1126 replies to this topic

[Amsro]

Osric Lancaster, on 15 April 2014 - 12:31 PM, said:

Put on your futility hats ladies and gents, it's time to poll this up.

http://mwomercs.com/...odule-revision/

Spoiler

If I could get someone with a page one response post to include this it'd probably help it's visibility.

On page 1!

[SVK Puskin]

Finally something which will balance teams in terms of weight class, you should add this long long time ago! I just hope that match making system will work in terms of skill.

[Aym]

Craig Steele, on 19 April 2014 - 07:01 PM, said:

I raised the point originally as it goes to my view as to why actual player activity might be a higher proportion of solo drops than groups as I suspect that your "demographic" is a larger than many assume. By my read of these two statements, I can add another couple of "views" that suggest that.

I guess what it comes down to in my mind is that "team play" for all it's benefits is not a utopia for everyone, and any successful game should be able to accommodate as many people as possible.
...
Accordingly some people need to put aside their personal agenda's and wants and embrace other peoples needs to ensure the sustainability of the bigger picture.

And this is the core point of contention many of us have with your point of view. Yes people like Winter, and myself, and any number of other "team players" who drop solo when they want to, for reasons you've outlined among many others, such as being the 5th-player, etc, are heavily influencing the 84% number, yet these players do not WANT to be isolated from groups, and we feel the gameplay will suffer, communities will suffer, and ultimately the studio will suffer for the direction they're taking the launch module.

[Craig Steele]

Aym, on 20 April 2014 - 01:10 PM, said:

And this is the core point of contention many of us have with your point of view. Yes people like Winter, and myself, and any number of other "team players" who drop solo when they want to, for reasons you've outlined among many others, such as being the 5th-player, etc, are heavily influencing the 84% number, yet these players do not WANT to be isolated from groups, and we feel the gameplay will suffer, communities will suffer, and ultimately the studio will suffer for the direction they're taking the launch module.

So given you have incorrectly attributed me to the 5th man quote, what exactly is your point of contention with my view?

Because I'm suggesting you don't actually know what my view is if you are mis quoting me and hence not actually in contention with my view (whatever you think it may be)

[Craig Steele]

Randalf Yorgen, on 20 April 2014 - 08:46 AM, said:

and just how many "Thousands if not more" are there? source for your data please and not just speculation. Also many have said that they are playing something else for now but are just checking back in to see if the game has gotten any better.

I also found something from the 11th that you might want to think on, and it was even posted in these forums.


https://twitter.com/...746825929818112
@PiranhaGames[color=#00FFFF] said:[/color]
[color=#00FFFF]I'm hiring for an UI Engineer. Know someone great? in Vancouver, BC Canada [/color]http://bull.hn/l/1Z6XP/53[color=#00FFFF] #job [/color]

[color=#00FFFF]and [/color]

https://twitter.com/...744198714261504
@PiranhaGames[color=#00FFFF] said:[/color]
[color=#00FFFF]I'm hiring: Lead Software Engineer in Vancouver, BC Canada [/color]http://bull.hn/l/1Z6XH/27[color=#00FFFF] #job[/color]

It would seem that a few positions have come open in the PGI offices, I wonder why. All I can do is speculate with out hard facts. It could be that they quit or were fired or PGI has expanded, or maybe they had babies and are on maternity leave (Canada provides 1 whole year of time off for having a baby that can be split between parents if wanted) My point is, without the rest of the story, we have no way of knowing anything for certain except what we have figured out for our selves. Many of us have figured out that PGI isn't going in the direction that we find even slightly acceptable but we love the IP and the Battletech Universe.

What do you think is going to happen now that they are charging ahead with their very poorly thought out plan? Someone said "So what is 5K players quit, there are 1.6 million players so who cares" With no option to delete your account and with these free mech weekends generating thousands of second accounts (for sale no doubt once this becomes an E-Sport) that 1.6 million is actually much smaller. Remember how someone was trying to say that shrinking faction websites and lower TS severs usage was proof that the Solo que was the preffered style of game play, it could also be evidence of a shrinking, DRASTICALLY SHRINKING player base (notice I didn't say PROOF) Using that same evidence here it would be very fair to say that the 1.6 million number very inflated when compared against the present day, or even the past 90 day active player list. Some European sites have speculated that there are less that 75K players (I don't know how they came up with that number so it too is just speculation)

So if there are thousands who don't show up here who feel the same as the people who post here and seeing as how there is strong evidence that the player base is just a small fraction the size it was at it's peak. It would be fair speculation that both sides make up a larger percentage of the global community than we can see based on these forums. With different communities in agreement that the player base tiny it is a fair conclusion to say that if PGI drives the Casual Group Player away that they will be loosing much much more than 5K, I suspect much closer to 35-40K which will cause ripples for those who remain, such as longer que times and more matches being imbalanced at launch and that's just on the player side.

35-40k players leaving (along with their wallets), even if the player base is double what it is speculated to be, lets say 150K would still be a death blow to the game but it would be like a gut shot, long, slow and very very painful right up until the end.



So how's that for pulling numbers out of my ass of thin air that can't be supported with hard raw data and facts and then using them to base projections on? Although what I said sounds very plausible and is likely close to what will actually happen it is still speculation based upon unconfirmed numbers. I can make claims based upon those numbers all day long, it won't do a thing to make my argument any stronger. What it will do is draw out the Trolls who live on the other side of the argument.

So what is fact? PGI is going in a direction that many of us don't like, PGI is telling many of us that we are a very low priority and that our concerns don't warrant even the smallest effort from PGI to address. Many players are playing other games but are checking back in to see if the game has gotten any better, and then they go back to the other games that they have been playing. PGI is pumping out sales like crazy right now, care to speculate as to why? (maybe their budget has shrunk to a size where they had to cut some high priced positions and want to fill them with fresh out of school yes men who will work for penuts) but the truth is that PGI is hiring.

if this was the stock market investors would be dumping their stocks and heading for the hills, only the little guy would stay because he still has "Faith" that the company will do the right thing.

Randy,

I'm not sure why you berate Bloodwolf about speculating and then go on to speculate yourself over half a dozen paragrapaphs. Is your speculation any stronger than his?

The only paragraph in your post I found worth anything was the last one but that was a poor analogy at best.

An Investor might or might not run for the hills, but their decision would not be based on pure speculation. An Investor receives information to make informed decision.

Customers like you and me do not. Customers buy the product / service in front of them or they do not.

[Imperius]

Hmmmm.... This thread is still going? I wonder how many repeated back and fourth comments are here?

[Roadbeer]

Imperius, on 20 April 2014 - 06:53 PM, said:

Hmmmm.... This thread is still going? I wonder how many repeated back and fourth comments are here?

7

[Aym]

Craig Steele, on 20 April 2014 - 05:51 PM, said:

So given you have incorrectly attributed me to the 5th man quote, what exactly is your point of contention with my view?

Because I'm suggesting you don't actually know what my view is if you are mis quoting me and hence not actually in contention with my view (whatever you think it may be)

What 5th man am I including you in? Your post was questioning the reasons for not grouping, even through we are group players at other times, and this directly addresses why solo players do in fact want to play with groups. I contend that the majority of "solo drops" do indeed want to play with grouped players, and a solo-only queue would be worse than what we have now in terms of quality gameplay.

[Craig Steele]

Aym, on 20 April 2014 - 07:14 PM, said:

What 5th man am I including you in? Your post was questioning the reasons for not grouping, even through we are group players at other times, and this directly addresses why solo players do in fact want to play with groups. I contend that the majority of "solo drops" do indeed want to play with grouped players, and a solo-only queue would be worse than what we have now in terms of quality gameplay.

No, that was not my post. I never questioned anything of the sort.

In another thread I argued that one of the reasons that Solo dropping activity was higher then team drops in PGI's numbers was that I suspected the demographic Winter represents is much larger than some people assign it.

I went on to explain because I held this personal opinion, I had a different view on what the actual activity rate is.

Some of the people posting here disagreed with me at the time in that other thread. They felt that demographic was not as large as I portrayed. Indeed, some suggested I was making it up.

In this thread I sought to clarify Winters statement, as it (and yours) appears to suggest that I was not making it up at all.

But thanks for reading.

[Randalf Yorgen]

Craig Steele, on 20 April 2014 - 06:00 PM, said:

Randy,

I'm not sure why you berate Bloodwolf about speculating and then go on to speculate yourself over half a dozen paragrapaphs. Is your speculation any stronger than his?

The only paragraph in your post I found worth anything was the last one but that was a poor analogy at best.

An Investor might or might not run for the hills, but their decision would not be based on pure speculation. An Investor receives information to make informed decision.

Customers like you and me do not. Customers buy the product / service in front of them or they do not.

if you're Randy go have a shower.

I state my speculation is an example of what happens when you speculate. Further, the numbers I was using in my speculation were all supposed facts from posts that YOU have made in the past

What was sold to you just 9 months ago when you started the game isn't what I was ASKED to invest in at the start of closed Beta

And thanks for proving my point about the Trolls from the other side coming out when you speculate.

and once again no Smiley face or unapproved familiarity to try and show friendship where none exists

[Sandpit]

Can anyone tell me why the 12man queue can't just be opened to all sizes and solos that want to opt in yet?

[Craig Steele]

Randalf Yorgen, on 20 April 2014 - 07:24 PM, said:

if you're Randy go have a shower.

I state my speculation is an example of what happens when you speculate. Further, the numbers I was using in my speculation were all supposed facts from posts that YOU have made in the past

What was sold to you just 9 months ago when you started the game isn't what I was ASKED to invest in at the start of closed Beta

And thanks for proving my point about the Trolls from the other side coming out when you speculate.

and once again no Smiley face or unapproved familiarity to try and show friendship where none exists

I saw you based your speculation on some of my deductions, why wouldn't you. Mine are well thought out and reasonable so I am not surprised you adopt them. They have more substance than some of the pipe dreams and fantasies portrayed in forums as fact.

You didn't invest though did you Randy. You paid some money and got some MC and some mechs and a key to use the game under the relevant licence / ToU. You bought a product / service.

You're not a shareholder, not an investor. Your name is not on the company balance sheet.

You're a consumer.

Provide feedback by all means, I am sure the company will appreciate it. But don't portray you're entitled to anything more than any other consumer or that the company should fold in to your personal whims at the expense of others.

As for Trolls, since when has been correcting poor analogy's an instance of trolling? Or is this another case of anyone who disagrees with your opinion is just plain argumentative and wrong? Ergo you start with name calling?

You might have missed this earlier, so I'll just leave it for you to read. It describes your post closing pretty well imo.

Sandpit, on 14 April 2014 - 06:33 PM, said:

no it's just another example of
"I really have no rational reason or argument against anything they've said so I'll resort to attacking them to try and distract from their ideas and maybe even get them baited into attacking me so I can either derail the thread or get them moderated"

It's a pretty common tactic used around here

[Sandpit]

Craig Steele, on 20 April 2014 - 07:34 PM, said:

I saw you based your speculation on some of my deductions, why wouldn't you. Mine are well thought out and reasonable so I am not surprised you adopt them. They have more substance than some of the pipe dreams and fantasies portrayed in forums as fact.

You didn't invest though did you Randy. You paid some money and got some MC and some mechs and a key to use the game under the relevant licence / ToU. You bought a product / service.

You're not a shareholder, not an investor. Your name is not on the company balance sheet.

You're a consumer.

Provide feedback by all means, I am sure the company will appreciate it. But don't portray you're entitled to anything more than any other consumer or that the company should fold in to your personal whims at the expense of others.

As for Trolls, since when has been correcting poor analogy's an instance of trolling? Or is this another case of anyone who disagrees with your opinion is just plain argumentative and wrong? Ergo you start with name calling?

You might have missed this earlier, so I'll just leave it for you to read. It describes your post closing pretty well imo.

It's ok Paul, we get it, you don't like groups. Some of us do though

[Craig Steele]

Sandpit, on 20 April 2014 - 07:39 PM, said:

It's ok Paul, we get it, you don't like groups. Some of us do though

Yes, clearly I am Paul's alt and I don't like groups, or perhaps you missed this?

Craig Steele, on 17 April 2014 - 01:07 AM, said:

I prefer

PUG QUEUE

• Solo players
  
• Small groups (2 & 3 man) capped at one per side

TEAMPLAY QUEUE

• Groups with 2-12 players and Solo players that have opted-in*
  
• MM tries to match groups 1:1 starting with the largest groups first
  
• Then tries to find 1-2 equal or smaller groups to fill in any gaps (if any)
  
• Any leftover spots are filled with 1-2 solo players per team
  
• Max of 3 groups per team
  
• 1-2 solo players maximum per team (to minimize PUG stomps)

So as small groups (2&3?) can also have faster MM times, better mech selection opportunities / usage and the Solo PUG player experience is protected from stomps.

[Ceesa]

Ok, so when Paul says they have an idea on the back burner, does that mean I know to expect it to be implemented in 2023? I mean, considering just how crucial the clan invasion, launch module, and bug fixing has been, the back burner has to be so far down on the to do list that you really can't even count it being there.

[Sandpit]

Craig Steele, on 20 April 2014 - 07:48 PM, said:

Yes, clearly I am Paul's alt and I don't like groups, or perhaps you missed this?

uhm I wasn't calling you Paul.....

[Randalf Yorgen]

Craig Steele, on 20 April 2014 - 07:34 PM, said:

I saw you based your speculation on some of my deductions, why wouldn't you. Mine are well thought out and reasonable so I am not surprised you adopt them. They have more substance than some of the pipe dreams and fantasies portrayed in forums as fact.

You didn't invest though did you Randy. You paid some money and got some MC and some mechs and a key to use the game under the relevant licence / ToU. You bought a product / service.

You're not a shareholder, not an investor. Your name is not on the company balance sheet.

You're a consumer.

Provide feedback by all means, I am sure the company will appreciate it. But don't portray you're entitled to anything more than any other consumer or that the company should fold in to your personal whims at the expense of others.

As for Trolls, since when has been correcting poor analogy's an instance of trolling? Or is this another case of anyone who disagrees with your opinion is just plain argumentative and wrong? Ergo you start with name calling?

You might have missed this earlier, so I'll just leave it for you to read. It describes your post closing pretty well imo.

deductions based on unprovable data are only speculation so yes I used them to show just how stupid some people can be, again thanks for opening your mouth and proving me right.

You PURCHASE stocks and they are investments. When something is sold to you as an investment then it is an investment whether you are on the letterhead or not. Once again you are showing how little you know of how the world works.

I am entitled to what I was sold now aren't I. If someone Told you that you were buying a house with a yard and they delivered you a converted bus you would take it based on what you are saying. that's fine for you, a fool and his money and all that.

Correcting a poor analogy? was it poor? No you understood what I was saying but it cut against all your arguments so of course you claim it's wrong, what else would a troll from the other side do.

Now this, you are right, except it perfectly describes how you are here in the forums;

"your opinion is just plain argumentative and wrong" but I would add dismissive and showing signs of a god complex. You can get help but first you have to admit you have a problem.

Craig Steele, on 20 April 2014 - 07:48 PM, said:

Yes, clearly I am Paul's alt and I don't like groups, or perhaps you missed this?

So you have no idea what you want, go take your bipolar meds and get to bed.

[Craig Steele]

Randalf Yorgen, on 20 April 2014 - 08:02 PM, said:

deductions based on unprovable data are only speculation so yes I used them to show just how stupid some people can be, again thanks for opening your mouth and proving me right.

You PURCHASE stocks and they are investments. When something is sold to you as an investment then it is an investment whether you are on the letterhead or not. Once again you are showing how little you know of how the world works.

I am entitled to what I was sold now aren't I. If someone Told you that you were buying a house with a yard and they delivered you a converted bus you would take it based on what you are saying. that's fine for you, a fool and his money and all that.

Correcting a poor analogy? was it poor? No you understood what I was saying but it cut against all your arguments so of course you claim it's wrong, what else would a troll from the other side do.

Now this, you are right, except it perfectly describes how you are here in the forums;

"your opinion is just plain argumentative and wrong" but I would add dismissive and showing signs of a god complex. You can get help but first you have to admit you have a problem.


So you have no idea what you want, go take your bipolar meds and get to bed.

Ha ha aha ha ahaha

I love reading your posts Randy.

Consistently without fail you paint me as all the things you feel and express about yourself. You must be so angry with yourself? What happened Randy, why so much pain?

You say I need to understand how the world works but then tell me that you "purchase" an investment. hahahahahahahahahaha

You make an analogy about a house and a bus without appreciating the old "buyer beware" credos of life, but then of course you in your timeless wisdom and wordly life experieince (you did your 20 remember) would know that but if it doesn't suit your argument you don't make the correlation. Oh wait, did you say the same thing to me?

Your analogy was poor. Buying a Founders pack is not making an investment. Ergo it was poor. I didn't make an argument did I so it can hardly be "against" my argument. It was just a poor analogy. ANYONE who has actually made an investment in the sharemarket would know that.

You can add dismissive, you've been dismissive of anyone who questions your opinion for so long I am not surprised you like the word. It would resonate with your quite a bit.

And seeing as you never bother to read a thread before jumping in with your baseless acqusations you wouldn't know how wrong you are.

I know exactly what I want Randy, it's just that what you think I want is very different to what I actually want. If there are drugs that increase a persons reading comprehesion, you should maybe get a prescription. MIght ease your anger levels if you could understand what people are saying without overlaying your predisposed beliefs.

Before you post again, heres some words from a wise man for you to reflect on.

Sandpit, on 14 April 2014 - 06:33 PM, said:

no it's just another example of
"I really have no rational reason or argument against anything they've said so I'll resort to attacking them to try and distract from their ideas and maybe even get them baited into attacking me so I can either derail the thread or get them moderated"

It's a pretty common tactic used around here

PS, I am quite impressed with your progress Randy, thats three posts now without direct abuse. Soon I'll be able to introduce you to real people with a level of confidence in your manners and conduct.

[Roadbeer]

Tune in next week for another exciting episode of...






Craig Steele vs The Forum

Edited by Roadbeer, 20 April 2014 - 08:29 PM.

[King Arthur IV]

Sandpit, on 20 April 2014 - 07:26 PM, said:

Can anyone tell me why the 12man queue can't just be opened to all sizes and solos that want to opt in yet?

any idea on the same lines would be fine with me. even matching 3, 4man premades against a 12 would be fine with me.

i play in a time zone that basically gets no 12man love. the only way to get things rolling is to round up 24 players. finding 24 willing players even from a "large" corp is difficult.

Edited by King Arthur IV, 21 April 2014 - 06:23 AM.