111 replies to this topic

[William Mountbank]

Just throwing a fact around: The Spider carries 5.9 tons of FF armour, the Locust 3.9. So the Spider has 50% more armour.

I also still can't get over people reporting that every match is a bloodbath, with the poor assaults not even reaching the ridge before that Spider-5V has ripped through all 12 enemy mechs. I wonder why Spider pilots even bother dropping with armour and max engines when they just need to stand still to win?
Sadly, even after 800 Spider matches this still doesn't work for me.

[dario03]

Coralld, on 18 October 2013 - 06:38 PM, said:

In my honest opinion I still say the 3S Streak Locust is the best out of the 3 because 4 Streaks tends to kill any Light mech. The 3M is also good but the Jenner is better.
Is it just me or have other people notice that the Locust suffers from abnormally large leg hit boxes like the Raven? I mean, I have fired shots that clearly went in between a Locusts legs and yet it still takes damage.
Also, the Spider is broken as hell. I know Garth thinks that the Spider is fine but I believe he is smoking some pretty strong stuff if he thinks that.

I assume by 4 streaks you mean 4ssrm2 and not 2ssrm2? Wouldn't you have to strip basically all of your armor to do that? That's 6 tons of weapons, plus ammo, and either take bap or hope no enemy has ecm around you. I know it can be done but seems like there would be a lot of downsides. The 2ssrm2 build can be done pretty easily but I wouldn't expect it to be beating other lights.

[Satan n stuff]

dario03, on 19 October 2013 - 02:42 AM, said:

I assume by 4 streaks you mean 4ssrm2 and not 2ssrm2? Wouldn't you have to strip basically all of your armor to do that? That's 6 tons of weapons, plus ammo, and either take bap or hope no enemy has ecm around you. I know it can be done but seems like there would be a lot of downsides. The 2ssrm2 build can be done pretty easily but I wouldn't expect it to be beating other lights.

I've seen some with 4 Streak SRM2s, but it is ridiculously heavy for a Locust, especially if you want BAP with that. 8.5 tons of weapons and ammo on a mech that only weighs 20. A 190 XL engine plus heat sinks have a total weight of 9 tons, endo steel internals weigh 1 ton, leaving only 1.5 for armor, with a smaller engine you could save some more weight, but that means you lose the one advantage you have over most other lights. There's also only a 2.5 ton difference between an 190 XL and a 100 XL once you add the required heat sinks, so lowering your engine rating only gives you a tiny bit of tonnage in return. Going without BAP or using fewer streak launchers makes it useable, but not exactly optimal. SRM2s on the other hand you can easily mount 4 of with a 190 XL, being only 4 tons plus 1-2 tons of ammo. You could even use that energy hardpoint if you want. That makes you terrible at fighting most lights but it's a pretty decent striker build as long as you don't get overconfident and get a bunch of streaks fired at you.

I expect the Locust will be appreciated a bit more when there's no longer 3-4 light killers on every team, at the moment lights are so common that nearly every mech that can is boating streaks. That likely means we'll need to wait until the public release of the Thunderbolt to see what it can actually do as at that point the number of Locusts and Shadowhawks ( which is a common streak boat ) being used should drop dramatically. I expect lights will temporarily more or less go extinct once the Shadowhawk is available to those that didn't buy the phoenix package.

Edited by Satan n stuff, 19 October 2013 - 03:11 AM.

[Christof Romulus]

I think that this needs to be said, because people haven't made the connection just yet:

Head Armor (All mechs): 18
Locust CT armor: 20 (4 rear)
Locust RT/LT armor: 16 (4 rear)
Locust RA/LA armor: 12
Locust RL/LL armor: 16

What does this mean? A Locust using an XL engine is LITERALLY a walking headshot waiting to happen.

Everything above the legs is the equivalent of a cockpit, and eating a shot from the REAR is unacceptable.

[Bors Mistral]

While I do think that the Locust could use some more internal HP in a few spots, that's not what annoys me the most with that mech.

What really gets me is how freaking easy it seems to be to damage your own legs just driving it around, especially considering how fragile they are to begin with...

[Corwin Vickers]

All you have to do is wave some lasers under a locust to double leg it.

Whether or not the mech itself is too big, the leg hit boxes are clearly much much bigger than the graphics suggest. Preemptive nerf to prevent whining with the influx of locusts.

[CrimsonOdyssey]

The problem with the locust is not the amount of armor it has. Sadly once again PGI made the mech too big. In comparison to the Jenner it is almost the exact same size but weighs 15 tons less than the jenner.

What this equates to is easy kills on a locust due to the mech being too easy to hit. If the mech were smaller (like it should be) it would be less easy to hit and thus not be as easy to 1 shot.

The Locust should in all actuality be the smallest and hardest mech in the game to hit by far, just because of it's weight (which should correlate to a smaller size than any other mech), but at the same time it should still be able to be 1 shot because armor and internals are fairly balanced (and PGI won't be able to balance armor ratings any better).

[Wine O]

Locust is a poorly designed and poorly performing mech that had no business being part of an $80 package in it's present state. Yes, any fool can have a good match in any mech - including a locust - but I am certain if PGI looks at the statistics of the locust performance in combat it will show how much of a lemon it is. I have never killed so many mechs (and been killed) with one shot like I have with a locust. It's not fun for the person getting smoked and takes no skill on the part of the killer. Shoot enough rounds blindly and you can hit anything. Skill alone will never polish that ****. If we were offered a chance to play in a tourney where all survivors were guaranteed to win a million bucks, who amongst you would even consider dropping in a locust? Of course you wouldn't. The locust adds nothing interesting to the game except another chance to give braggarts desperate for attention a forum to say how awesome they are in a terrible mech. The prosecution rests it's case.

[Coralld]

dario03, on 19 October 2013 - 02:42 AM, said:

I assume by 4 streaks you mean 4ssrm2 and not 2ssrm2? Wouldn't you have to strip basically all of your armor to do that? That's 6 tons of weapons, plus ammo, and either take bap or hope no enemy has ecm around you. I know it can be done but seems like there would be a lot of downsides. The 2ssrm2 build can be done pretty easily but I wouldn't expect it to be beating other lights.

It is with 4SSRM2s, and yes, it does have issues with ECM but I am either in a Light swarm or I stick with the main body of my team and provide Anti-Light mech support while my team provides the Anti-ECM. Sure you can mount just as much Streaks on bigger mechs but you can't chase Light mechs down in them, with a Locust however you can. Its not a mech you want to go galavanting off in by your self unless it against a Light mech you know does not have ECM.
Its really fun running down and eating those annoying troll MG Spiders who think is funny as hell to be able to tank 12 mechs while shooting at and possibly killing at least 1 of your teams Atlases.

[Voidcrafter]

I'm okay with it dieing so fast - after all... they're like trucks in real life that weight about the same?
Try shooting a truck with a tank and observe the results.
Now does it seems familar?

When weight balance(like drop-weight balance) is adjusted right there could find some better games - until then...
You've chosen to pilot 20t mech! Wth do you expect?
Will any reasonable player find a reason no not pilot this if they were like the old Raven 3L?
They can go with 170 as far as I know - so that's something too.
I really can't get you light pilots... if you want to endure sh*t - go for a heavy/assault mechs.
Stop blaming the others for being able to hit you!

[Corwin Vickers]

Well the speed cap we have right now is artifical. The locust is lighter than everything else thus it should be able to go faster right? Well they can't because the game engine can't handle it.

If you're going to be light with no armor or weapons you'd want to be fast.

So that just makes it a bad choice when other mechs do the exact same thing only better in every way.

To top if off PGI decided to make it's little delicate stems have hitboxes the size of elephants. It's actually easier to hit a locusts legs than it's body.

Also people paid real money and they want to use it.

This is why you see complaints.

[Ngamok]

Like I said before, once lobbies are here and you can set up 12 vs. 12 Locust games, the Locust dies too easy compared to it's other light buddies.

Edit: Until that happens, I've sold off the 3m and 3S though the 3S as a stream boat would be good at some point.

Edited by Ngamok, 22 October 2013 - 09:29 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Khobai, on 17 October 2013 - 01:36 PM, said:

Then why would you ever play a Locust? When you can just play a Jenner and survive the same AC20 to the leg?

You are not thinking about the bigger picture. Youre just thinking a 20 ton mech should be fragile. Yes thats true it should be. But if its so fragile thats it blatantly inferior to other options then theres a problem. Locust needs to be toughened up.

I would play it to be a Scout not a combat unit. And FYI We shouldn't survive a AC20 to the leg either on a Jenner. The AC20 was a Mech killer weapon. Now its just a medium heavy hitter.

[MizarPanzer]

Because locust will die to a 20-point alpha most of the time (any hit other than arms) where a spider can take 2 such hits at each of its location. That buffs its survivability exponentially. Because the next hit you get on the spider is unlikely to be the same location you got him before.

[Satan n stuff]

MizarPanzer, on 22 October 2013 - 12:41 PM, said:

Because locust will die to a 20-point alpha most of the time (any hit other than arms) where a spider can take 2 such hits at each of its location. That buffs its survivability exponentially. Because the next hit you get on the spider is unlikely to be the same location you got him before.

A fresh locust with enough armor and the right armor distribution can survive one AC/20 hit if it lands anywhere but the rear torso. Legs are 16+8=24 each, sidetorsos are max 20+10=30 each, but more likely 21-25 in front, CT is max 24+12=36, usually well over 20 in front and the head is completely irrelevant.
Of course it still can't survive nearly as many of them as any other mech, but if it's built right it's not automatically dead if it takes that hit.
Also since we're comparing locusts to spiders here, I'd like to point out that in a duel locusts actually do really well against them, especially the ones with streaks. The laser locust is at a slight disadvantage here, though not enough that the more skilled player wouldn't win most of the time but this matchup is nigh impossible for the machine gun locust as it's outgunned by any spider. The only way the machine gun locust could win is if the spider starts to heat up before the locust is to badly damaged. Expect the machine gun spider to consistently beat the machine gun locust ( but not the streak or laser locust ) as it doesn't have that weakness.

[Christof Romulus]

***** n stuff, on 23 October 2013 - 06:31 AM, said:

A fresh locust with enough armor and the right armor distribution can survive one AC/20 hit if it lands anywhere but the rear torso. Legs are 16+8=24 each, sidetorsos are max 20+10=30 each, but more likely 21-25 in front, CT is max 24+12=36, usually well over 20 in front and the head is completely irrelevant.
Of course it still can't survive nearly as many of them as any other mech, but if it's built right it's not automatically dead if it takes that hit.

Thankfully, when someone fires an AC 20 they are not firing any other weapons at the same time at the same target - the instant that starts happening though, may whatever deity the Locust has programmed belief in have mercy on it's fusion engine...

[kongman]

the spider is a broken mech , it has bugs in its hit registry

[Kaspirikay]

Because spiders got a 2+ invulnerable save.

[Linkin]

Just put lasers only on the locust, paint it black, and pretend it is a TIE Fighter with legs. Works for me

[Pjwned]

ClumsyKlutz, on 17 October 2013 - 10:45 AM, said:

The Spider is completely broken.
Problems with the hitboxes as far as i know.
Just 15min ago i had a spider(standing) in front of my lasers, and it was hit by multiple alpha strikes, larges lasers and ppcs.

4 or 5 complete hits with all weapons, no damage to the spider.

It's kinda discouraging to walk around in a heavy mech and get killed by indestructible spiders.

I had a similar experience not long ago trying to kill a spider with my LB10-X, and even after hitting it multiple times it didn't die while standing about 100m away, completely ridiculous.