191 replies to this topic

[Craig Steele]

Aym, on 30 April 2014 - 05:26 AM, said:

Except the conclusion you've drawn from the numbers presented is in no way a "fact." It's why you do solo, but there actual evidence in my thread listing reasons that people solo drop to make up that funny 84 percent number. Preferring to drop solo only is not one of the more common responses.

Bam, there it is.

"Actual Evidence"

lol

EDIT: PS, He did say "for whatever reason"

Edited by Craig Steele, 30 April 2014 - 06:12 AM.

[disarray]

team fortress 2 had perfect in-team voice chat in 2007.

it's pretty bloody sad MWO doesn't bother to have one. we wouldn't need to stuff around with teams or teamspeak if the mass of puggers could just press-to-talk.

maybe then you'd even make friends from people you keep bumping into who don't suck. and, dare i say it, go on to form teams with them?

easy integrated communication systems facilitating teamwork and co-operation? really???? SAY IT AIN'T SO!!!

(seriously, get with the freakin program already. 2007. tf2 has rocked it since 2000 and fkn 7)

[Magna Canus]

1453 R, on 29 April 2014 - 10:33 AM, said:

Let me tell you!


Pretty much, yep! Either that or adhere to strict attendance requirements – that’s the real deal-breaker for a lot of folks. I can and have gone months at a time without playing MWO – can you think of a single group that’ll put up with a player not being around for longer than three consecutive days? I asked people if they would, once. Notice nobody took me up on it.

No, there really aren’t. There really, really, really aren’t. Name me one group that’d be all “Sure!” when I come back after a month-long GW2 binge and say “You know what? I’ve got an itch to run me some Durgan tonight, who wants to go and do that thing?”

No there isn’t. Every single team out there, EVERY FROGGING ONE, requires a time commitment that I am unwilling/unable to make. There is an hours-per-week requirement, or a drops-per-week, or a “be here for Saturday night gametime or you’re out.” I have other stuff to do, I have friends beyond MWO, and I will be danmed if I let some two-bit goose-stepping power tripper tell me that making my weekly drop schedule is more important.

Yep! And I understand and accept that I’m at a disadvantage when I drop solo against what may very well be a premade lance. I read the articles and guides on silent cooperation with PUGlies, and I do my best to be a valuable member of any given drop even without voice coordination or a prebuilt lance. I’m cool with it. If I’m cool with it, why shouldn’t you be cool with me being cool with it?

First of all, because the notion of dropping in a group alongside some of the people I see in the GD section of the forums makes me physically ill. Second of all, because the people I’d like to drop with – Koniving, Void Angel, Redshift, and others who make the Guides and New Player Help sections of the forums into the excellent and helpful community that GD most emphatically is not – are already busy dropping with their actual buddies, for which I do not even remotely blame them. Third of all, because the only guild I’ve ever found where I’m welcome to play when, where, and as I like doesn’t play MWO.

Optimistic much? There’s plenty of reasons why this statement is not nearly as true as you might like, but that’s a discussion for a different thread.

It’s not instinctive. It’s a highly practiced, well-thought-out, and quite thoroughly tested intense dislike of the gibbering bassholes who populate the forums, long experience with avoiding second-job “Here’s your schedule, here’s your kit, you get one sickday a month, and we’ll tell you what you’re doing Saturday night” competitive guilds/units/whatevers, and the knowledge that the ‘Mechs I love to run are ‘Mechs that would get me thrown out of any half-decent unit no matter how good I am with them.

I play what I want, when I want, and with who I want. These three factors combine to ensure that there is not a single unit in the entirety of the greater MWO community which would take me, so why bother? I’ll just drop solo and take my lumps as I need to. It’s what I’ve done in every other MechWarrior game I’ve ever played.

Hey there,
I must have missed the post you noted at the top where you asked people if they were willing to have people that took longer breaks. I am not sure about other groups, but this is fine by the Golden Foxes. If we know what your situation is and you drop a note, we know what is gong on and things are fine.

We have a few people that need to be gone for weeks at a time, we even have a guy working on an oil rig for a month or more before coming back home. Communication is key. If we know what the deal is, we are fine with it. We have regular drop nights just like any other team, but they are optional, not mandatory. Because of other RL stuff I am usually not in those drop nights, but I am still a lance leader in our EU company.

So, if you do want to join a group that will accept your long pauses, join the Golden Foxes, the invitation stands. All we require from new recruits is that you sign up on our forum, drop a short hello this is me post, and drop on our TS server when time permits.

http://www.darkjedi....club/FOX/enlist

[Magna Canus]

Votanin FleshRender, on 29 April 2014 - 10:46 AM, said:

Yes, it's a team game. Which is why I find it so mind bogglingly stupid there's no ingame VoIP.

Personally, I did put up a post in the hiring hall. 95% of the PMs I got included the following phrases "interview process" "training programs" "weekly practice" "must be active" "TS and working mic" (I can't TS due to RL, although I can listen in). None of that sounds as *extremely* casual as I need to be (60-70 hrs a week working, 4 kids, great wife I won't ignore to play). I did join one very friendly, small group of folks, but their playing times were often not my playing times, and then I ragequit after 1 (well, more like 50) roflstomps too many.

But I'd love to be able to just drop in and hear my random team coordinate.

Mostly, I'm not very social. I tend to be very introverted by nature.

We have a space for you too. We have other members that can't talk on TS, but like to be a part of the team and enjoy at least hearing what the rest of his lance is saying/suggesting, etc. Drop by and give us a try.

[Craig Steele]

8

[GrandLocomon]

I dislike all the premades who complain about pug players, and how pug players don't want to join them. The zillion posts a day I see making fun of pugs... why would I want to join a team again? So I can hate on the pugs too? No thanks.

...Technically I am a part of the blue team XD

[Magna Canus]

StaggerCheck, on 29 April 2014 - 11:02 AM, said:

I'm all for playing in groups, but sometimes things can go wrong and you end up playing 1/2 the potential games you could have, had you just dropped solo for an hour. Case in point... say I form a group of four players, let's call them StaggerCheck, Mr. White, Mr. Pink and Mr. Orange... things tend to go like this after the first match... Mr. White: That was close match. I think I'm going to put LRMs on my Mech instead of these SRMs. Give me two mins in the Mech Lab. Mr. Orange: It's been five minutes, Mr. White. You done yet? Mr. White: Yeah, almost done. I thought this would work, but I’m having trouble finding another ton for more ammo. Mr. Pink: I’m ready to drop whenever. Mr. Orange: Mr. White…… Mr. White….. Mr. White: One sec, almost done! Mr. Orange: Paging Mr. White. Mr. White: Done! Ready to drop. Mr. Orange: Great, I’m ready too. StaggerCheck: Ready up, Mr. Pink. Mr. Pink? Where the hell is Mr. Pink? We’ve been waiting for five minutes. Mr. White: Can we drop without him? We’re wasting time here. Mr. Pink: Sorry! My cat got hit by a hotdog cart. Fluffy looks like she’ll be ok, though. Ready to drop! [Match ends in a loss] Mr. Orange: Well, that sucked. We got rolled pretty badly there. Mr. Pink: Yeah. Brb… Fluffy is walking in circles for some strange reason. Mr. White: Yeah, that game sucked. I didn’t get any good locks with my LRMs… too much ECM, I guess. I’m going to refit my SRMs… give me two minutes in the Mech Lab… brb

LOL, been there, done that. There is no shame in telling the guys that you are going to go solo for a bit until they are ready, or asking the guy outfitting his mech to drop group and tinker in peace until he is ready.

Communication is key, mature units will understand your reasons.

[Joseph Mallan]

GrandLocomon, on 30 April 2014 - 06:46 AM, said:

I dislike all the premades who complain about pug players, and how pug players don't want to join them. The zillion posts a day I see making fun of pugs... why would I want to join a team again? So I can hate on the pugs too? No thanks.

...Technically I am a part of the blue team XD

You've been on the Red team as far as I have seen.

[Viges]

The only reason to join team now - easier wins. No cw, no any team-based missions/achievements/content. So why do you want to join a team? Because you suck as lone wolf.

[Joseph Mallan]

Viges, on 30 April 2014 - 07:00 AM, said:

The only reason to join team now - easier wins. No cw, no any team-based missions/achievements/content. So why do you want to join a team? Because you suck as lone wolf.

cause you wanna be on a team and be ready to go when the game actually launches. So now that's two reasons to be on a team.

[Viges]

Joseph Mallan, on 30 April 2014 - 07:04 AM, said:

cause you wanna be on a team and be ready to go when the game actually launches. So now that's two reasons to be on a team.

A man can dream...

[Magna Canus]

Craig Steele, on 30 April 2014 - 06:42 AM, said:

8

Hey Craig,
long time no post. I might hate the answer but.... what's with the numbers?

[1453 R]

To All Respondents to My Original Post

First of all, damn. I did not expect the recruiters to come out of the woodwork in response to that. Heh, while I can see where it might appear otherwise, I did not consider myself to be complaining about not having a unit, just stating my reasons why there aren't any units that work for me.

Secondly:

Ye know, I suppose that's the real problem.

I met the only guild/unit/league/whatever that I feel comfortable with and enjoy playing alongside in GW2, and I met them...because two of them found me in-game, pulled my face out of the ground, and then offered to help me not get my face stuck in the ground again for the rest of the evening. One thing led to another, and now I'm what passes for command staff over in GTFC, and was one of the better/more prolific dungeon players before my job ate my life.

There is no 'one thing led to another' in MWO. I've been paying attention to my 'Quoted By's' in this thread, buzzing through it and clicking on signature banners, and I'm mostly seeing a loooot of application forms. i totally understand why, but I also understand that applications are things I submit to employers, not things that should get in the way of a band of casuals looking to drop together. I tried an app-form group once, actually - a Shieldwall of Rasalhague member sent me a "Good work in your Locust the other day, not often I see scouts who actually scout". Checked the 'About Us' section of their site, decided 'what the hell', submitted an app, had a week's solid discussion in the thread...and was told politely and with all due regret and their thanks for checking us out at the end of the process to go p!ss on myself.

I hate throwing darts at a board covered in clickable sig banners. I will not go through all the same ridiculous rigmarole to find a unit in MWO that I went through to get an actual IRL paying job. I'm not going to join a unitful of complete strangers I've never seen in action, I don't even remotely have the time/inclination to start one of my own, and the people whom I like/respect on these forums are already full-up doing things far more important than cozening the introvert. Again, a thing for which I don't blame them the slightest bit.

This is hardly any fault of anyone here, it's just the way the game works at the moment. It's easier, cleaner, and just so much less of a hassle to run solo when I feel like shooting robots. And until the day when I can just shoot someone a message and say "Hey, care to drop a match or two?", I'll pretty much continue to PUG along as usual. Thanks anyways.

[AlmightyAeng]

1453 R, on 30 April 2014 - 07:38 AM, said:

This is hardly any fault of anyone here, it's just the way the game works at the moment. It's easier, cleaner, and just so much less of a hassle to run solo when I feel like shooting robots. And until the day when I can just shoot someone a message and say "Hey, care to drop a match or two?", I'll pretty much continue to PUG along as usual. Thanks anyways.

Totally fair...though you CAN do that.

If you remember their name after a match.
And spell it right.
And they see the itty bitty purple flashing marker that says 'Be my friend!'
And then see it again if you message them.

Yeah...thanks for all those social tools PGI.

[Kalit]

For those who think there are no groups/corps/clans that don't have requirements on playtimes/etc. Let me introduce the Carrion Crows.

We are a merc corp about having fun, we are free to join, have a TS server and website, and we do not require anything of our members except to have fun and don't prevent others from having fun.

We do have some scheduled events, but we do not force anyone to attend. Also, you can take a few days, few weeks, or even a few months off from the game and we will just say 'Welcome Back' when you return.

The only people we have ever kicked out of our group were trolls who only caused arguments and wanted to make people angry. If you're not one of those, you have a place in the Crows

www.carrioncrows.com

[Joseph Mallan]

Kalit, on 30 April 2014 - 07:42 AM, said:

For those who think there are no groups/corps/clans that don't have requirements on playtimes/etc. Let me introduce the Carrion Crows.

We are a merc corp about having fun, we are free to join, have a TS server and website, and we do not require anything of our members except to have fun and don't prevent others from having fun.

We do have some scheduled events, but we do not force anyone to attend. Also, you can take a few days, few weeks, or even a few months off from the game and we will just say 'Welcome Back' when you return.

The only people we have ever kicked out of our group were trolls who only caused arguments and wanted to make people angry. If you're not one of those, you have a place in the Crows

www.carrioncrows.com

A suggestion, The Crows need to make the www. linkable and maybe have it in the Banner box. So folks can see who your members are an see what you sound like in the forums.

[Davers]

1453 R, on 30 April 2014 - 07:38 AM, said:

To All Respondents to My Original Post

First of all, damn. I did not expect the recruiters to come out of the woodwork in response to that. Heh, while I can see where it might appear otherwise, I did not consider myself to be complaining about not having a unit, just stating my reasons why there aren't any units that work for me.

Secondly:

Ye know, I suppose that's the real problem.

I met the only guild/unit/league/whatever that I feel comfortable with and enjoy playing alongside in GW2, and I met them...because two of them found me in-game, pulled my face out of the ground, and then offered to help me not get my face stuck in the ground again for the rest of the evening. One thing led to another, and now I'm what passes for command staff over in GTFC, and was one of the better/more prolific dungeon players before my job ate my life.

There is no 'one thing led to another' in MWO. I've been paying attention to my 'Quoted By's' in this thread, buzzing through it and clicking on signature banners, and I'm mostly seeing a loooot of application forms. i totally understand why, but I also understand that applications are things I submit to employers, not things that should get in the way of a band of casuals looking to drop together. I tried an app-form group once, actually - a Shieldwall of Rasalhague member sent me a "Good work in your Locust the other day, not often I see scouts who actually scout". Checked the 'About Us' section of their site, decided 'what the hell', submitted an app, had a week's solid discussion in the thread...and was told politely and with all due regret and their thanks for checking us out at the end of the process to go p!ss on myself.

I hate throwing darts at a board covered in clickable sig banners. I will not go through all the same ridiculous rigmarole to find a unit in MWO that I went through to get an actual IRL paying job. I'm not going to join a unitful of complete strangers I've never seen in action, I don't even remotely have the time/inclination to start one of my own, and the people whom I like/respect on these forums are already full-up doing things far more important than cozening the introvert. Again, a thing for which I don't blame them the slightest bit.

This is hardly any fault of anyone here, it's just the way the game works at the moment. It's easier, cleaner, and just so much less of a hassle to run solo when I feel like shooting robots. And until the day when I can just shoot someone a message and say "Hey, care to drop a match or two?", I'll pretty much continue to PUG along as usual. Thanks anyways.

A lot of the applications are for "security" and "Teamspeak management" purposes. I know several people have complained about how "applications hurts recruitment and wouldn't it be easier if we could just give out the TS info in game", but if you want to have a neat garden you need the tools to get rid of the weeds.

[1453 R]

I totally get that. Problem is, the application pretty much forces any given new player to make a hard commitment to one UND ONLY VUN given group, generally before they have the foggiest idea if there's anyone in that group they even like.

GTFC has a completely open-door recruitment policy - if someone asks for an invite, they get it. End of story. If someone turns out to be a derp, or a doosh, then they get the axe later on, but that's no big deal. Someone can say "Hey, mind if I tag along with you guys for a little bit, see if it works?", and not only can they totally do that, but there's no hard feelings or wasted time/space if it doesn't work out. And no "Thanks for trying, now GTFO" messages in response to applications which were solicited from the player in the first place.

1453-R <- *still rather sore over the Skjaldborg incident, however it went down.*

[Mavairo]

1453 R, on 29 April 2014 - 10:33 AM, said:

Let me tell you!


Pretty much, yep! Either that or adhere to strict attendance requirements – that’s the real deal-breaker for a lot of folks. I can and have gone months at a time without playing MWO – can you think of a single group that’ll put up with a player not being around for longer than three consecutive days? I asked people if they would, once. Notice nobody took me up on it.



No, there really aren’t. There really, really, really aren’t. Name me one group that’d be all “Sure!” when I come back after a month-long GW2 binge and say “You know what? I’ve got an itch to run me some Durgan tonight, who wants to go and do that thing?”



No there isn’t. Every single team out there, EVERY FROGGING ONE, requires a time commitment that I am unwilling/unable to make. There is an hours-per-week requirement, or a drops-per-week, or a “be here for Saturday night gametime or you’re out.” I have other stuff to do, I have friends beyond MWO, and I will be danmed if I let some two-bit goose-stepping power tripper tell me that making my weekly drop schedule is more important.


Yep! And I understand and accept that I’m at a disadvantage when I drop solo against what may very well be a premade lance. I read the articles and guides on silent cooperation with PUGlies, and I do my best to be a valuable member of any given drop even without voice coordination or a prebuilt lance. I’m cool with it. If I’m cool with it, why shouldn’t you be cool with me being cool with it?



First of all, because the notion of dropping in a group alongside some of the people I see in the GD section of the forums makes me physically ill. Second of all, because the people I’d like to drop with – Koniving, Void Angel, Redshift, and others who make the Guides and New Player Help sections of the forums into the excellent and helpful community that GD most emphatically is not – are already busy dropping with their actual buddies, for which I do not even remotely blame them. Third of all, because the only guild I’ve ever found where I’m welcome to play when, where, and as I like doesn’t play MWO.



Optimistic much? There’s plenty of reasons why this statement is not nearly as true as you might like, but that’s a discussion for a different thread.



It’s not instinctive. It’s a highly practiced, well-thought-out, and quite thoroughly tested intense dislike of the gibbering bassholes who populate the forums, long experience with avoiding second-job “Here’s your schedule, here’s your kit, you get one sickday a month, and we’ll tell you what you’re doing Saturday night” competitive guilds/units/whatevers, and the knowledge that the ‘Mechs I love to run are ‘Mechs that would get me thrown out of any half-decent unit no matter how good I am with them.

Oh, also I was/am a total junkie for the Invasion and FedComm Civil War-era novels, wherein House Davion were the Good Guys, Katrina Steiner was the Bad Girl, Ulric Kerensky was a hero and Morgan Kell was a motherfrogging sorcerer until Katrina’s venomous, spiteful self had him poisoned on his flagship halfway to Strana Mechty. I grew up with those books. Victor Steiner-Davion, Kai Allard-Liao, and Phelan Kell were my childhood heroes. The very same characters, in the very same books, that all the old TT diehards claim Ruined BattleTech/MechWarrior FOREVER, and which they spit on with every ounce of spite and derision in their bones whilst exclusively flying the CapCon flag in protest (and never mind that Romano is even worse than Katrina is) and burning effigies of one of my favorite authors. So the lore-based units are just right out, aren’t they?

I play what I want, when I want, and with who I want. These three factors combine to ensure that there is not a single unit in the entirety of the greater MWO community which would take me, so why bother? I’ll just drop solo and take my lumps as I need to. It’s what I’ve done in every other MechWarrior game I’ve ever played.

Um, I have never in this or any other game (and refuse to do so) join any guild with "Attendance Requirements" in the last TWO games I was Seriously involved in, I was in the top 2 percentile of players. The first being Forza and the second being STO. If I were looking for a guild to join in this game (I'm not. I have one already Comstar Irregulars) and they told me "Oh you have to be here X and Y and Z for A amount of time" I would tell them three words that start with the letters G F and Y.

Comstar Irregulars is probably the most casual guild I've ever been in. I could (and have) left for months at a time come back and it's "oh hey it's Mav" or "hey man long time no see" and that's that. Hell most of the time when I drop in MWO it's with a couple of my buddies from previous games and not CI. You don't even have to drop with them when you're on.

There is also no time committment, it's however much you want to play and that's that. People have lives, and most guilds that have any intention on lasting for Years rather than months, understand this. It was that way in Illusion's Crew, and in sto, CAC (killed by Cryptics refusal to commit to pvp), TMF (killed because of the introduction of starbases and the massive grind required to get them up and running) and TSI alike.

If you're willing to be a team player, then you're needing a guild. You just haven't found the right one yet. Pugs are by and large to be expected to be nothing more than bullet soaks. There's a reason why when you ask most premade players or Pugmade players (guys that group up before hand but do not have dedicated complimentary builds etc) what the biggest problem with pug players is... and the answer is universally: They do not communicate, nor do they act as a team. Pugs are John Rambo want to be, out for individual glory. Not the survival or victory of the team as a whole.

I don't know what guilds you play with but they Suck. Seriously they suck. I heard of guilds like that in STO, and come Tournament Time they were always the first to wash out. Because they suck the fun right out of it. Which sucks the skill right out along side it. I've again Refused flat out to be in any guild that will say and do such things. GFY is a great standby for people like that.

Seriously man, I don't know what d-bags you've rolled with in the past but not everyone's like that.
and if CI ever came to me and went "hey mav we want to see you put everything in that you can which also means meta only, and if you don't you're out" Well then, those three letters likely will pop up. I really really doubt CI will do such a thing though. It's an easygoing fun atmosphere to play in. Want to play a locust? Fine, Awesome? Fine.

The real funny thing is Mechwarrior is SO far from being a game that's worthy of soaking in countless hours to get better and "be the best" that I find the visual of "professional guilds!" even more laughable than I usually do.

Edited by Mavairo, 30 April 2014 - 01:26 PM.

[JimEvolved]

I think my biggest thing, which has been said in this thread but I don't mind contributing my $.02, is that the tools are not available to easily find a group you're comfortable with. With the social platforms available today I'd think it would be reasonably possible to have a team database that could be populated with searchable options--general playstyle, RP/not-RP, Family friendly, peak attendance times, geographic/timezone preferences, does the team have attendance requirements (y/n), etc.

I also tend to agree that for new players the general perception is that most guilds are serious and competitive and RP and MilSim (which for me personally is just all of the NOPE) and have not even just attendance requirements but training requirements and schedules, etc. It would be nice if the reality . . . that a more gradual ramp exists . . . could also become the perception. Again, I think a lot of this could be addressed by improvements to the social platform.

Edited by JimEvolved, 30 April 2014 - 01:37 PM.