342 replies to this topic

[TimePeriod]

*Inset wall of text explaining a lot of legit reasons*

"It lacks range!"
Weelph, get closer.

"It does not do pinpoint damage!"
Maaaaaaaybe because it is a shotgun? Get closer.

"I cannot use it on my meta builds!"
Get - Closer.

"But I am in his face"
FIRE THE GUNS!


95% of the time, any issue you have with the LBX is solved by getting closer

Edited by TimePeriod, 30 April 2014 - 10:57 AM.

[Sigilum Sanctum]

Shlkt, on 30 April 2014 - 10:50 AM, said:

LBX provides modest bonuses vs. an unarmored target. All that extra "critical damage" translates into an 18% damage boost vs. an unarmored target. Better than nothing but not amazing.

Unfortunately the shotgun effect also applies to critical hits; they get spread out over all internals, often resulting in fewer destroyed internals. If the component has just one piece of equipment, like an AC/20, then the LBX can often disable it with just one shot. If there are multiple internals, though, like 2 PPCs or 2 AC/5s then it's unlikely you'll disable any of the equipment until the entire limb is blown off. MGs are much better for crit-seeking in that case.

If your target happens to have an unarmored Gauss, though, you're in luck Very easy to destroy in a single hit.

The issue you just outlined is easily mitigated by equipping 4 MGs on the Jager DD with the dual LB10XACs. Both my buddies use that build along with 2 medium lasers. Its more venemous than some people are willing to admit.

[Mcgral18]

ExplodedZombie, on 30 April 2014 - 10:46 AM, said:

The LB-10X has been great for a while now. Not sure I understand the haters. If you are a really good shot with it, it can be devastating. I love using it on several builds.

The thing is, you can't be a good shot until you get within 200M. Its impossible with that CoF.

[Mister Blastman]

TimePeriod, on 30 April 2014 - 10:55 AM, said:

*Inset wall of text explaining a lot of legit reasons*

"It lacks range!"
Weelph, get closer.

"It does not do pinpoint damage!"
Maaaaaaaybe because it is a shotgun? Get closer.

"I cannot use it on my meta builds!"
Get - Closer.

"But I am in his face"
FIRE THE GUNS!


95% of the time, any issue you have with the LBX is solved by getting closer

You try getting closer to 8 Victor DSs slamming PPC + AC fire into your pinpoint face. Go ahead. Try.

Good luck. You'll need it.

[Mcgral18]

TimePeriod, on 30 April 2014 - 10:55 AM, said:

*Inset wall of text explaining a lot of legit reasons*

"It lacks range!"
Weelph, get closer.

"It does not do pinpoint damage!"
Maaaaaaaybe because it is a shotgun? Get closer.

"I cannot use it on my meta builds!"
Get - Closer.

"But I am in his face"
FIRE THE GUNS!


95% of the time, any issue you have with the LBX is solved by getting closer

While the other ACs can fire at a further range....and do the same damage they do up close. Saving a single ton isn't worth that in most cases.

[Sigilum Sanctum]

TimePeriod, on 30 April 2014 - 10:55 AM, said:

*Inset wall of text explaining a lot of legit reasons*

"It lacks range!"
Weelph, get closer.

"It does not do pinpoint damage!"
Maaaaaaaybe because it is a shotgun? Get closer.

"I cannot use it on my meta builds!"
Get - Closer.

95% of the time, any issue you have with the LBX is solved by getting closer

People don't want to get close in this game, they would rather spam you with LRMs or peck at you at range with all their superior meta builds so they can walk away from a match while only receiving minimal damage.

Seriously people like that are boring as hell. Anytime I get into a knife fight/brawl I get a rush because at that distance its up in the air who might win, you better pilot well and hope some teammates help you. Its exhilarating.

Now if im being hit by a sniper with Gauss rifles thats a different story. Gauss get me worked up because they're straight up deadly as hell. If I get pegged by a gauss, you just became my priority target and my mind is racing on how to properly deal with you.

AC2s?AC5s?Large lasers?
You're annoying as shit. Thats it. Thats all they are to me.

Edited by Sigilum Sanctum, 30 April 2014 - 11:04 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Mister Blastman, on 30 April 2014 - 10:58 AM, said:

You try getting closer to 8 Victor DSs slamming PPC + AC fire into your pinpoint face. Go ahead. Try.

Good luck. You'll need it.

Last Poptart I faced


Amazing how not superior they are when they don't have 2-3 buddies with them.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 30 April 2014 - 11:03 AM.

[TimePeriod]

Mister Blastman, on 30 April 2014 - 10:58 AM, said:

You try getting closer to 8 Victor DSs slamming PPC + AC fire into your pinpoint face. Go ahead. Try.

Good luck. You'll need it.

Not sure I see where the fun nore have I ever encountered such a situation, your imagination is an amazing feat!

[Mcgral18]

Sigilum Sanctum, on 30 April 2014 - 11:01 AM, said:

People don't want to get close in this game, they would rather spam you with LRMs or peck at you at range with all their superior meta builds so they can walk away from a match while only receiving minimal damage.

Seriously people like that are boring as hell. Anytime I get into a knife fight/brawl I get a rush because at that distance its up in the air who might win, you better pilot well and hope some teammates help you. Its exhilarating.

Now if im being hit by a sniper with Gauss rifles thats a different story. Gauss get me worked up because of they're straight up deadly as hell. If I get pegged by a gauss, you just became my priority target and my mine is racing on how to properly deal with you.

AC2s?AC5s?Large lasers?
You're annoying as shit. Thats it. Thats all they are to me.

I'm willing to bet that my WubShee will beat any LB10x build out there. With pulse lasers.

True, it's an insane amount of wub with an equally insane amount of heatsinks, but the LB10x just can't compare to the aimed 52.6 damage alpha. It's over 100 damage in 4 seconds. Your dakka just can't compared.

Downside is facehugging 200M range.

[Jonny Taco]

TimePeriod, on 30 April 2014 - 10:55 AM, said:

*Inset wall of text explaining a lot of legit reasons*

"It lacks range!"
Weelph, get closer.

"It does not do pinpoint damage!"
Maaaaaaaybe because it is a shotgun? Get closer.

"I cannot use it on my meta builds!"
Get - Closer.

"But I am in his face"
FIRE THE GUNS!


95% of the time, any issue you have with the LBX is solved by getting closer

Or you just put an ac10 on there and stop being bad... LBX are not and have not been a significant factor in the "meta" of this game because they are bad... Stop trying to white knight the current silly implementation and get on board with some reasonable solutions... First and for most being that the total damage per shot from an lbx 10 should do more than the total damage of a standard ac10... Damage values of other weapons have already been changed from their "canon" versions for the sake of balance, I don't see why the teribad lbx10 should be any different. Players need to be reasonably rewarded for closing that gap... Currently lbx10 users are actually punished if you compare the weapon system to the ac10 which is actually better at long and close range... LbX10 is trash, everyone who did not spend their childhood eating paint chips knows this.

Edited by lartfor, 30 April 2014 - 11:20 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Mcgral18, on 30 April 2014 - 11:04 AM, said:

I'm willing to bet that my WubShee will beat any LB10x build out there. With pulse lasers.

True, it's an insane amount of wub with an equally insane amount of heatsinks, but the LB10x just can't compare to the aimed 52.6 damage alpha. It's over 100 damage in 4 seconds. Your dakka just can't compared.

Downside is facehugging 200M range.

and crippling heat, and DoT damage which can be spread. Is it viable and effective, sure, but come one man, you are opening yourself up for mockery from our MetaOverlords by talking Pulse Lasers.. Everyone knows those are low Elo, crap. No self respecting Metawhore would touch them.

lartfor, on 30 April 2014 - 11:04 AM, said:

Or you just put an ac10 on there and stop being bad... LBX are not and have not been a significant factor in the "meta" of this game because they are bad... Stop trying to white knight the current silly implementation and get on board with some reasonable solutions... First and for most being that the total damage per shot from an lbx 10 should do more than the total damage of a standard ac10...

excuse me, I think you forgot to put this in your Siggy

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 30 April 2014 - 11:08 AM.

[80sGlamRockSensation David Bowie]

Bishop Steiner, on 30 April 2014 - 11:02 AM, said:

Last Poptart I faced


Amazing how not superior they are when they don't have 2-3 buddies with them.

Opinion over a play style, personal experience and the like has nothing to do with the inherit game mechanics of a weapon or its effectiveness.


We know YOU love the LBX10 in its current form, but you need to stop taking offense when other people point out its short comings.

[Sigilum Sanctum]

Mcgral18, on 30 April 2014 - 11:04 AM, said:

I'm willing to bet that my WubShee will beat any LB10x build out there. With pulse lasers.

True, it's an insane amount of wub with an equally insane amount of heatsinks, but the LB10x just can't compare to the aimed 52.6 damage alpha. It's over 100 damage in 4 seconds. Your dakka just can't compared.

Downside is facehugging 200M range.

I actually love pulse lasers. They have insane heat, but at close range theyre terrifying. I run both my Orions with Large Pulse Lasers. Love the wub, don't doubt the wub. :]

[TimePeriod]

lartfor, on 30 April 2014 - 11:04 AM, said:

Or you just put an ac10 on there and stop being bad... LBX are not and have not been a significant factor in the "meta" of this game because they are bad... Stop trying to white knight the current silly implementation and get on board with some reasonable solutions... First and for most being that the total damage per shot from an lbx 10 should do more than the total damage of a standard ac10...

I rarely encounter AC10's when I am pugging, I mostly face AC2/5/UAC5 with PPC's and gauss. Never really any AC10's.

[Phromethius]

You Non-LBXers make it seem like you can't be accurate with this weapon? MANY times the spread pattern is tight as heck! I use the paper doll and the target info gathering module so I know Exactly where to place my cluster round. Component destruction is still effective since more and more builds are arriving with ARM mounted weaponry (here's looking at you clans!) I love launching my LBX canister to the open side torso and seeing a fourth of the mech crumble off. Stripper poll on legs aint gonna do much for the OpFor.

[Deathlike]

Bishop Steiner, on 30 April 2014 - 10:49 AM, said:

Of course. In your enlightened Elo, no one uses them, so it would be rather hard to die to them, wouldn't it.

My "enlightened" Elo sees deaths by PPCs, ACs, and medium lasers at astronomical rates.

However, because of MM, I do actually see LBX fielded. Still unthreatened.

I'm actually using LBX at the intended range (below 270m) and put in 3 tons of ammo for it. The ROI in it is just so bad even when I close the gap.. while attempting to brawl. Brawling at the higher Elo levels is supremely difficult. The fact I get better results with SRMs than LBX speaks more to what has been committed to LBX and the woefully low results I get. SRMs don't even have options beyond 270m, and LBX still does a worse job. I only get ~50% acc for SRMs, yet getting 80% acc for LBX is somehow better?

There is a freaking "lost in translation" thing where the effort being put in LBX requires my target to be dumb and I'd still fail to kill it faster with LBX. That's how bad it is.

This is not an Elo issue. If a weapon is constituted by good @ the higher levels, there's good reason for it. It could be OP, but since LBX is genuinely not that yet, it is what the upper Elo says it is. I am trying my hardest (if I'm not an outright tryhard) to make it work... and when I'm telling you SRMS ARE WORKING BETTER THAN LBX, please don't mock me for just saying that. You're simply undermining your own argument. I'm doing a "in good faith test run" of them if you can't see that I'm doing everything that I can think of to be 100% effective AND IT STILL DOESN'T WORK, well, don't claim it's MY ELO'S FAULT. Elo does not cover the effectiveness of a weapon... it shows "how proficient" you are with what you are given. If LBX does not fit that criteria, then it's simply discarded. As soon as I'm done with the test, I'm going to discard that weapon until further notice.

[Bishop Steiner]

mwhighlander, on 30 April 2014 - 11:07 AM, said:

Opinion over a play style, personal experience and the like has nothing to do with the inherit game mechanics of a weapon or its effectiveness.


We know YOU love the LBX10 in its current form, but you need to stop taking offense when other people point out its short comings.

perhaps if you ever actually read the majority of my posts on the LB-X your post might seem a little less silly.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 30 April 2014 - 11:13 AM.

[Mcgral18]

Bishop Steiner, on 30 April 2014 - 11:07 AM, said:

and crippling heat, and DoT damage which can be spread. Is it viable and effective, sure, but come one man, you are opening yourself up for mockery from our MetaOverlords by talking Pulse Lasers.. Everyone knows those are low Elo, crap. No self respecting Metawhore would touch them.

Ah, but with a coolshot I can pump out 200 damage without worrying much about heat. 150 is very feasible. How much armor does your side torso have?

Good luck spreading .6 burn time over more than 3 components.

By the way...we do have private servers now. We can test all of this. In an organized manner to obtain CoF results, and in practical duels to see how they perform in reality.

[Mister Blastman]

TimePeriod, on 30 April 2014 - 11:03 AM, said:

Not sure I see where the fun nore have I ever encountered such a situation, your imagination is an amazing feat!

Reference this:

[Bishop Steiner]

Mister Blastman, on 30 April 2014 - 11:14 AM, said:

Reference this: