532 replies to this topic

[Trauglodyte]

Gorgo7, on 06 February 2014 - 09:26 AM, said:

Awesome 9M, stock build.
3 ERPPC, 20 DHS.
Try it some day. It'll change your outlook, smart guy.

Really?

AWESOME AWS-8Q 51 games played
AWESOME AWS-8R 45 games played
AWESOME AWS-8T 45 games played
AWESOME AWS-8V 48 games played
AWESOME AWS-9M 245 games played; 1 day 01:10:46 total time played

Gosh! I've never piloted an Awesome before. I wonder if I know what I'm talking about.

Edited by Trauglodyte, 06 February 2014 - 09:43 AM.

[Corvus Antaka]

Trauglodyte, on 06 February 2014 - 09:41 AM, said:

Really?
AWESOME AWS-8Q 51
AWESOME AWS-8R 45
AWESOME AWS-8T 45
AWESOME AWS-8V 48
AWESOME AWS-9M 245 132 113 1.17 227 136 1.67 77,543 157,448
1 day 01:10:46

Gosh! I've never piloted an Awesome before. I wonder if I know what I'm talking about.

Ditto. besides, the stock build is 3 PPC, not 3 ERPPC.

my quad erppc stalker is just fine thank you. my 1 erppc spider has a KDR of 2.78 and a w/l with 50% pugging at 1.48. I can usually do 300-1000dmg a match with a single erppc.

the normal PPC needs a heat nurf. the erppc is just fine. its pinpoint precise damage is extremely useful, and the 15 heat sets the correct bar for this gun to be used by skilled pilots. this is why most pilots use the normal PPC, it's basically super duper easy mode right now when combined with some low heat ballistics, and at 90-800m gives you the same pinpoint punch the erppc does.

I'd argue that if the PPC itself where theoretically removed from the game, the entire jumpsnipe meta would be much more balanced with the brawler/laser meta which currently barely exists due to the power & almost unlimited refire rate of easy mode setups like 2 or 3 normal PPC and some ballistics.

[Joseph Mallan]

Trauglodyte, on 06 February 2014 - 09:41 AM, said:

Really?

AWESOME AWS-8Q 51 games played
AWESOME AWS-8R 45 games played
AWESOME AWS-8T 45 games played
AWESOME AWS-8V 48 games played
AWESOME AWS-9M 245 games played; 1 day 01:10:46 total time played

Gosh! I've never piloted an Awesome before. I wonder if I know what I'm talking about.

Now compare it t the TT Awesome which was in fact Awesome and could sustain fire without shutting down just by firing on a 3;2 Cyclic rate. Our Awesome is not nearly 1/2 as good.

[Trauglodyte]

Joseph Mallan, on 06 February 2014 - 09:48 AM, said:

Now compare it t the TT Awesome which was in fact Awesome and could sustain fire without shutting down just by firing on a 3;2 Cyclic rate. Our Awesome is not nearly 1/2 as good.

I'm aware of that Joe. The point that I was trying to make is that it is possible to pilot the Awesome and do just fine. It doesn't have the ballistics so it gets hosed there versus the Victor. But, the ER PPC is fine and nobody is saying that you've got to run 3 ERs anyway. Quite frankly, that is just stupid due to their heat (was as bad in TT) and the fact that you can run 1 ER PPC, 2 PPCs, and 3 Md Lasers with 20 DHSs and a 375 XL. The 3 Mds, while not as potent as 2 ERs runs at 1/10th the heat for 5 points less damage while you can still hammer with your arm mounted ER.

Again, the problem isn't the ER PPC. Its that people don't know how to manage their heat and think that they can blaze away as much and as often as they want without any repercussions. Its as you've said in other posts, if you run beyond your line and get blown away due to stupidity, that is your fault. If you run 3 ERs and try to play without taking heat into consideration, you shutting down is your own fault. This isn't TT heat or recycle times - we've got to deal with it.

[Ngamok]

MavRCK, on 05 February 2014 - 06:36 PM, said:

bump

Necro bumping.

[Ngamok]

NRP, on 06 February 2014 - 08:46 AM, said:

Wow, this is an awesome thread! I can't believe I missed it back then.

The ERPPC is the poster child for "over nerf". The very same issues are going to be front and center again when the Clan mechs go live. Many of them have ERPPCs in their default loadouts.

People seem to have an irrational amount of hate for/fear of PPCs/ERPPCs, yet they seem to be perfectly happy with Ballistics Warrior Online.

It's mostly because everyone in 12s is running around with 2 PPC/ER PPC and 2 AC/5 because the speed matches so well and because of the distance and pinpoint damage. I see mwhighlander in his 2x PPC Jenner all the time. I see lots of guys in their HGNs and VTRs with the PPC / ER PPC AC builds all over and when they get too hot with the ERs they just fire the ACs till they cool off enough to alpha strike you again. If ERs are too hot, why are people still using them?

[Joseph Mallan]

Trauglodyte, on 06 February 2014 - 10:00 AM, said:

I'm aware of that Joe. The point that I was trying to make is that it is possible to pilot the Awesome and do just fine. It doesn't have the ballistics so it gets hosed there versus the Victor. But, the ER PPC is fine and nobody is saying that you've got to run 3 ERs anyway. Quite frankly, that is just stupid due to their heat (was as bad in TT) and the fact that you can run 1 ER PPC, 2 PPCs, and 3 Md Lasers with 20 DHSs and a 375 XL. The 3 Mds, while not as potent as 2 ERs runs at 1/10th the heat for 5 points less damage while you can still hammer with your arm mounted ER.

Again, the problem isn't the ER PPC. Its that people don't know how to manage their heat and think that they can blaze away as much and as often as they want without any repercussions. Its as you've said in other posts, if you run beyond your line and get blown away due to stupidity, that is your fault. If you run 3 ERs and try to play without taking heat into consideration, you shutting down is your own fault. This isn't TT heat or recycle times - we've got to deal with it.

I understand where you're going, but an Awesome should not do "Just Fine" It should be feared/respected on sight. Its called an AWESOME... Awesome isn't "Just Fine"!

A Devastator would not live up to the name if it had 2 AC2 and 4 small lasers now would it?

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 06 February 2014 - 10:44 AM.

[Ngamok]

Joseph Mallan, on 06 February 2014 - 10:42 AM, said:

I understand where you're going, but an Awesome should not do "Just Fine" It should be feared/respected on sight. Its called an AWESOME... Awesome isn't "Just Fine"!

A Devastator would not live up to the name if it had 2 AC2 and 4 small lasers now would it?

Awesome became watered down in the late 80s and early 90s.

And no a Devestator wouldn't

[Joseph Mallan]

Ngamok, on 06 February 2014 - 10:45 AM, said:

Awesome became watered down in the late 80s and early 90s.

And no a Devestator wouldn't

I never remembered the Awesome losing it swag. Someone saw 3 PPCs, the first thing they did was see IF there was a bigger Mech, then made the Awesome the primary kill target.

[Ngamok]

Joseph Mallan, on 06 February 2014 - 10:48 AM, said:

I never remembered the Awesome losing it swag. Someone saw 3 PPCs, the first thing they did was see IF there was a bigger Mech, then made the Awesome the primary kill target.

Meant the word was over used back then, lol.

[Trauglodyte]

Joseph Mallan, on 06 February 2014 - 10:42 AM, said:

I understand where you're going, but an Awesome should not do "Just Fine" It should be feared/respected on sight. Its called an AWESOME... Awesome isn't "Just Fine"!

A Devastator would not live up to the name if it had 2 AC2 and 4 small lasers now would it?

I get what you're saying. I just hate when people come here and start whining about things and then fail to realize that the reason that they can't is because they can't stop themselves. I don't ***** when I die cause I got a lil loose in my piloting or fail to control my heat and shut down. People need to take responsibility for what goes on in the game. I wonder, though, how Awesome it will be if the day ever comes where JJs are put back in their place. It makes me sad that the ground locked mechs are so secondary to their jump jetting brethren.

That being said, the ER is a tad hot. It'll be less acceptable if they ever give my bread and butter the spread that it had back in early beta.

[Joseph Mallan]

Ok An Awesome should be able to fire on a 3:2 Cyclic rate and say active all game zero shut downs It is how it was meant to be used. 16-18 double sinks should allow us to fire 2 ERPPC non stop/ no shut down. It is how it worked on TT and in fiction. Heck even making it so it could keep a 2,2,1 rhythm would be better than how we have it now.

[Almond Brown]

Joseph Mallan, on 06 February 2014 - 11:05 AM, said:

Ok An Awesome should be able to fire on a 3:2 Cyclic rate and say active all game zero shut downs It is how it was meant to be used. 16-18 double sinks should allow us to fire 2 ERPPC non stop/ no shut down. It is how it worked on TT and in fiction. Heck even making it so it could keep a 2,2,1 rhythm would be better than how we have it now.

Wasn't that 3:2 cycle in TT based on a 10 second round? So fire 3 wait 10 seconds, fire 2 wait etc etc. Likely in MWO if one had the discipline, they could also do 3 wait 2 wait and not have Heat issues given max DHS's.

Would that be an effective BattleMech when facing MWO's totally cool running, high fire rate same damage profile, Ballistic/PPC monsters? Apparently not!

[Joseph Mallan]

Almond Brown, on 06 February 2014 - 12:09 PM, said:

Wasn't that 3:2 cycle in TT based on a 10 second round? So fire 3 wait 10 seconds, fire 2 wait etc etc. Likely in MWO if one had the discipline, they could also do 3 wait 2 wait and not have Heat issues given max DHS's.

Would that be an effective BattleMech when facing MWO's totally cool running, high fire rate same damage profile, Ballistic/PPC monsters? Apparently not!

And the 10 second turn was fine for TT where 2 minutes of combat took 10 hours. It's called hand wavium cause for the purpose of the game it is a reasonable explanation. Once you go to real time handwavium needs to give way to the new physics. A MW:O turn is closer to 5 seconds +/- a second or two.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 06 February 2014 - 12:15 PM.

[Gorgo7]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 06 February 2014 - 09:46 AM, said:

Ditto. besides, the stock build is 3 PPC, not 3 ERPPC.

my quad erppc stalker is just fine thank you. my 1 erppc spider has a KDR of 2.78 and a w/l with 50% pugging at 1.48. I can usually do 300-1000dmg a match with a single erppc.

the normal PPC needs a heat nurf. the erppc is just fine. its pinpoint precise damage is extremely useful, and the 15 heat sets the correct bar for this gun to be used by skilled pilots. this is why most pilots use the normal PPC, it's basically super duper easy mode right now when combined with some low heat ballistics, and at 90-800m gives you the same pinpoint punch the erppc does.

I'd argue that if the PPC itself where theoretically removed from the game, the entire jumpsnipe meta would be much more balanced with the brawler/laser meta which currently barely exists due to the power & almost unlimited refire rate of easy mode setups like 2 or 3 normal PPC and some ballistics.

Wrong. The 9M comes equiped with three ERPPC's as stock. Check Smurfiy's.
Yaking about a spider with a single ERPPC is meaningless. In fact, the stalker you speak of I doubt you play much since the heat nerf, esp. given the way you rhapsodised about the spider. I think you're talking through your hat.
The ERPPC is too hot.

[Joseph Mallan]

Gorgo7, on 07 February 2014 - 05:28 AM, said:

Wrong. The 9M comes equiped with three ERPPC's as stock. Check Smurfiy's.
Yaking about a spider with a single ERPPC is meaningless. In fact, the stalker you speak of I doubt you play much since the heat nerf, esp. given the way you rhapsodised about the spider. I think you're talking through your hat.
The ERPPC is too hot.

If the ER PPC makes 15 heat per shot, it is not to hot. It is working as it has for 25+ years.

[Gorgo7]

Joseph Mallan, on 07 February 2014 - 05:32 AM, said:

If the ER PPC makes 15 heat per shot, it is not to hot. It is working as it has for 25+ years.

Not a tabletop game anymore as has been discussed above.

[Joseph Mallan]

Gorgo7, on 07 February 2014 - 05:34 AM, said:

Not a tabletop game anymore as has been discussed above.

Don't care. The game is based in the CBT Universe, is Using CBT weapons and Combat vehicles. So you play a game based on CBT you follow CBT rules closely. MechWarrior is part of the franchise, named after the guy driving a Mech. You don't go into SWTOR and say Jedi need to be allowed blasters. PPCs are the hottest running weapon in the game. They are supposed to be punishing if used without restriction. PPCs are perfect.

[Bishop Steiner]

Lupus Aurelius, on 06 October 2013 - 10:22 AM, said:

Their range is on par with AC5 / UAC5, and shorter than Gauss and AC2, and only slightly longer than the AC10.

and their "extra range" is largely a unicorn as you have to be shooting at oblivious targets or Stalkers for them not to dodge at extreme range with the laughable projectile speed. If they are going to keep the crippling heat, they need to drop the Projectile Speed nerf, and the minimum range for PPCs. (Heck they even just took the emp effect away at sub 90 meters so I can't even use them to defeat ecm on circling lights for streaks to work. WTF?)

[Gorgo7]

Thank you Bishop!
Your feelings and logic are reciprocated.
Good post.