DemonRaziel, on 04 October 2013 - 04:20 AM, said:

I sincerely hope this is not meant seriously.

Entirely. Most light drivers are shameless opportunists who wouldn't know what to do with themselves if the shoe was on the other foot, so to speak. Fortunately for them (in the short term anyway), PGIGP's Devs think an Inner Sphere ruled by light mechs is going to make their game enormously popular... just like their Jesus Box and 3PV will.

[Blacksoul1987]

I do agree that it is true that ssrm2's are strong against lights but regular srm's are especially garbage against lights cause their spreads are balanced against the chassis that are much larger. for example a srm6 hit on an atlas results in missles spread throughout its torso from the same range against a light it results in 1 or 2 maybe 3 missles hitting the mech and the others peppering the ground behind and that doesn't even take into consideration how tricky it can be to land volleys on a mech that is strafing at 150kph fix srms so that when you do hit the light mech with them they actually do damage and then I don't care what you do with streaks. and FYI my accuracy with ac20 is higher than streaks 72% for ac20 63% for ssrm2's so I don't care about your complaints about it being skill less to hit with them cause I can hit with ac20 and in fact I do better with medium lasers as well again not an issue......only reason I don't simply just bring more ammo for ac20 is cause if you lose that right arm you would only be left with 2 medlas and I used regular srms previously on it but even a well targeted shots do nothing but pepper the landscape. tighten the spread of srms and I will stop using ssrms on my victor

[stjobe]

Dozier, on 04 October 2013 - 04:53 AM, said:

We only built them to begin with to counter the 6 lights on the other team we were dealing with game after game.

I think you spelled "heavies" wrong there - lights are the least played weight class, even less played than mediums. Most people play heavies and assaults, and six lights on the other team is a statistical fluke, nothing you have to "deal with game after game".

More often than not, I'm the only light on both teams.

Edited by stjobe, 04 October 2013 - 05:53 AM.

[DemonRaziel]

Kaijin, on 04 October 2013 - 05:14 AM, said:

Entirely. Most light drivers are shameless opportunists who wouldn't know what to do with themselves if the shoe was on the other foot, so to speak.

True about any weight class. Many Assault pilots think they should win all because they have the heaviest 'Mech and pack the most weapons, but can't be bothered to actually aim those it at anything smaller than a Hunchback.

Bad pilots usually lose to better ones, unless they have other advantage on their side. The "poor Atlas" you referred to has got almost as much internals in CT as a Jenner/Raven has total CT armor + internals and more than a Spider/Commie/Locust... What exactly is the ludicrous advantage on the light Mech's side?

Kaijin, on 04 October 2013 - 05:14 AM, said:

Fortunately for them (in the short term anyway), PGIGP's Devs think an Inner Sphere ruled by light mechs is going to make their game enormously popular... just like their Jesus Box and 3PV will.

Just finished a game, with 6 Assaults, 5 Heavies and me in a Light 'Mech. Other side: 8 Assaults, 4 Heavies. Not a rare occurrence, either, that I'm the only Light, or maybe one of 2-3 Medium+Lights in the whole game. How is this game (or the IS by extension) ruled by Lights?