206 replies to this topic

[White Bear 84]

Saber Avalon, on 02 June 2014 - 01:31 AM, said:

There is also this handy chart, that I sadly cannot find the post I nabbed it from. I would like to give credit if someone knows of the post origin. Anywho, it's a handy chart of the mechs and the variants we are getting are denoted by a " >". The Hardpoints are based on the stock configs and since all Prime variants listed on the Clan page have 1-1 hardpoints for stock equipment that is what it's based off of. Note: Summoner Prime, B, D, Nova Prime, B, S, and possibly more are not listed as having JJ even though they do have them.

Spoiler

I nabbed this chart just today - it is SirLANsalot

[Saber Avalon]

White Bear 84, on 02 June 2014 - 05:47 PM, said:

I nabbed this chart just today - it is SirLANsalot

Thank you, I will update my post with that.


EDIT: Updated main post with the above and the below:

Note: Per VLog#2 12:15 - 13:30 - David states PGI is "aiming to do 12 vs 12 Clan vs IS" and right after Paul says "Yeah we’re actually going to start with the 12 v 12, 12 clan versus 12 inner sphere"

EDIT2: Added additional info: However, in NGNG podcast #105 at 24:25 "Russ confirms mixed Omni and Frankenmechs mixed on the same team in pug drops"

Edited by Saber Avalon, 02 June 2014 - 10:01 PM.

[Raigner]

His latest statement directly contradicts his statement in vlog4 were he said this, witch is were we are all getting the disconnect from

"right now we've found a problem that's inherent with our weapons system that's not allowing us to actually have an ammo swap-type. We are looking into possible other solutions and we'll let you know as soon as we can find out what we can do there. It's currently looking like we're going to be dealing with a mixture of a LBX and a actual clan autocannon. So basically, instead of being able to switch ammo types you'll be able to switch weapon types."
-Paul

[Saber Avalon]

raigner, on 03 June 2014 - 12:56 AM, said:

His latest statement directly contradicts his statement in vlog4 were he said this, witch is were we are all getting the disconnect from

"right now we've found a problem that's inherent with our weapons system that's not allowing us to actually have an ammo swap-type. We are looking into possible other solutions and we'll let you know as soon as we can find out what we can do there. It's currently looking like we're going to be dealing with a mixture of a LBX and a actual clan autocannon. So basically, instead of being able to switch ammo types you'll be able to switch weapon types."
-Paul

His statement actually clarifies it. As you are switching weapon types from LBX to Standard AC, what we all assumed is that he meant on the fly, in a match, when he meant in the mechbay, before you launch.

[Raigner]

... that dose not make it better. nor dose it make any of us here happy.

[Saber Avalon]

raigner, on 03 June 2014 - 10:02 AM, said:

... that dose not make it better. nor dose it make any of us here happy.

Didn't say it did. I'm as disappointed as you are, but it's something, I guess. I'm only here stating the facts, the whole purpose of this thread.

[Jaroth Corbett]

Well done Saber. This deserves a sticky. Oh & since we do not get Stars, our weapons have been nerfed & the IS is going to have access to Clan mechs, weapons & tech in 3049 when we roll back, I am tossing Zellbrigen to the wind. I am going to watch those people that have repped the Inner Sphere from closed beta ***** themselves out & get Clan tech & laugh.

Edited by Jaroth Corbett, 03 June 2014 - 08:09 PM.

[Saber Avalon]

Jaroth Corbett, on 03 June 2014 - 08:07 PM, said:

Well done Saber. This deserves a sticky. Oh & since we do not get Stars, our weapons have been nerfed & the IS is going to have access to Clan mechs, weapons & tech in 3049 when we roll back, I am tossing Zellbrigen to the wind. I am going to watch those people that have repped the Inner Sphere from closed beta ***** themselves out & get Clan tech & laugh.

Spheroids are not worthy of Zellbrigen anyway. I would rather give a battlemech to a surat and laugh as it squashed the freebirths.

[CyclonerM]

Jaroth Corbett, on 03 June 2014 - 08:07 PM, said:

Well done Saber. This deserves a sticky. Oh & since we do not get Stars, our weapons have been nerfed & the IS is going to have access to Clan mechs, weapons & tech in 3049 when we roll back, I am tossing Zellbrigen to the wind. I am going to watch those people that have repped the Inner Sphere from closed beta ***** themselves out & get Clan tech & laugh.

An interesting point of view. Sure, as a Warden and a warrior born in the Inner Sphere i tend to respect the spheroids much more than the averaga Clansman. However i will keep Zellbrigen for truly honorable foes, mainly my trothkins

[Sniper09121986]

Saber Avalon, on 02 June 2014 - 01:31 AM, said:

- Engine type and rating can not be changed. If the mech starts off with an 300 XL it stays that way. You can not change it to a standard and you can not change it to say, a 350 rating.

- Clan Endo-Steel(ES): The critical locations for Clan ES will be fixed in pre-designated locations, based on the CT selected, instead of the dynamic slots of IS mechs so far.

- Clan Ferro-Fibrous(FF): Again, Clan FF criticals will be fixed in pre-designated locations, based on the CT selected, instead of the dynamic slots of IS mechs so far.

I always thought it applies only to omnimechs in general, quiaff? Otherwise a great guide, especially the table.

[Saber Avalon]

Sniper09121986, on 05 June 2014 - 11:43 AM, said:

I always thought it applies only to omnimechs in general, quiaff? Otherwise a great guide, especially the table.

Aff. As stated in my post:

In addition, OmniMech rules apply to all Clan OmniMechs as well as any IS OmniMechs they may make in the future. There are also rules that apply to all Clan and IS Mechs, dictating the use of Clan technology.
- Clan Mechs can only equip Clan weapons and equipment.
- Clan 'Mechs cannot equip Inner Sphere technology.
- When customizing a Clan Mech, only Clan technology is shown in the player’s inventory.
- IS Mechs cannot equip Clan technology.
- When customizing an IS Mech, only IS technology is shown in the player’s inventory.

[Sniper09121986]

Saber Avalon, on 05 June 2014 - 07:33 PM, said:

Aff. As stated in my post:

In addition, OmniMech rules apply to all Clan OmniMechs as well as any IS OmniMechs they may make in the future. There are also rules that apply to all Clan and IS Mechs, dictating the use of Clan technology.
- Clan Mechs can only equip Clan weapons and equipment.
- Clan 'Mechs cannot equip Inner Sphere technology.
- When customizing a Clan Mech, only Clan technology is shown in the player’s inventory.
- IS Mechs cannot equip Clan technology.
- When customizing an IS Mech, only IS technology is shown in the player’s inventory.

Yes, but the parts I was referring to were under Clan Equipment Tech section, not Omni-Tech section. Or is it that Clan structure and armour slots are fixed throughout the Clan mechs? I am a little confused, since I thought they are only fixed in omnimechs, but in Clan non-omnis they would be movable just like IS ones we have today.

[Saber Avalon]

Sniper09121986, on 06 June 2014 - 09:52 AM, said:

Yes, but the parts I was referring to were under Clan Equipment Tech section, not Omni-Tech section. Or is it that Clan structure and armour slots are fixed throughout the Clan mechs? I am a little confused, since I thought they are only fixed in omnimechs, but in Clan non-omnis they would be movable just like IS ones we have today.

For now the only omni-mechs we have are clan, there are no non-omni-mechs being released yet and it is considered clan tech at this time. In addition, the clan XL engine differs from IS with the crit slots and survivability, plus ES and FF take up less crits in clan form than they do in IS form and clan FF provides more armour per ton than IS. That is why I put them under clan tech. They are affected by both sets of rules and I didn't want to have two listings for the same equipment. I suppose I could clarify the fixed items are for omni-mechs only though.

[Saber Avalon]

I am getting antsy, so much information being teased coming down the pipe.... wait so hard.... must go to work too.... want delicious information. I feel like a stalker, this is not healthy lol

http://www.reddit.co...e_death/ci07lcz


Russ Bullock @russ_bullock · 2h
All three designers and I are preparing update posts for the forums, ETA before end of day on all of them.

Russ Bullock ‏@russ_bullock
@Wintersdark so many subjects, Some clan balance items, MM, JJ heat, Falling damage, Clan logos, Clan Targeting Computer and Command Console

Russ Bullock ‏@russ_bullock
@33_rocks @HerbuRola @MechWarriorF2P update on that poll coming in a post today.

Edited by Saber Avalon, 06 June 2014 - 11:38 AM.

[Khobai]

Wait so if Clan ACs do frontloaded damage, why would anyone ever use a Clan UAC? Even if it does slightly higher dps the lack of frontloaded damage makes it inherently weaker.

[Saber Avalon]

Khobai, on 06 June 2014 - 11:12 PM, said:

Wait so if Clan ACs do frontloaded damage, why would anyone ever use a Clan UAC? Even if it does slightly higher dps the lack of frontloaded damage makes it inherently weaker.

Screen shake, suppression, brawling, they'll have their usage.

[Koniving]

What makes people use UAC/20 over AC/20?

Simple. (These times are assumed).
Clan AC/20, 20 damage in 0 seconds, 1 pinpoint location
Clan UAC/20, 20 damage in 1 seconds, 5 'pinpoint' locations.
Clan UAC/20, up to 40 damage in 3 seconds, 10 'pinpoint' locations.
Clan AC/20, 40 damage in 4 seconds, 2 pinpoint locations.
Clan UAC/20, up to 60 damage in 5 seconds, 15 'pinpoint' locations.
Clan UAC/20, up to 80 damage in 7 seconds, 20 'pinpoint' locations.
Clan AC/20, 60 damage in 8 seconds, 3 pinpoint locations.
Clan UAC/20, up to 100 damage in 9 seconds, 25 'pinpoint' locations.
Clan UAC/20, up to 120 damage in 11 seconds, 30 'pinpoint' locations.

Then they both reach 12 seconds and the cycle continues.

Significantly more rapid damage.
Then if the UAC/5 glitch still exists (apparently a 'feature', you can 'triple tap' a UAC within a single cooldown).. Triple tapping a UAC/20 would get you 60 damage before the AC/20 would be able to fire a second time.

It isn't just "slightly higher DPS." It's the firepower of two AC/20s tied together. Yes, it spreads. However it's two AC/20s for less weight than an AC/20. Mediums can easily carry two of them.

I suppose consider when the AC/10 and the AC/2 had the same DPS, people largely preferred the AC/2. Lighter, always ready to fire, same DPS, better range.

The Clan AC/20 will be based off of the Clan LBX-20, which is 9 slots. The UAC/20 will be 8 slots. It can be assumed that per squeeze the UAC/20 will be hotter, but given MWO's heat system it would be divided per shot. With the stated round count of 5, and PGI's chosen heat level of 6 (given by the IS AC/20), I would expect 1.1 heat per 'shot' with 6 heat per 'tap' or 'burst'.

The Clan AC/20, taking a hint from the Clan LBx on Sarna, will follow suit as one heat cooler than the UAC, so 5 heat per shot. Between the two, the Clan AC/20 will be easy to apply ghost heat to. The UAC/20? Given the way it shoots it'd be impossible to apply ghost heat without bugs coming along. So there's another likely reason; the UAC/20 would be incredibly difficult to slap ghost heat on. No ghost heat, more UAC/20 goodness.

I suspect UAC rounds will fly faster given their burst fire nature.

Also the central theme on every balancing statement on every weapon so far is "spreading damage."

Seriously, consider this:
Clan ER lasers are more powerful than IS lasers. Paul's statement? "Longer beam time."
Clan pulse lasers are more powerful than IS pulse. Likely response? Longer beam time.
Clan missiles? "Ripple fire." Basically streaming them. More damage spread.
Clan Streaks? "2 at a time." Streaming them. More damage spread.
Clan UACs? Burst fire. More damage spread.
Clan LB? ...that's a given.
Clan AC? This wasn't supposed to exist so I suspect it's an afterthought. Knowing PGI they might slap on an extra second of waiting for the AC/20.
Clan ER PPC? That'd be 15 damage pinpoint equal to a Gauss Rifle without the charge up. Given the central theme, it isn't hard to guess what happens next. Possibilities include: Charge up? Beam fire? Residual damage? Splash mechanic they mentioned in NGNG podcast 34 through 38 then mentioned failure and silence? Damage transference?
Whatever they do, it needs to fit with the central theme, otherwise the meta will be twin "Clan AC/5" and "ER PPC" in poptart city. And it'll be disgusting if it goes that route.

Edited by Koniving, 07 June 2014 - 12:48 AM.

[Pariah Devalis]

Koniving, on 07 June 2014 - 12:45 AM, said:

What makes people use UAC/20 over AC/20?

Simple. (These times are assumed).
Clan AC/20, 20 damage in 0 seconds, 1 pinpoint location
Clan UAC/20, 20 damage in 1 seconds, 5 'pinpoint' locations.
Clan UAC/20, up to 40 damage in 3 seconds, 10 'pinpoint' locations.
Clan AC/20, 40 damage in 4 seconds, 2 pinpoint locations.
Clan UAC/20, up to 60 damage in 5 seconds, 15 'pinpoint' locations.
Clan UAC/20, up to 80 damage in 7 seconds, 20 'pinpoint' locations.
Clan AC/20, 60 damage in 8 seconds, 3 pinpoint locations.
Clan UAC/20, up to 100 damage in 9 seconds, 25 'pinpoint' locations.
Clan UAC/20, up to 120 damage in 11 seconds, 30 'pinpoint' locations.

Then they both reach 12 seconds and the cycle continues.

Significantly more rapid damage.
Then if the UAC/5 glitch still exists (apparently a 'feature', you can 'triple tap' a UAC within a single cooldown).. Triple tapping a UAC/20 would get you 60 damage before the AC/20 would be able to fire a second time.

It isn't just "slightly higher DPS." It's the firepower of two AC/20s tied together. Yes, it spreads. However it's two AC/20s for less weight than an AC/20. Mediums can easily carry two of them.

I suppose consider when the AC/10 and the AC/2 had the same DPS, people largely preferred the AC/2. Lighter, always ready to fire, same DPS, better range.

The Clan AC/20 will be based off of the Clan LBX-20, which is 9 slots. The UAC/20 will be 8 slots. It can be assumed that per squeeze the UAC/20 will be hotter, but given MWO's heat system it would be divided per shot. With the stated round count of 5, and PGI's chosen heat level of 6 (given by the IS AC/20), I would expect 1.1 heat per 'shot' with 6 heat per 'tap' or 'burst'.

The Clan AC/20, taking a hint from the Clan LBx on Sarna, will follow suit as one heat cooler than the UAC, so 5 heat per shot. Between the two, the Clan AC/20 will be easy to apply ghost heat to. The UAC/20? Given the way it shoots it'd be impossible to apply ghost heat without bugs coming along. So there's another likely reason; the UAC/20 would be incredibly difficult to slap ghost heat on. No ghost heat, more UAC/20 goodness.

I suspect UAC rounds will fly faster given their burst fire nature.

Also the central theme on every balancing statement on every weapon so far is "spreading damage."

Seriously, consider this:
Clan ER lasers are more powerful than IS lasers. Paul's statement? "Longer beam time."
Clan pulse lasers are more powerful than IS pulse. Likely response? Longer beam time.
Clan missiles? "Ripple fire." Basically streaming them. More damage spread.
Clan Streaks? "2 at a time." Streaming them. More damage spread.
Clan UACs? Burst fire. More damage spread.
Clan LB? ...that's a given.
Clan AC? This wasn't supposed to exist so I suspect it's an afterthought. Knowing PGI they might slap on an extra second of waiting for the AC/20.
Clan ER PPC? That'd be 15 damage pinpoint equal to a Gauss Rifle without the charge up. Given the central theme, it isn't hard to guess what happens next. Possibilities include: Charge up? Beam fire? Residual damage? Splash mechanic they mentioned in NGNG podcast 34 through 38 then mentioned failure and silence? Damage transference?
Whatever they do, it needs to fit with the central theme, otherwise the meta will be twin "Clan AC/5" and "ER PPC" in poptart city. And it'll be disgusting if it goes that route.

More like twin ERPPC and an AC5 (If space permits). Sorry, but 6 tons for 15 damage is far better than 7 tons for 5. Every day of the week. The downside is heat, and I suspect people will find 30 damage from a pair of ERPPC is enough. Especially with the tight tonnage limits available for Clan mechs outside of the assault mechs we currently have.

Not like we have the Night Gyr. XD

[talbs]

Thank you

[Scurry]

Hmm.....I notice that there hasn't been anything mentioned on Artemis implementation for Clans. Especially since mechs like the Shadow Cat are specially noted to have Artemis-LRM launchers. Given that Artemis is an 'upgrade', does that mean none of the incoming Clan mechs have or are capable of installing Artemis?