198 replies to this topic

[R Razor]

Bring back Repair and Re-arm, implement burst fire (damage over time like lasers) or Nerf the ever loving CRAP out of them. I want to bathe in the tears of the crutch wielders as it's yanked out from under them.

[DONTOR]

I just want my AC2s to be the longest ranged ACs again, and for a little PPC splash.

[Adamski]

You may want to research some of your facts, the AC were always meant to have their long range, ever since table top. That was not some balancing decision made by PGI.

Not to mention that it takes more ammo to destroy an enemy in MWO because armor per ton is doubled,but ammo per ton is not.

Like I said, they need to nerf the projectile speed on (ER)PPC from 1,500 down closer to 500. Do it in increments of 250 until PPC is no longer the dominant weapon of the game, then remove the silly ghost heat mechanic.

EDIT: For reference,AC20 is at 650 projectile speed.

Edited by Adamski, 28 May 2014 - 02:13 PM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Adamski, on 28 May 2014 - 12:21 PM, said:

PPC meta reigned until PGI implemented Ghost Heat, which ****** over LLAS users.

then PPC + AC meta reigned, until PGI cut AC range by 33%.

How much longer until PGI figure out how to fix PPC projectile speed to something like the AC/20 so that it no longer syncs with the long range ACs, and destroys the pinpoint meta.

Why should a PPC go that slow? That makes absolutely no sense when the weapon doesn't even work below 90 m.

But hey, if you want PPCs to sync with AC20s, I will personally make sure you regret ever suggesting that

[Gas Guzzler]

Adamski, on 28 May 2014 - 02:11 PM, said:

You may want to research some of your facts, the AC were always meant to have their long range, ever since table top. That was not some balancing decision made by PGI.

Not to mention that it takes more ammo to destroy an enemy in MWO because armor per ton is doubled,but ammo per ton is not.

Like I said, they need to nerf the projectile speed on (ER)PPC from 1,500 down closer to 500. Do it in increments of 250 until PPC is no longer the dominant weapon of the game, then remove the silly ghost heat mechanic.

EDIT: For reference,AC20 is at 650 projectile speed.

PPCs aren't the dominant weapon, they are the best mid-long range energy weapon as they are supposed to be. They only become supreme when coupled with AC's. If they were dominant then we would see quad-PPC builds dominating everywhere, which we don't which is partly because of ghost heat but even firing them in pairs is still not a great brawling setup (minimum range, high heat).

[YueFei]

You duct-tape PPCs with your ACs because you have 10 free DHS in your engine that provides cooling equivalent to 23 SHS once you unlock double-basics. And increases your heat cap by 24. Then there is CoolShot which can flush out 21.6 heat.

Why not convert that excess heat capacity and cooling into damage as efficiently as possible? Hence PPCs, with fast projectile speed, good range, pin-point damage application, converting heat-to-damage at a ratio of 1 damage per heat.

LL convert at a better ratio if your opponent sits there and does not move and does not twist. Then it has a damage-per-heat ratio of 1.28. As soon as you are up against folks who are accustomed to having to react quickly enough to arm-tank and shoulder-tank PPCs and ACs, that efficiency goes way down. If you only get 4 out of 9 points of damage into the CT where you wanted it to go, the LL is getting damage-per-heat at a ratio of 0.57. Yes, LL are 2 tons lighter than PPCs and use 1 less crit slot, but because DHS eat so many crit slots, at some point it becomes really impractical trying to shove more DHS into your mech.

The minimum range of PPCs is an issue in 1v1s or smaller scale battles. Once it becomes many vs many, and other PPC users can cover each other's minimum range, that weakness is largely mitigated.

Edited by YueFei, 28 May 2014 - 02:39 PM.

[LordKnightFandragon]

IanDresariAce, on 28 May 2014 - 11:34 AM, said:

Oethe , yeah, Gauss is nerfed beyond any limits! But making other weapons weaker won't solve any problems. It'll just start another round of endless nerfing.
One shouldn't fix one things by ruining other things. Do you agree?

P.S. Maybe we should start a campaign for making Gauss free of that stupid "recharge"?

Exactly, endless nerfing, all its going to do is move people from using one good thing to using the next thing until it gets nerfed. Then that gets nerfed...and they move on......

Why the AC need to be nerfed?! Why the GR need to be nerfed? Nerf heat scale....to prevent us from endlessly lolpha-ing everything.

And I would love to get the Gauss charge bull (*&% removed. Its already, big, heavy, low ammo count.......

I know in TT it has like a 3 hex minimum range, apply that instead....

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 28 May 2014 - 02:50 PM.

[Wolfways]

LordKnightFandragon, on 28 May 2014 - 02:49 PM, said:

I know in TT it has like a 3 hex minimum range, apply that instead....

I think that was removed because "it doesn't make sense"...in a game of giant fighting mechs...

[Oethe]

LordKnightFandragon, on 28 May 2014 - 02:49 PM, said:

Exactly, endless nerfing, all its going to do is move people from using one good thing to using the next thing until it gets nerfed. Then that gets nerfed...and they move on......

Why the AC need to be nerfed?! Why the GR need to be nerfed? Nerf heat scale....to prevent us from endlessly lolpha-ing everything.

And I would love to get the Gauss charge bull (*&% removed. Its already, big, heavy, low ammo count.......

I know in TT it has like a 3 hex minimum range, apply that instead....

Even if they lower heat scale that wouldn't make GR and AC less used, if anything they would be more widely used as you would heat up even faster from all energy weapons.

[Kyle Wright]

THIS IS B.S.!!!!!!

Nerfing Ac's especially the AC20 is goign to make mechs like the Hunchback and Yen Lo Wang DEAD!!!!

Why? Because as is these mechs have to get close as is, but now you are asking them to get even closer. All it will take is a decent alpha and there goes THE WANGS ARM, or pop pop pop goes the HUNCHIES HUNCH.

Mediums are out gunned and out armored and need every advantage possible. this will further force people to run Heavies and Assaults to withstand the onslaught up close.

[Jolly Llama]

Let them do it. Then it will be easier to boat Large Pulse Lasers. When they nerf those, boat something else. That is how the game is played. The devs **** around and nerf stuff in a misguided effort to make everyone equal, skilled and unskilled alike. Then the smart players start boating a different weapon system....and the cycle continues. When they grow a brain and make weapon system choice based on how you shoot and not what damage you do, then the game will actually be balanced.

[Khobai]

Quote

Nerfing Ac's especially the AC20 is goign to make mechs like the Hunchback and Yen Lo Wang DEAD!!!!

I hardly ever see hunchbacks or YLW now. So it makes no difference.

[Mystere]

SgtMagor, on 28 May 2014 - 12:34 PM, said:

I don't worry about nerfs, whatever the devs decide to do I just adapt and readjust my game play. so if I have to stop using a particular mech and use a different variant, guess it can't be helped heh!

The only problem with nerfs is that people might have bought Hero mechs (i.e. paid real money) only to see them become "less fun".

[Dymlos2003]

Kyle Wright, on 28 May 2014 - 03:35 PM, said:

THIS IS B.S.!!!!!!

Nerfing Ac's especially the AC20 is goign to make mechs like the Hunchback and Yen Lo Wang DEAD!!!!

Why? Because as is these mechs have to get close as is, but now you are asking them to get even closer. All it will take is a decent alpha and there goes THE WANGS ARM, or pop pop pop goes the HUNCHIES HUNCH.

Mediums are out gunned and out armored and need every advantage possible. this will further force people to run Heavies and Assaults to withstand the onslaught up close.

Uh no it won't. Won't change a thing for those builds.

[R Razor]

geodeath, on 28 May 2014 - 03:49 PM, said:

Then the smart players start boating a different weapon system....and the cycle continues.

Nothing smart about finding the ***** in the armor and exploiting a mechanic to score maximum damage in a minimum amount of time.......it's no different than a RAT finding his way through a MAZE to get a piece of CHEESE. Although when looked at in that light, maybe you aren't too far off in your assessment of said min/max players after all............

[TercieI]

Khobai, on 28 May 2014 - 03:51 PM, said:

I hardly ever see hunchbacks or YLW now. So it makes no difference.

Exactly what I was thinking: "You can't kill that which is already dead." Also, if you're firing AC/20s in triple range (or outside about 300m, honestly), you're doing it wrong anyway.

[Mystere]

Adamski, on 28 May 2014 - 02:11 PM, said:

Like I said, they need to nerf the projectile speed on (ER)PPC from 1,500 down closer to 500. Do it in increments of 250 until PPC is no longer the dominant weapon of the game, then remove the silly ghost heat mechanic.

EDIT: For reference,AC20 is at 650 projectile speed.

My main issue with this is that I find the probability of dodging fire from an energy weapon a bit silly.

[Kyle Wright]

Dymlos2003, on 28 May 2014 - 03:53 PM, said:

Uh no it won't. Won't change a thing for those builds.

Uh yeah it will. Say they drop the mach effective range on the AC20 to from 270 down to 200. that means the max range the weapons system reaches drops as well. Further that means the distance to which damage scales down forcing a medium to have to get even closer.

So if it doesn't make a difference then please explaiN?


Edit: So I just saw the thread where they are just dropping the max range and not the max effective range.

Edited by Kyle Wright, 28 May 2014 - 04:53 PM.

[verybad]

They're probably the top of the list in terms of capabiliy. They're fun to use, but the whole point about balancing is that you can't have a whole class of weapons that's better than other ones.

[Jolly Llama]

R Razor, on 28 May 2014 - 03:57 PM, said:

Nothing smart about finding the ***** in the armor and exploiting a mechanic to score maximum damage in a minimum amount of time.......it's no different than a RAT finding his way through a MAZE to get a piece of CHEESE. Although when looked at in that light, maybe you aren't too far off in your assessment of said min/max players after all............

And that is why you will be killed by the meta and eventually rage quit the game. You have no understanding of the willingness of the military mind to use the most deadly weapon system arrangement available at any given time.