68 replies to this topic

[MeiSooHaityu]

Arden Varr, on 22 January 2014 - 09:45 AM, said:

I for one am really enjoying the new glass effect. It's quite striking at times on some maps, but honestly I hardly notice it once the battle starts. To me it's jsut a little bit more immersion, and I'm all for it. That said, as soemone posted before the way the new glass reacts to the light and environment seems a little off, but I'm sure that cna be adjusted down the road. that or I'll stop noticing and it won't matter to me anyway.
Looking forward to when they turn on the crack/damage feature, but I hope they apply it in moderation as too much of it could hurt visibility too much (realism or no, there's a limit to what even reasonable people will tolerate). I figue that's why it's not released yet, they're fine-tuning how bad the cracks get. Hopefully, it only cracks on the cockpit taking damage, that'll save me a glance at the displays.

Yea, I am hoping that the damage glass won't take effect until the head is pretty well damaged (like no armor and orange internals). Some people will still hate it, but I would find it acceptable.

[RapierE01]

Yeah i love the Cockpit glass. Its a very cool thing. More of those Immersion quirks please

[Equalizer]

Cockpit glass is a really cool feature indeed.

[LORD TSARKON]

SpiralFace, on 22 January 2014 - 09:03 AM, said:

This. So much this.....

That cockpit glass took a single artist about 2-3 days to do the whole lot, and then a shader artist to get the effect in game.

People who think that a simple geo object and texture job REPLACED a feature demanding massive amounts of developers and designers need to get their heads checked.

And that Shader needs to be fired... because its a pisspoor job.....

The Glass Reflects all lights sources... even if those Light Sources are supposed to be covered by the MEch Itself (this is why so many people are having more Glare FACING AWAY from the SUn,ect)... the back of your MEch should COVER/BLOCK the Light Source but because it was horribly written and coded that is not the case.

People are getting Sun Glare in the CAVE on Forest Colony....

PGI needs to Hire competent Programmers

Edited by LORD TSARKON, 22 January 2014 - 01:53 PM.

[Belorion]

They could stand to tone down the effect just a tad.

[Wanzer MkII]

Roadbeer, on 22 January 2014 - 09:14 AM, said:

I said "Maybe" as I'm not sure if they're in the same skill set or not, but I do know that the rest aren't.

The ignorance on these forums is stunning, for the love of God please tell me you don't vote.

Look, my point is not to have artists code and coders art. (Yeah, I used art as a verb.)

It's more of an overall focus issue. There is just so much of this game that is left missing. I mean, I have a real love/hate relationship with MWO. The very basics of Mech combat are awesome, but that's all we have right now. It's a promise of an awesome future game.

When something like this comes out, it gives the allusion that attention that is sorely needed elsewhere isn't there. Not to mention I don't really see what this adds. In my opinion the whole thing is superfluous.

Yeah, the art people that did the window aren't doing the coding. But I'm guessing CW is going to need a ton of art assets as well. So are they taking focus from that to do a stupid window? I don't know, but that's what it looks like.

[Roadbeer]

Wanzer MkII, on 22 January 2014 - 02:21 PM, said:

Yeah, the art people that did the window aren't doing the coding. But I'm guessing CW is going to need a ton of art assets as well. So are they taking focus from that to do a stupid window? I don't know, but that's what it looks like.

Need to have a canvas to put your art on.
CW is still on a cocktail napkin, so the artists need something else to do.

[LauLiao]

MeiSooHaityu, on 22 January 2014 - 11:04 AM, said:

Yea, I am hoping that the damage glass won't take effect until the head is pretty well damaged (like no armor and orange internals). Some people will still hate it, but I would find it acceptable.

Agreed. Would make a wonderful "Valkyrie needs food badly. Valkyrie is about to die" warning. (Yeah I pulled out the Gauntlet reference)

Wanzer MkII, on 22 January 2014 - 02:21 PM, said:

Look, my point is not to have artists code and coders art. (Yeah, I used art as a verb.)

It's more of an overall focus issue. There is just so much of this game that is left missing. I mean, I have a real love/hate relationship with MWO. The very basics of Mech combat are awesome, but that's all we have right now. It's a promise of an awesome future game.

When something like this comes out, it gives the allusion that attention that is sorely needed elsewhere isn't there. Not to mention I don't really see what this adds. In my opinion the whole thing is superfluous.

Yeah, the art people that did the window aren't doing the coding. But I'm guessing CW is going to need a ton of art assets as well. So are they taking focus from that to do a stupid window? I don't know, but that's what it looks like.

And how do you know that all other art assets weren't put on hold because of say some coding issue that needed to get worked out first? It could be that one guy was sitting around one day with nothing else to do while he waited for someone else in some other department. Would you rather that guy sit around and do nothing or he spend the day adding cockpit glass?

[Dan Nashe]

I don't mind it. It maybe looks neat.
Agree that they really need the cockpit to not be hollow in the back and for the texture on the outside, otherwise it risks ruining immersion rather than helping it.

That said, since I run everything on minimum and turn everything off that I can, it doesn't have much to contrast it with in terms of light sources ;-).

1600 x 900; motion lur off, v-sync off, system specifications low (everything in advanced off). .
30-40 fps.

(AMD 6100 Six-Core, 10 GB RAM, GeForce GTX 650Ti, not great, but oh well).

[KAT Ayanami]

It does not bother me much. But again, I havent hit all the maps yet.

[SpiralFace]

Wanzer MkII, on 22 January 2014 - 09:06 AM, said:

I'm guessing artists don't code the new artwork into the game, do they?

No they don't. That is what engine tools are for. To have a tool set that the artists can dial in effects and the like and spit them to the engine without bothering dev. If EVERYTHING depended on Coders to integrate into the engine, then nothing would get done because it would make a sever bottle neck.

If you are an artist working in games, you better know your way around engine tools and know enough high level code concepts to understand what the tools are doing. Its part of the job description.

Wanzer MkII, on 22 January 2014 - 09:13 AM, said:

So your saying the same people could be working on new and better maps? Got ya.

Also false. Your comparing apples to oranges. Its not like there is a general "artist" term that gets thrown around (Just like there is no generic "game developer" job description.) Everyone has a specialty. Just because you are a level designer / artist doesn't mean you know engine shaders (as that is what a tech artist is for.) Nor does a vehicle / mech artist usually know much about organic design or level flow.

Everyone has their own specialized tasks, and that is how side projects get done. My guess? The artists that make mechs that have no issues it seems making their deadlines had a small side project for immersion and ran with it. It wouldn't detract from levels because that actually takes a Level designer. You don't need a Level designer to make cockpit glass. Nor would a vehicle artist be much help designing additional levels.

[Sabazial]

LauLiao, on 22 January 2014 - 03:26 PM, said:

Agreed. Would make a wonderful "Valkyrie needs food badly. Valkyrie is about to die" warning. (Yeah I pulled out the Gauntlet reference)

I put way too much money into that game back in the day, man.. am i really that old?

[GRiPSViGiL]

I really like it.

It gives people with a great sense of awareness and visual acuity something to separate them from people who don't.

[Wanzer MkII]

Roadbeer, on 22 January 2014 - 03:00 PM, said:

Need to have a canvas to put your art on.
CW is still on a cocktail napkin, so the artists need something else to do.

Well I can't argue with that one.

[Wanzer MkII]

LauLiao, on 22 January 2014 - 03:26 PM, said:

Agreed. Would make a wonderful "Valkyrie needs food badly. Valkyrie is about to die" warning. (Yeah I pulled out the Gauntlet reference)



And how do you know that all other art assets weren't put on hold because of say some coding issue that needed to get worked out first? It could be that one guy was sitting around one day with nothing else to do while he waited for someone else in some other department. Would you rather that guy sit around and do nothing or he spend the day adding cockpit glass?

Look, maybe I didn't explain myself right.

You guys are stuck on "artists don't code" and yeah, I get that. They had an art guy sitting there doing nothing so we came up with cockpit glass. If the artists have so much extra time to put out pointless items while important things like CW and UI 2 are still in development, well then, maybe they have too many artists and not enough developers.

That is the point. They are putting too much "resources" on things that don't actually improve the game. Cockpit glass doesn't improve the game.

Fix the game, then polish it.

[mania3c]

Wanzer MkII, on 23 January 2014 - 08:41 AM, said:

Look, maybe I didn't explain myself right.

You guys are stuck on "artists don't code" and yeah, I get that. They had an art guy sitting there doing nothing so we came up with cockpit glass. If the artists have so much extra time to put out pointless items while important things like CW and UI 2 are still in development, well then, maybe they have too many artists and not enough developers.

That is the point. They are putting too much "resources" on things that don't actually improve the game. Cockpit glass doesn't improve the game.

Fix the game, then polish it.

and again you don't understand concept of development in big teams..

in big studios and teams "resources" are not always money.. more often..resources are "manpower" and "time".. they have these coders, artists, many departments..so your idea is that other departments should just stop doing their job just because CW is still not there?

Or do you believe that when you are dealing with concept like CW, if you will throw another 10 people into it, it will develop faster?? both are wrong.. first of all..you really can't throw 10 coders into one thing..it doesn't work..it slows things down.. Also, you really can't put 5-6 different designers and lead roles into one specific job and expect it will somehow come faster..again..it will again slow things down..you are thinking like typical high manager in some publishing house who has no idea how things works but feel he has to be important and tell people what they should be doing..

fact is..there is only so much people you can put into one project or part of the project..you really can't make typical circle "design, code, test, gather feedback, repeat", faster just throwing people into it..

In the same time..these teams also have their own boards with "to do" list..they finished they rounds of mechs, weapon models, etc..clan mechs have time..so it was time to work more on immersion thing..which has to be done anyway at some point..cockpit glass is most probably job of people, who are dealing with mechs, technical art assets, etc..basically they had guy who developed that shader and texture, and other guys who mapped this into cockpit UVW ..none of these would help to develop CW or UI2 faster nor their are cutting resources of other teams..because it's more about manpower and time..not money as many may think..

Edited by mania3c, 23 January 2014 - 09:57 AM.

[SpiralFace]

Once again, Mania3c has the right of it.

Tell me, can you paint a picture faster if you get more guys on it? Can you file your taxes faster if you go to multiple brokers? Can you get to work faster if 2 people drive a car instead of one?

There are some tasks that can be divided, and then there are tasks that can't. CW will be a massive task that takes multiple piece to be built simultaneously. Sure multiple people can do it. But only one guy can get the "grand vision" outlined, only the leads can look at that division and break out WHAT tasks can be divide up to everyone, and THEN you can get all the individual tasks to those that can do it.

Having the guys at the bottom work on side projects or things that are unrelated isn't going to hurt the future things when the guys at the top are still figuring out what to do.

Edited by SpiralFace, 23 January 2014 - 10:50 AM.

[MrSilky]

I thoroughly hate the new cockpit glass. I'm a relatively new player, having started in November or December. Lot of things I dislike but I can see the potential in the game, even made my first MC purchase a few weeks ago.

Fired up the game today to play a few rounds and this dirty glass in the cockpit is triggering a headache. I don't care if you guys love it, that's great, but can we have an option to turn it off? Until it's gone or there is an option to disable it, I will not be playing.

[kesuga7]

Just make the ice melt on cockpit glass when playing on cold maps

when your mech begins to reach higher temperatures
and re-appear when it cools

doesn't have to be fancy
could just fade out

[mack sabbath]

If everything from cockpit shake to tinted glass cause such an alarming degree of nausea, headaches and bleeding eyes, might I suggest a doctor or perhaps an aggressive therapist?

I swear the moist underflesh of some pilots here is so sensitive, water must be an irritant.

Sheesh.