338 replies to this topic

[Will9761]

bump for Crabs

[HammerSwarm]

Knightshadowsong, on 16 February 2014 - 07:50 PM, said:

I'm sorry. Crab and King Crab are Parifrancy mech's. SOOO out of date that every major and minor power in the Inner sphere stopped using them YEARS ago (according to Lore) Plus as cool as another all energy mech would be. there just so Ugly that they'd make an anorexic start eating again.

I'd like to see something a bit more... Current time line like Mauler. (Case in point the Awesome shouldn't even be available yet because it was made AFTER wave one of the clan invasion.)

I am unaware of the lore you speak of. Referencing Sarna http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Crab I know that production was restarted in 3050.

The king crab was a clan buster so I don't know what you are talking about. there either.

The goal of this package is to add utility which was is thus far unfilled:

• The Crab is an all energy guerrilla fighter designed to last. If and when we ever get a reinforcement mode You'll see energy mechs take off again. Why? because how much ammo would you need to survive 4 waves of enemies? more than a single mech can carry. She how that utility for future projected gamemodes is unfilled?
  
• The KingCrab is an area denial assaults and counter to stupid Jager Builds. A king crab is a jager's natural predator after all. It'd be 100 tons of armor and death waiting for you around every corner. Unlike a jager with limited ammo that has to make itself vulnerable by lessening armor and using an XL to have 2x AC 20s the King crab wouldn't need to make those sacrifices, but would be an even bigger target for mediums and lights.

Two unfilled roles, two mechs perfect for those roles.

It's a slam dunk.

[Critical Rocket]

Out of date? Old designs? Sorry Knightshadowsong but by that definition virtually every 'mech in the Inner Sphere isn't worth using by the great houses. TRO 3025 has 'mechs that were around during the Star League if not all of them so how does this logic work exactly? The Star League era designs such as the Crab and King Crab fell out of use not because of their supposed obsolescence, it was because the tech used in them (XL engines, ER large lasers, CASE etc.) became extremely rare and producing that tech became impossible after the numerous Succession wars.

Couple this with the fact that the Star League or House Cameron didn't give out their improved versions of exisiting designs to the other houses willly nilly. So the remaining Crab and King variants that had Lostech probably either ended up going with the Exodus forces or being left in Brian Caches for later use.

I am interested though, could please link this lore you reference? Considering the fact Hammerswarm pointed out, mentions that production on these designs started up again in 3050 because of the rediscovery of Lostech would suggest that they are not out-dated at all. Consider that the Orion is freaking ancient and was around during the same period as the Crab and King Crab the arguement just doesn't make sense Shadow.

Remember the Inner Sphere isn't the high tech gleaming paradise it once was. Entire production complexes built specifically for certain chassis's where destroyed and the the people who knew how to build these 'mechs were either killed or the designs where lost to time. Comstar are the reason several designs came back because they maintained a store of Star League equipment to fight the clans on Tukkayid.

[Coralld]

And thus the lord said "Let there be crabs."

[Ragnar Darkmane]

Coralld, on 17 February 2014 - 08:26 PM, said:

And thus the lord said "Let there be crabs."

And crabs there shall be, at least we all pray for the arrival of our saviors ^^!

[Ragnar Darkmane]

Also got a signature template for you guys, put it in your sig and let it be known that we want the crabs in the game!
Just mark everything below, and Ctrl + C, Ctrl + V it into your sig:

RAISE YOUR PINCERS TODAY AND VOTE FOR THE CRABS: http://mwomercs.com/...ng-crab-thread/

Edited by Ragnar Darkmane, 19 February 2014 - 09:11 AM.

[Carnifex125]

This must happen!
PGI, I am (and it would seem many others are) willing to dish out the cash for this mech, required mech bays, its variants, and likely a cool beans paint job for the KGC

[GalaxyBluestar]

“Hello, mechwarriors, look at your mech, now back to mine, now back at your mech, now back to mine. Sadly, he isn’t like my energy stalker, but if he could use a crab that had all the energy and mobility wanted then that sig mech would be my crab mech. Launch mech, start up sequence, now what are you driving? The best energy boat needed for speed as well as armour maybe your mech can pew pew like my sig mech. What’s in your head, back to my mech. We want it, it’s an crab with two pincers that can act as door shields you’d love to use better than a stalker. Look again, no longer stuck in hunchback, Anything is possible when you campaign hard enough for good mechs. I’m on a crab.”




i know it's a slap dash effort but i couldn't help myself.

[GreyGriffin]

The crab is the first 'mech model I ever owned.

[Knightshadowsong]

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/King_Crab

Sorry to say guys, but I'm right about it being obsolete, Built in 2743, and the current time line is about 3015. I'm not saying that the idea wouldn't have some value. But again, THE MECH IS JUST SOOO UGLY!!! I've debated over HOW they would do a cosmetic make up for this thing, but seriously, I want NEW mech's. Not oversized clunkers from more then 100 years ago (Atlas excluded from that because it's just that bad ass)

Personally I don't care if it's put in, but look the stats on that thing, it's slow as frozen molasses and just wide enough that it's CT might as well have a target painted on it with 'shoot here' in bi bold letters. Give me the something like the Cerberus if you want a 100 tonner. something that doesn't look like someone who was blind with arthritis drew it.

[Knightshadowsong]

Now let me make one thing clear. I'm not totally againsed this, but really, I kinda want PGI to focus on Clan Mech's. and NOT SCREWING THEM UP. The Thing is, for evey 1 clan mech. I think we should get 2 IS mech's. I'd like to see a lot of features put in first before we start dealing with stuff like this.

So, one thing is, Yes, Crab and King Crab would be welcome to me (weather or not I use them is in the air) But there are a lot cooler mech's out there that could fit the bill quite nicely.

[HammerSwarm]

Knightshadowsong, on 19 February 2014 - 03:46 PM, said:

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/King_Crab

Sorry to say guys, but I'm right about it being obsolete, Built in 2743, and the current time line is about 3015. I'm not saying that the idea wouldn't have some value. But again, THE MECH IS JUST SOOO UGLY!!! I've debated over HOW they would do a cosmetic make up for this thing, but seriously, I want NEW mech's. Not oversized clunkers from more then 100 years ago (Atlas excluded from that because it's just that bad ass)

Personally I don't care if it's put in, but look the stats on that thing, it's slow as frozen molasses and just wide enough that it's CT might as well have a target painted on it with 'shoot here' in bi bold letters. Give me the something like the Cerberus if you want a 100 tonner. something that doesn't look like someone who was blind with arthritis drew it.

The year is 3051 in game right now. This took me a while to understand so I'll explain it. The technology in the star league circa ~2700 exceeds the tech availible in 3025. This is due to near endless space war and the destruction of factories, and deaths of countless scientists, engineers, and academics. So until an event where the helm memory core was discovered the tech wasn't as good as Star League Tech. So TRO 3050 is the first to reflect LosTech. The crab might be old, but it's still better than the crap that was being made prior to 3050.

So the king Crab and Crab are old, but are nicer than several new things.

If you need another way of putting it imagine a devastating event on earth where most people die. Can you make a micro processor with the items you have in your home? nope. In 100 years when the population has rebounded some and we've recovered will our future children rediscover micro processing? probably. especially if the books survive.

[HammerSwarm]

Knightshadowsong, on 19 February 2014 - 03:52 PM, said:

So, one thing is, Yes, Crab and King Crab would be welcome to me (weather or not I use them is in the air) But there are a lot cooler mech's out there that could fit the bill quite nicely.

As to your other points the Cerebrus looks cool but is 3054 which is ahead of our time line. Breaking time line is bad and should be kept to a minimum.

If you'd like to know more about the helm memory core http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Helm_Memory_Core

And this one for Los Tech http://www.sarna.net/wiki/LosTech

Glad you're not anti crab, Some one would probably pinch you! Thanks for the bumps!

[GalaxyBluestar]

Knightshadowsong, on 19 February 2014 - 03:46 PM, said:

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/King_Crab

Sorry to say guys, but I'm right about it being obsolete, Built in 2743, and the current time line is about 3015. I'm not saying that the idea wouldn't have some value. But again, THE MECH IS JUST SOOO UGLY!!! I've debated over HOW they would do a cosmetic make up for this thing, but seriously, I want NEW mech's. Not oversized clunkers from more then 100 years ago (Atlas excluded from that because it's just that bad ass)

Personally I don't care if it's put in, but look the stats on that thing, it's slow as frozen molasses and just wide enough that it's CT might as well have a target painted on it with 'shoot here' in bi bold letters. Give me the something like the Cerberus if you want a 100 tonner. something that doesn't look like someone who was blind with arthritis drew it.

LOL

ORION

PRODUCTION YEAR 2456

ARGUMENT IS MOOT!

edit; orion was never a pretty mech and in MWO it looks like it's made out of duplo. horses for courses mate.

Edited by GalaxyBluestar, 19 February 2014 - 05:06 PM.

[Tesunie]

Knightshadowsong, on 19 February 2014 - 03:46 PM, said:

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/King_Crab

Sorry to say guys, but I'm right about it being obsolete, Built in 2743, and the current time line is about 3015. I'm not saying that the idea wouldn't have some value. But again, THE MECH IS JUST SOOO UGLY!!! I've debated over HOW they would do a cosmetic make up for this thing, but seriously, I want NEW mech's. Not oversized clunkers from more then 100 years ago (Atlas excluded from that because it's just that bad ass)

Personally I don't care if it's put in, but look the stats on that thing, it's slow as frozen molasses and just wide enough that it's CT might as well have a target painted on it with 'shoot here' in bi bold letters. Give me the something like the Cerberus if you want a 100 tonner. something that doesn't look like someone who was blind with arthritis drew it.

Commando: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Commando - Production year 2463
Spider: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Spider - 2650
Locust: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Locust - 2499
Firestarter: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Firestarter - 2550
Hunchback: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Hunchback - 2572
Cicada: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Cicada - 2740
Kintaro: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Kintaro - 2587
Shadowhawk: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Shadowhawk - 2550
Griffin: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Griffin - 2492
Wolverine: http://www.sarna.net...28BattleMech%29 - 2575
Catapult: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Catapult - 2561
Orion: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Orion - 2456
Thunderbolt: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Thunderbolt - 2491
Awesome: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Awesome - 2665 <- Older than King Crab apparently... Not clan era.
Stalker: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Stalker - 2594
Highlander: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Highlander - 2592
Victor: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Victor - 2508
Battlemaster: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Battlemaster - 2633

King Crab: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/King_Crab - 2743 <- Is NEWER than most mechs already in the game...
Crab: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Crab - 2719 <- Is also NEWER than most mechs already in the game...


Unless I am seriously missing something, I'd say it'd be nice to get some "newer" tech into the game, such as the Crab and King Crab...

[Tesunie]

Some people have even asked/speculated that the Mackie could be injected into the game at some point.

Mackie: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Mackie - 2439
(PS: Mackie was the first mech ever created...)

[HammerSwarm]

Tesunie, on 19 February 2014 - 06:50 PM, said:

Some people have even asked/speculated that the Mackie could be injected into the game at some point.

Mackie: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Mackie - 2439
(PS: Mackie was the first mech ever created...)

Another slow lumbering utility mech without a clear purpose or role in combat. Less armament than an atlas with the similar large lumbering body type. I wouldn't shell out 9-15m c-bills per.

The mackie is the perfect illustration of why the king crab would be a good choice for the next assault mech. The mackie offers no further utility over an atlas except that it's gun arm is mounted at shoulder height. The King crab is an entirely new body style and has a fearsome armament.

The mackie would be a joke without a complete hard point overhaul. 1 AC 10, 1 PPC, 2 Medium Lasers. My BJ 1 puts out the same Alpha, and moves faster.

The king crab with a few actuators removed in the arms would be a fearsome killing machine.

[Critical Rocket]

@Knightshadowsong
You're looking at the year of deployment and thinking that like the real world, older tech is less advanced and thus obsolete. Battletech however has a major event in the fiction or lore as some may refer to it, in that House Cameron created the Star League. Basically the league was all of the major houses working and cooperating for mutual benefit. Technology advanced tremendously for the great houses, but the best equipment such as C.A.S.E, BAP, Streak SRM 2's, ER Large Lasers, ER PPC's, Ferro Fibrous, Endo Steel and more are all Star League era advancements.

Now this tech was better than what you see in 3049 and thus many designs such as the Crab, King Crab, Black Knight and more used some of this tech exclusively by House Cameron's royal brigades. However when the Cameron's were betrayed by Stefan Amaris of the Rim world republic it sparked a massive civil war as the forces of the SLDF (Star League Defence Force) fought against the traitor and usuper Amaris in a brutal conflict that ravaged the Cameron worlds. Kerensky was successful and afterwards took his forces in exile beyond the periphery to try and maintain the values of the league.

Now the other houses (Kurita, Steiner, Davion, Liao and Marik) stayed out of the war between the SLDF and Amaris with the hopes that they could either gain more power and influence over the winners government and gain access to a larger supply of Star League tech. For example a SLDF Warhammer may have had an XL engine, ER PPC's or double heatsinks, while a House Davion Warhammer of the same period would have had normal single heatsinks, PPC's and a STD engine. Now this is an example and not an actual Warhammer but it's to illustrate the difference in tech levels between the Star League and the Houses.

The reason battlemechs like the Crab aren't used anymore is not because they are obsolete, but because the design required items like Double Heatsinks, certain communications equipment, XL engines etc. which for a long time where impossible for Inner Sphere techs to reproduce as the knowledge of their construction was lost over the centuries of war between the Successor States, i.e. the Succession Wars. These wars destroyed entire worlds, ruined industry and came extremely close to sending humanity into a new dark age. Fortunately the Ares convention altered a lot of this and Comstar became a sort of mediator between the Houses.

When the Gray Death Legion discovered the Helm Memory core the knowledge of the Star League became available once again after centuries of being lost. This is why we have 'mechs like the Highlander which is a Star League design and by your definition should be obsolete by the way.

Now you want PGI to focus on getting the clans right, but you have to realise that the clans in this game will be very different from the tabletop or earlier games. With all the changes made to the current lineup of weapons and equipment the clans will have to be different. This doesn't mean they won't hold that advantage for which they are well known for, it will just be different from older Mechwarrior games.

On the point of visuals, have you seen the original artwork and then compared it to the new designs? Trust me, PGI would do a great job with the Crab and King Crab. The sig used by Hammerswarm in fact shows you the artwork created for MWO if they added these two mechs. Compare those to the original and they look ten times better, but why does it matter if the 'mech looks good? The battlefield function of these 'mechs are what is important and Hammerswarm has laid out his reasons for these being added very well in the original post.

And finally Knight, check Tesunie's post above and see that your date of production arguement doesn't stand. Please read up on the differences between Star League, Inner Sphere and Clan tech before posting about obsolete designs etc.

[Coralld]

Tesunie, on 19 February 2014 - 06:45 PM, said:

Commando: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Commando - Production year 2463
Orion: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Orion - 2456

Oh god the Commando and Orion are old!! And yet their still alive and kicking.

[Fang01]

Tesunie, on 19 February 2014 - 06:50 PM, said:

Some people have even asked/speculated that the Mackie could be injected into the game at some point.

Mackie: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Mackie - 2439
(PS: Mackie was the first mech ever created...)

Guilty. I've also called for Ymir http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Ymir

Hammerswarm can hate all he wants. The Mackie fits current meta perfectly, especially the definitive MSK-9H which features an ac20, 2xppc, and 2xmlas.

Don't get me wrong, I'd like to see everything get in eventually including his crustaceans, I'd just like to see the OG stuff get some love first