325 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

Roland, on 25 May 2014 - 08:25 PM, said:

I'm sure your five minutes of experience really grasped the intricacies of the game... And your absolutely zero experience with league of legends makes you a truly well rounded expert on the subject.

At this point, you are just the cranky old man yelling at kids to get off his lawn. Sad, really.

Oh, and for the record, no dude. King of dragons is absolutely nothing like a game such as league of legends, and you sound like an imbecile when you say they are the same genre. League of legends isn't a role playing game, just because it has fantasy themes.

you do realize your posts tend to take a rather petty tone when people don't agree with your ironclad, always right worldview, don't you? Not one off your more endearing qualities, and often detrimental to people being able to look past the attitude, to what can often be good point buried beneath the patronization.

[Sephlock]

Roland, on 25 May 2014 - 08:25 PM, said:

I'm sure your five minutes of experience really grasped the intricacies of the game... And your absolutely zero experience with league of legends makes you a truly well rounded expert on the subject.

At this point, you are just the cranky old man yelling at kids to get off his lawn. Sad, really.

Oh, and for the record, no dude. King of dragons is absolutely nothing like a game such as league of legends, and you sound like an imbecile when you say they are the same genre. League of legends isn't a role playing game, just because it has fantasy themes.

Mmm, nostalgia.

[Tremendous Upside]

Bad game design is creating a fully customized mechlab where you need to constantly dump c-bills into the ether just to make changes with parts you've already purchased. Wanna know why I have mechs that run meta and stay meta? It's because it's easier than having to justify throwing my in-game currency away to change them, only to be cash-poor when the next chassis I want comes out. Simple as that. Even the freaking mechlab here is geared to trying to get you to drop cash for MC to buy normal variants. I read a post on Outreach HPG where Kaffeangst and Heimdelight both stated how much they've earned in game -- and I'm in the ballpark with both of them. Yet I have a grand total of 131 million c-bills in the bank right now. I'm at a point where I won't spend to change anything because I know I'll likely be behind the 8-ball when clan stuff hits -- and costs 30 million c-bills per variant. That's not the players' fault. It's the way the game is designed. I can't imagine what a chore this game must be for players that've started recently or are just starting now. They'll be grinding forever just to get mech one at a time. Or they'll be spending real money just to get by.

[Bishop Steiner]

Sephlock, on 25 May 2014 - 08:27 PM, said:

Mmm, nostalgia.

as simple as so many game were back then...why were they so much more fun then so many current games? (don't get me wrong, most games were horrid dreck, then and now..... but I spend hours looking at games now, and so many just feel like boring clones of other franchises, with a different color shirt) War Thunder worth a look?

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

Jun Watarase, on 25 May 2014 - 07:53 PM, said:

Why are people still arguing over this? Its legal precedent in almost every country that you are responsible for your own actions, not a 3rd party which made the faulty product/service.

Funny how these guys only do it on the internet where there are no consequences involved...

Lol adaptation...i wonder how the top ranked chess players in the world would react if i email them and tell them to adapt to playing chess with all queens. Im pretty sure they would simply not play with me. The minority should totally force the majority to adapt to their special snowflake needs.

Your arguement is faftally flawed. No where has PGI said combining PPCs with ACs was illegal.

So precedence falls short.

[Sephlock]

Bishop Steiner, on 25 May 2014 - 08:32 PM, said:

as simple as so many game were back then...why were they so much more fun then so many current games? (don't get me wrong, most games were horrid dreck, then and now..... but I spend hours looking at games now, and so many just feel like boring clones of other franchises, with a different color shirt) War Thunder worth a look?

Too much focus on graphics above all, and then physics above all (thanks, Valve).

[Bishop Steiner]

JohanssenJr, on 25 May 2014 - 08:42 PM, said:

Your arguement is faftally flawed. No where has PGI said combining PPCs with ACs was illegal.

So precedence falls short.

Juns posts pretty much universally fall short.

[Roland]

Bishop Steiner, on 25 May 2014 - 08:27 PM, said:

you do realize your posts tend to take a rather petty tone when people don't agree with your ironclad, always right worldview, don't you? Not one off your more endearing qualities, and often detrimental to people being able to look past the attitude, to what can often be good point buried beneath the patronization.

His position is utterly without merit though. He has no idea what he's talking about. At this point, we're beyond opinion, and into cold hard facts.

Sephlock, on 25 May 2014 - 08:27 PM, said:

Look at this. He's saying that this game, a side scrolling beat-em-up is somehow comparable to a game like DotA, or League of Legends.

No dude. It's not. They're not the same genre of game. They are not only different games, but they are totally different TYPES of games.

The fact that someone would make the comparison means that their perception of a game like LoL is superficial to the extent that they don't really grasp even the most basic understanding of what the game is even about.

It has fantasy themes... You choose a character... and that's the end of the similarity. Games like DotA and LoL are STRATEGY games, not RPG's. If someone doesn't grasp this most fundamental aspect of them, then it means they are not equipped to evaluate those games.

Looking at a game like DotA or LoL and then saying, "Derp, that's a terribly designed RPG game!" is ridiculous... because they AREN'T RPG GAMES. Which really would be obvious to someone who played them for more than 5 seconds.

Again, I'm really not a fan of MOBA games, but I at least know what they freaking are... and forgive me if I'm not real impressed with someone who presumes to make claims about game design but isn't able to differentiate between totally different game genres.

[anonymous161]

op is a moron concluded.

[Bishop Steiner]

Roland, on 25 May 2014 - 08:56 PM, said:

His position is utterly without merit though. He has no idea what he's talking about. At this point, we're beyond opinion, and into cold hard facts.

Look at this. He's saying that this game, a side scrolling beat-em-up is somehow comparable to a game like DotA, or League of Legends.

No dude. It's not. They're not the same genre of game. They are not only different games, but they are totally different TYPES of games.

The fact that someone would make the comparison means that their perception of a game like LoL is superficial to the extent that they don't really grasp even the most basic understanding of what the game is even about.

It has fantasy themes... You choose a character... and that's the end of the similarity. Games like DotA and LoL are STRATEGY games, not RPG's. If someone doesn't grasp this most fundamental aspect of them, then it means they are not equipped to evaluate those games.

Looking at a game like DotA or LoL and then saying, "Derp, that's a terribly designed RPG game!" is ridiculous... because they AREN'T RPG GAMES. Which really would be obvious to someone who played them for more than 5 seconds.

Again, I'm really not a fan of MOBA games, but I at least know what they freaking are... and forgive me if I'm not real impressed with someone who presumes to make claims about game design but isn't able to differentiate between totally different game genres.

I got no issue with your point Roland. I simply am saying that sometimes, how you go about making them obfuscates the validity your argument might have when you go and fly off the handle and start ranting. (I can state for a fact whenever I let myself do it, I have pretty much lost, because nobody is going to look to actually see what is said).

A little sarcasm, especially with obvious trolls, like Flaming Oblivion, I am all for, but lately you seem to be dropping to the f-bomb default mentality a lot more than usual. You usually make good points, even if I don't always agree with them. Don't want to see good counter arguments lost behind delivery.

[and zero]

BULLSHIT

[Bishop Steiner]

Darth Bane001, on 25 May 2014 - 08:58 PM, said:

op is a moron concluded.

Well, in fairness, the OP made a moronic conclusion. Whether or not he is a moron, I suppose will be determined by his continued handling of this thread.

so far..........

[anonymous161]

I said concluded everyone can go back to doing something relevant...I'm gonna go play mass effect 2...Drunk yay!

Edited by Darth Bane001, 25 May 2014 - 09:06 PM.

[Roland]

Bishop Steiner, on 25 May 2014 - 09:00 PM, said:

I got no issue with your point Roland. I simply am saying that sometimes, how you go about making them obfuscates the validity your argument might have when you go and fly off the handle and start ranting. (I can state for a fact whenever I let myself do it, I have pretty much lost, because nobody is going to look to actually see what is said).

You'll note that I don't start off quite so dismissive, but I get there after it becomes apparent that things aren't going anywhere.

I used to be kinder, and more caring about not hurting other folks' feelings on these forums, but I kind of stopped caring at some point after it became apparent that some folks don't get the hint if you're polite all the time.

It started off with me simply pointing out that in his list of "badly designed games", he listed a bunch of games which were actually hailed as some of the best designed games ever. (Honestly, I think he may be the first guy I've ever seen who had bad things to say about TF2)

It wasn't until he started making absurd claims about how King of Dragons was better that I started just pointing out how ridiculous he was being.

[Kassatsu]

Bishop Steiner, on 25 May 2014 - 08:32 PM, said:

as simple as so many game were back then...why were they so much more fun then so many current games? (don't get me wrong, most games were horrid dreck, then and now..... but I spend hours looking at games now, and so many just feel like boring clones of other franchises, with a different color shirt) War Thunder worth a look?

Fine, no one else answer about War Thunder. Yes, it's worth a look. I've dropped over $140 on the game in far less time than I'd drop $50 on most games (namely the steam packs) because it's generally a very good WWII flight simulator. Also you can fly a B-24 and liberate your enemies with high explosives in true american fashion. Get it, B-24 Liberator? Ha, I made a funny. The controls scale from derp mouse aim mode (where you'll likely do most of your grinding) to a 'realistic' mode that still allows the derp mouse mode, but the real fun is playing realistic or simulation mode with a proper flightstick. Haven't had that much fun in a flight sim in years.

What was this topic again? Oh right, it's the devs fault, period.

[Nothing Whatsoever]

Darth Bane001, on 25 May 2014 - 09:05 PM, said:

I said concluded everyone can go back to doing something relevant...I'm gonna go play mass effect 2...Drunk yay!

ME2?

Ah, Yes... I should go...
and do another cycle of that series! (Much good acting of voice and such stuff...) Oh the fond memories,
up until the damn Catalyst junk of ME3 at least.

I can wait for further MWO development, regardless of how I seem to need to be needing to carry harder than I needed to do in the past to keep a 1.0 W/L as a PUGger (my current stats look atrocious with my favoring of Awesomes and all ).

[YueFei]

Jun Watarase, on 25 May 2014 - 07:53 PM, said:

Why are people still arguing over this? Its legal precedent in almost every country that you are responsible for your own actions, not a 3rd party which made the faulty product/service.

Funny how these guys only do it on the internet where there are no consequences involved...

Lol adaptation...i wonder how the top ranked chess players in the world would react if i email them and tell them to adapt to playing chess with all queens. Im pretty sure they would simply not play with me. The minority should totally force the majority to adapt to their special snowflake needs.

Bullshit, Jun. Your analogy makes no sense.

No, what you're really doing is throwing a tantrum because someone dared to deploy their Queen, or to use Castling. For whatever reason you refuse to use your Queen, or to leap your Knights over other pieces, because *you* decided it was unsporting. Well guess what? You don't get to decide the rules of Chess, because you're an unranked nobody. I think the World Chess Federation and the Grandmasters are far better qualified to evaluate the nuances of Chess than you are.

[Demuder]

I am afraid you got it totally backwards lockwoodx. Bad game design is 100% the devs' fault. The players have no say in it and cannot affect it. Maybe you are confusing bad game design with a bad meta, which surely is dependent on the players, however, the meta is consequence of the game design. If the design is bad, the meta is bad.

Maybe you can blame players for bad taste, you can blame them for not showing a gentlemanly behavior, but you cannot blame them for not designing the game right.

I dare you -or anyone for that matter- to demonstrate which design choices were affected by the players. I could make a list, but it would only show what is painfully obvious. One thing PGI never did was to listen to the players. They don't listen to whiners, they don't listen to experienced players, they don't listen to new players, they don't listen to hardcore players, they don't listen to BT fans, they don't listen to anyone. One can blame MWO's community for many things, affecting the game design is not one of them.

[Jun Watarase]

JohanssenJr, on 25 May 2014 - 08:42 PM, said:

Your arguement is faftally flawed. No where has PGI said combining PPCs with ACs was illegal.

So precedence falls short.

Apparently you missed the point. The idea that you can push all the blame to PGI while abusing something for personal gain is fatally flawed, and in real life, everyone recognizes this.

Also i think there is a serious problem here if people's only moral compass is "if its not illegal, i will do it!". Just thinking of all the sociopaths out there makes really worried. Imagine if i go on a cruise and people get it into their heads that international waters = everything goes and some of the people here just happen to be on the same ship, so they start robbing people at knife point for money or something.

Edited by Jun Watarase, 26 May 2014 - 08:02 AM.

[Roadbeer]

lockwoodx, on 25 May 2014 - 03:24 PM, said:

FAIL... he's changed his tune because his wallet is bleeding. Now the tryhards are bleeding along with him. I want to mend the wounds before it's too late and surgery is needed.

[Citation Needed]

His statement was immediately followed up by his Community Manager informing his CUSTOMERS that they read forum posts outloud and mock/facepalm them.

Change of tune indeed