146 replies to this topic

[InspectorG]

I thought the only fix needed was the legs on the Raven?

Honestly though, if lights are supposed to recon and harass, i would suggest a speed tweak to the commando 2d and moar module slots for the lighter lights (locust, commando). Would they be more viable/fun with 6 slots?

That and maybe 40 inch aluminum rims. With spinners. Yes. Spinners.

[Joseph Mallan]

nimdabew, on 02 May 2014 - 08:25 AM, said:

This. I have a video I have to upload that I am piloting my commando. Had rely yellow armor. I step out of cover for about 5 seconds, while moving, and I just died. PPC/Gauss hit to center torso and co pletly destroyed. It isn't a pilot problem per se, but PPFLD problem. As long as that is the meta of the game, lights will be one shotted.

Yeah... Like they have been for 30 years... if you hit them. They are light and lightly armored they are not meant to absorb damage.

[Trauglodyte]

Darian DelFord, on 01 May 2014 - 06:04 PM, said:

Now that Hit detection is working alot better, I am seeing more and more lights being nailed from 500+ meters out. What are we suppose to do? The only way to make C-Bills or Xp in this game is to do damage and assist. However I have noticed a remarkable increase in the speed in which lights die? Further the field is just being littered with Heavies and assaults again for the same reason I believe. 3/3/3/3 will not address this issue. I have known it was coing for a while now. The question is.... What are lights suppose to do about it.

2 things to help you:

• Never stop moving, ever
  
• Never stop and go in reverse - if you turn a corner and see a bunch of enemies, keeping pushing and move to cover cause the worst thing that you can do is to slow your momentum.

[Adiuvo]

Trauglodyte, on 02 May 2014 - 10:08 AM, said:

2 things to help you:

• Never stop moving, ever
  
• Never stop and go in reverse - if you turn a corner and see a bunch of enemies, keeping pushing and move to cover cause the worst thing that you can do is to slow your momentum.

Pushing into them is suicidal... using your JJs to turn and reverse into them is the better option in that case.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Adiuvo, on 02 May 2014 - 10:30 AM, said:

Pushing into them is suicidal... using your JJs to turn and reverse into them is the better option in that case.

Because all lights have JJ's?

Generally speaking Traug is right, the process of stopping to reverse as a light is a death sentence.

[Adiuvo]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 02 May 2014 - 10:41 AM, said:

Because all lights have JJ's?

Generally speaking Traug is right, the process of stopping to reverse as a light is a death sentence.

All viable lights where you would come across that situation? Yes.

If you're piloting a brawl Raven still that's the first problem, but a any other brawler light such as a Spider, Jenner, or Firestarter should have JJs.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Adiuvo, on 02 May 2014 - 10:49 AM, said:

All viable lights where you would come across that situation? Yes.

If you're piloting a brawl Raven still that's the first problem, but a any other brawler light such as a Spider, Jenner, or Firestarter should have JJs.

Sorry, didn't realize this was the "viable lights thread, by adiuvo".

[Adiuvo]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 02 May 2014 - 10:51 AM, said:

Sorry, didn't realize this was the "viable lights thread, by adiuvo".

You're the one who questioned my statement, and I gave an explanation. I suppose you like complaining.

If you want me to go into why certain lights are viable and certain ones are not, I could, but that's probably best for another thread. Though somehow I think you're against the very notion of 'viability' in the first place.

[Joseph Mallan]

Adiuvo, on 02 May 2014 - 10:49 AM, said:

All viable lights where you would come across that situation? Yes.

If you're piloting a brawl Raven still that's the first problem, but a any other brawler light such as a Spider, Jenner, or Firestarter should have JJs.

All due respect:
Spider:Spiders are generally used as fast strike forces to hit an enemy's rear with lightning speed(not brawling)
Jenner: a fast guerrilla fighter(Not Brawler)
Firestarter: was designed by Argile Technologies of Skye in 2550 to perform as an incendiary 'Mech.(NOT A BRAWLER)
None of our lights were ever intended for stand up fighting (brawling).

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 02 May 2014 - 10:56 AM.

[Adiuvo]

Joseph Mallan, on 02 May 2014 - 10:54 AM, said:

snip due to woah color codes

What TT/battletech lore says about the roles of mechs got thrown out the window as soon as we were allowed to change things like armor, weapons, and engine sizes.

[Trauglodyte]

Adiuvo, on 02 May 2014 - 10:30 AM, said:

Pushing into them is suicidal... using your JJs to turn and reverse into them is the better option in that case.

You're right in that. But, even the Locust can't stop quickly enough and reverse before it would take catestrophic damage. So, for land locked mechs, you're left with the better choice of continuing on and hoping for better cover.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Trauglodyte, on 02 May 2014 - 11:01 AM, said:

You're right in that. But, even the Locust can't stop quickly enough and reverse before it would take catestrophic damage. So, for land locked mechs, you're left with the better choice of continuing on and hoping for better cover.

Sorry Traug, the Locust isn't a viable light, so we shouldn't even discuss them.

[Joseph Mallan]

Adiuvo, on 02 May 2014 - 10:56 AM, said:

What TT/battletech lore says about the roles of mechs got thrown out the window as soon as we were allowed to change things like armor, weapons, and engine sizes.

So since you aren't playing the mech as intended, doesn't change the fact none of our Lights were meant to be brawlers. The Light Brawler mechs were all slower, had more armor, and better weapons to start with!

Nicholas Carlyle, on 02 May 2014 - 11:01 AM, said:

Sorry Traug, the Locust isn't wasn't ever a viable light, so we shouldn't even discuss them.

FTFY

[Whompity]

nimdabew, on 02 May 2014 - 08:25 AM, said:

This. I have a video I have to upload that I am piloting my commando. Had rely yellow armor. I step out of cover for about 5 seconds, while moving, and I just died. PPC/Gauss hit to center torso and co pletly destroyed. It isn't a pilot problem per se, but PPFLD problem. As long as that is the meta of the game, lights will be one shotted.

Link it when you do. The problem I see (based on what you've written above) is hinted at by others later on. If you "step out of cover" you're not going 150kph for the first 20 metres. Lights accellerate fast, but not instantaneously. Horrible things happen when you are at low speed, and that includes starting to move and especially braking. I'm ashamed to admit I've come around a few corners and slammed on the brakes when I should have just turned hard instead.

If you plan to peek, peek and get back under cover. If you are scouting and aren't sure what you'll find around the next corner, either slow down and stop and peek before proceeding, or go out there at full blast with a clear plan of where you'll head to if it isn't safe. A slow light is a dead light.

[Xyroc]

I pilot lights all the time and live to the end of the match regularly with 500 + dmg

I also pilot a x2 Gauss JM6 that focuses on priotity targets ... but ... I quite often get to kill a light that wants to make poor movement choices

Example:

Running in strait lines ( always like a snake or next to cover folkes )
Stopping ... ever
Failing to know their surroundings and runs right in front of enemy.
Joining the team fight but is in front of the pack becoming focused ( always get your enemy fighting then take cheap back shots n such )

[Trauglodyte]

Quit fixing on my Locust. Until the Wolfhound comes out, I dont' really have a Light to run. I'm fighting the Firestarter urge, even though it was one of my favorites back in TT.

[Joseph Mallan]

Trauglodyte, on 02 May 2014 - 11:16 AM, said:

Quit fixing on my Locust. Until the Wolfhound comes out, I dont' really have a Light to run. I'm fighting the Firestarter urge, even though it was one of my favorites back in TT.

TT Masochist?

[LiGhtningFF13]

Also have much fun with lights, working just fine for me!

[Allen Ward]

Darian DelFord, on 01 May 2014 - 06:04 PM, said:

Now that Hit detection is working alot better, I am seeing more and more lights being nailed from 500+ meters out. What are we suppose to do? The only way to make C-Bills or Xp in this game is to do damage and assist. However I have noticed a remarkable increase in the speed in which lights die? Further the field is just being littered with Heavies and assaults again for the same reason I believe. 3/3/3/3 will not address this issue. I have known it was coing for a while now. The question is.... What are lights suppose to do about it.

I think it's now as it should have been long time ago. Lights are not made for taking lots of damage - at whatever range. True - a twin Gauss hit now is devastating, but it's your fault if someone can hit you from 500m - you are moving at 100-155 kph (or supposed to).

As I pointed out long time ago: Lights received more armor than other weight classes from PGI when comparing to the original BT game. Actually Lights should have even less armor than today and die even faster (not that I want that). The problem is that MWO at the current stat offers no real role for Light Mechs. They should be used in huge maps with lots of cover to observe and to spot targets. Light Mechs are not built to kill Banshees or stand up against incoming fire from anything bigger than Cicada. PGI has yet to deliver the maps and game modes that make Lights really enjoyable.

Yes, there are killer Light pilots out there, playing annoying builds with ER PPC or ER LLs that you can hardly counter in a heavy/assault mechs. If you encounter several of them, even your Atlas is done seconds. He may have a lucky shot with an AC20 at short range, but he will go down. That alone shows the oddness of MWOs weight system.

Hopefully we will see a huge map (Alpine x2) where some kind of electromagnetic storm takes out mech targeting (yes, no automatic show up on display - use your eyes!) and systems like ECM or missile lock (or reduces their range) and teams must rely on their Lights to find the enemy and Tag targets. I would love this.

[LowSubmarino]

I only read a few posts on the first page.

And, yeah, I agree. Lights die quicker. Especially when they turn their back I manage to one shot their vulnerable backs when dropping in mechs with a lot of firepower. 2 ppcs plus 3 ac 5 kill a light mech if you hit their backs.

But honestly. That is how it is supposed to be. A light mech is not designed to brawl. They are deadly at spotting and in small swarming numbers to pounce and then quickly retreat, attack the flank and then run away.

The problem is, I have said it 100 times, that most maps in mwo are designed to favor mechs that can take damage and dish it out.

There are only a few maps which allow speed, agility - and a subsequent loss in armor and firepower - to be a competitive alternative choice to heavies or assaults: E.g. Canyon Network and Tourmaline desert.

Tiny maps are good for heavy hitters. They render light mech's speed and 'scouting/skirmishing' role an inferior option. Lights need multipe, covered attack paths to utilize guerilla style tactics (again tourmaline/canyon network) to be effective or to locate enemy movement on huge maps or to attack soft targets. Mwo does only feature a very small amount of those features thus prioritizing on firepower and armor. It is really rather simple. It's not rocket science.

Lights have to die fast. How can a light mech take multiple alphas to the face and not die?? That just wouldn't make any sense whatsover. They were not build to take any damage at all. They are scouts/thiefs/assassins/etc.

But most maps are way too tiny for super long distance sprinters to put their agility to good use.

It's not the mechs. It is the maps. I'll repeat that another 2000 times whenever I see this topic popping up.

Lights would shine like supernovas in a more simulation oriented game. In arcade style, deathmatch, super quick matches (in super tiny maps) they are pushed to the edge of uselesness, or more correctly, an inferior option for a spot that ist much better filled with heavier mechs.

Edited by oneda, 02 May 2014 - 11:38 AM.