45 replies to this topic

[Hayashi]

Ping: 284-294ms.

With recent patches my hitreg is getting worse. Now I can paint targets all day long with medium lasers and do only 350 damage (aka, 14 full hits). I fired 5-laser alphas at least 30 times, probably closer to 40, indicating only about 40% of the shots are being registered. And this is on Assault and Heavy mech targets, where speed-related hit registration is not much a problem. Previously, hit registration used to be 90% on target for heavies and assaults, while ~ 50% on lights.

On the other hand, I seem to be getting hit normally by enemy fire. Previously, when I had bad hitreg on others they also had bad hitreg on me, and vice-versa. Now it's like they're shielded and I have a bullet magnet.

Any similar/contrasting experiences from other 250+ ms ping folk?

---

In addition, does anyone with <50ms ping have the same issue? If all low pingers don't have hitreg problems and all high pingers do, it's clearly a ping-related issue; if everyone regardless seems to have hitreg issues, it may be something else causing the problem.

Edited by Hayashi, 13 November 2013 - 04:21 AM.

[ShinVector]

Hayashi, on 11 November 2013 - 10:41 PM, said:

Ping: 284-294ms.

With recent patches my hitreg is getting worse. Now I can paint targets all day long with medium lasers and do only 350 damage (aka, 14 full hits). I fired 5-laser alphas at least 30 times, probably closer to 40, indicating only about 40% of the shots are being registered. And this is on Assault and Heavy mech targets, where speed-related hit registration is not much a problem. Previously, hit registration used to be 90% on target for heavies and assaults, while ~ 50% on lights.

On the other hand, I seem to be getting hit normally by enemy fire. Previously, when I had bad hitreg on others they also had bad hitreg on me, and vice-versa. Now it's like they're shielded and I have a bullet magnet.

Any similar/contrasting experiences from other 250+ ms ping folk?

I think you are flaying about with lasers at 250+ms ping which is broken...
Other than that the people hitting you are probably using ballistics where HSR works better unlike lasers.

A person can only see things from his own view.

I feel that ghost hits is happening more now.. Just hate it when you leg suddenly turn red core when there was no indication or impulse that you were hit by anything.

I prefer to attack heavy and assaults nowadays at well. At least I know that my lasers will hit some part of the big mech though it may not be the compartment, i am aiming for.

[Hayashi]

Spectating high ping players also seems to show rather strange aiming (generally, aiming way off target), while spectating lower ping players gives more expected behaviour.

I shot a Shadowhawk earlier moving backwards in the right torso because I was expecting the hitreg compensation to then damage his centre torso at that speed. It blew off his left arm instead even though my beam never crossed that component at all. It's like the mechs are all 2 seconds off where they look like they are.

[ShinVector]

Hayashi, on 11 November 2013 - 11:01 PM, said:

Spectating high ping players also seems to show rather strange aiming (generally, aiming way off target), while spectating lower ping players gives more expected behaviour.

I shot a Shadowhawk earlier moving backwards in the right torso because I was expecting the hitreg compensation to then damage his centre torso at that speed. It blew off his left arm instead even though my beam never crossed that component at all. It's like the mechs are all 2 seconds off where they look like they are.

I won't say 2 seconds off... Even 250-300ms off is really a long time in game time where actions are taken <150ms.
Online fighting games are worst off where some moves need to be done at intervals of 17ms.

[Hayashi]

At its speed, 0.5 seconds was the amount of time needed for the Shadowhawk to back its CT into the position I shot at however. I was stationary (because summing two angular velocities would throw hitreg completely out the window, even though it's kind of suicidal for a Locust to be stationary). For that beam to hit its arm it really has to be 2 seconds behind schedule - which is puzzling given how even 2x 300ms should lead to only a 0.6 second ping correction.

I don't have an estimate at present as to my own mech's speed's effect on where I'm shooting however. It's all over the place.

Edited by Hayashi, 11 November 2013 - 11:19 PM.

[ShinVector]

Hard to assume what happen... Nvidia Shadowplay (Post 10min on the fly video dump) is your friend if, you can use it !

[Hayashi]

Shadowplay isn't useable for laptops at the moment, not yet. I'll see if I can get a video up about it sooner or later via MSI.

[ShinVector]

Hayashi, on 11 November 2013 - 11:36 PM, said:

Shadowplay isn't useable for laptops at the moment, not yet. I'll see if I can get a video up about it sooner or later via MSI.

Just so you know.. Probably going to be the same crappy broken HSR issue that I post about before.
I have a may have a more recent video of me not being able to finish off a stinking Shadowhawk because of lag shield..
Didn't upload it.. I may have deleted it hmm..

Eg.

Edited by ShinVector, 11 November 2013 - 11:58 PM.

[GrandLocomon]

I've consistently experienced atrocious hit detection this last patch as. I watch the enemies paper dolls not changed despite alpha striking them and seeing the lasers hit. My ping is always over 300. Hit registration has never been worse for me than this last week.

[hoverstorm]

Come on, PGI. In warthunder, one can easily hit another player's plane even with 300ms latency. The planes too have different components, so don't tell me its harder because its more complicated in mwo because of the different parts and guns. In addition, they have a realistic physics engine.

The fact that they are still in open-beta and have a more polished game ain't helping MW:O.

Edited by Eirikr Sim, 12 November 2013 - 08:59 PM.

[Troutmonkey]

I'm from Aus and notice HSR has gotten considerably worse since the magical days when PPC and ballistics got fixed during beta.

It's really bad now, though I've always had around 250-300 ping

[Arguss10]

I am having the same problem also here in West Australia.My ping hovers between 280 - 320 ping and hit detection has been getting worse over the last month or so. Trying to hit a spider right now is almost a waste of time as I hit him with 2 er lrg and 3 med lasers front on 3 times and never showed any damage at all.

[GrandLocomon]

Please everyone here submit a support ticket about this with your experiences so the devs notice. I can barely scratch assault mechs, let alone lights; the game is unplayable right now for me... very frustrating because I really like playing this game... even LRM boating isn't working for me and that usually works when my ping gets too high (not that that's fun anyway, but hey).

[GalaxyBluestar]

just dropping this in, a quote addressing the conversation that ac's are being fielded more and dominate overall play probably due to hit reg and recent heat management nerfs for lasers...

GalaxyBluestar, on 12 November 2013 - 09:32 PM, said:

anyways i'm begining to doubt my validations, yes the heatmanagment learning curve and the damage over time ratio being greater is why people are fileding more ac's but i'm also thinking that faster weapons counter the latency which plays against a lot of things but shouldn't be a part of the weapons balance... directly anyways. however it does scare the judgement and the resulting behavior leads to shifts in meta like the one percieved at the moment.

for example, the gauss charge is fine hold when target is found let go when you're cursor is lined up. simple stuff however how's the damage output to someone suffereing lag?



perfect hit sparks flying on that BM yeah gauss is fine L2p etc.

but if this happens too often



and this becomes a trend i could easily percieve the gauss as being weak and could start a pgi you've ruined the gauss thread. BTW the BM has moved 9M in 6 seconds so he's a sitting duck for me to shoot. you can see the end of the sparks as my shot hits but no damage even a target like this has to be lead.

edit: yes that's a laser boat BM... he lost against mr can't hit for system screwups and a hunchi.

this has been the problem for game balance since day 1, lots of conflicting reports are made due to this hit detection issue.

i get the feeling my ping and/or rig isn't entittled to gameplay balance anymore, these experiences screw the validation although i still see a lot of ac's on the field. but like i said i think it's because people don't like heat managment in general and more frontloading shots means you could proberbly land more damage overcoming lag issues.

posted in this thread

i can confirm for you hayashi high pingers have it baaaaaaad.

the devs can look up my recent exploits in my sig mech {stalker 5m} and compare the damage out put this month to when HSR was first introduced. my accuracy has fallen from 91% down to 88.

Edited by GalaxyBluestar, 13 November 2013 - 02:51 AM.

[Hayashi]

Eirikr Sim, on 12 November 2013 - 07:45 PM, said:

Come on, PGI. In warthunder, one can easily hit another player's plane even with 300ms latency. The planes too have different components, so don't tell me its harder because its more complicated in mwo because of the different parts and guns. In addition, they have a realistic physics engine.

The fact that they are still in open-beta and have a more polished game ain't helping MW:O.

Thing is, MWO DID have good hitreg for lasers some time ago. The hitreg degradation is a recent issue (after they fixed the previously atrocious ballistics hitreg). They can probably fix it once they know what the problem is.

[HarlekinEO]

You can test the location of the mechs with a tag. Maybe it helps you, to figure out, how worse the hit registration is for you.

[ShinVector]

HarlekinEO, on 13 November 2013 - 03:22 AM, said:

You can test the location of the mechs with a tag. Maybe it helps you, to figure out, how worse the hit registration is for you.

Please show us a video of how TAG helps.. LOL.
You must understand that HSR is broken and we do not fully understand where and how it is broken, no thanks to PGI.

Now when it comes back to leading... It is extremely hard to predict and lead shot, especially with lasers.
I try and sometimes get it right but it is very very hard.
How to I describe it... Say your ping is 250ms... You the enemy make in front of but he is actually +250ms ahead of time where you are seeing him right now. Now you want to hit him.
Do you hit the one you see or where you predict he is going to be in +250ms time ?
See the problem for us here ?

Anyway the +250ms thing is just a speculation on my part.. I am not sure for far the time desync really is. Usually 1-3 mech distances away.

Edited by ShinVector, 13 November 2013 - 04:09 AM.

[Hayashi]

What he's probably talking about is the red crosshair effect. Essentially, the crosshair only turns red when the server registers an actual hit from any weapon. TAG is unique in that it can be maintained forever - and TAG also turns the crosshair red, so some players use it to 'spot' the actual location of a mech before unloading with the rest of their lasers - which thanks to having no travel time will also hit if the TAG hits.

A video with the red crosshair TAG would show how different the 'actual location' of the enemy mech is relative to where it looks like it is.

Still too damn busy IRL, but should be able to record next week.

Edited by Hayashi, 13 November 2013 - 04:18 AM.

[ShinVector]

Hayashi, on 13 November 2013 - 04:15 AM, said:

What he's probably talking about is the red crosshair effect. Essentially, the crosshair only turns red when the server registers an actual hit from any weapon. TAG is unique in that it can be maintained forever - and TAG also turns the crosshair red, so some players use it to 'spot' the actual location of a mech before unloading with the rest of their lasers - which thanks to having no travel time will also hit if the TAG hits.

A video with the red crosshair TAG would show how different the 'actual location' of the enemy mech is relative to where it looks like it is.

Still too damn busy IRL, but should be able to record next week.

I know what he meant.. I want him show us how feasible it is...
If only it gave us an indicator where the mech really is like X-wing vs Tie Fighter had auto leading indicators. I dunno still...
They just gotta fix HSR.. I wanna see how SC does in their dogfight Alpha.

[Hammerhai]

The empirical impression I get is that, yes, I hit less, and most certainly get hit a lot more in the CDA I run at the moment.
Ping 280 avg (This has also gone up from 270) with an unquantifiable amount of lag spiking up to + 400.

In fact is there a utility available which would monitor ping during a game session? That would help hugely in at least measuring the quality of the connection. Maybe one of our hobby coders like Sjurwareagle could help?

I have lost count how many times my front armour simply evaporates and I go straight from running at full speed to death screen with no warning.