126 replies to this topic

[Gyrok]

Dirus Nigh, on 09 June 2014 - 07:58 PM, said:

Good thread Jager. This is the type of thing the competitive community needs to do to reach out to MWO players as a whole.






Can you be any more condescending? You do not know this person. You do not know his ability as an individual player. There a ton of pug players that as an individual could make competitive players work for their win. Just because you may not see him, or regularly enough to remember his name, does not mean he sucks. Come on you are acting like the epitome of the arrogant, snide jerk casual players are turned off by.

There were players in the launch day tournament who only played solo, and many of them more than pulled their own weight for their teams. That also includes the winning team tiger.

Also keep in mind that even though average players can be lifted up the elo bracket because they drop with good four man teams, good solo players can be dragged down by constantly being put on teams with below average players.

He was being extremely condescending acting as if he knew what the comp scene is doing for the game...however, how could he?

Additionally, he claimed to be in the top ELO bracket...as I said, no offense...but I see the top comp players in drops routinely...and Mister D has never been on my radar as someone to be concerned about. If he is so great he wants to toot his own horn in a thread like this, he should be prepared to take some flack from people he says he supposedly plays with.

When I see Adiuvo, schopenhauer, heimdelight, Jager, or panicbutton, guys like that in a match, I know well and good I need to make sure we focus them first. If I am in a match and Mister D is on the other side, I am not particularly concerned about what he is doing.

Again, this has nothing to do with what ELO bracket you think you may fall into...as the group of players you need to worry about when you are dropping will come with experience, and after 8k drops, I still do not know who Mister D is because he was either not that impressive or memorable a player.

Not to be offensive, just calling it like I see it.

[Butane9000]

#1 Do you remember the Dark Sabres Mercenary Corp from early closed beta? (personal)

#2 Out of all the non-competitive battlemechs the IS have, which do you think is the best? (i.e. none of the current meta mechs/chassis).

[Dirus Nigh]

Gyrok, on 10 June 2014 - 07:55 AM, said:

He was being extremely condescending acting as if he knew what the comp scene is doing for the game...however, how could he?

Not to be offensive, just calling it like I see it.

Yeah, he was being combative. I said in my last post that I went off half cocked. Sense I mentioned you as well you deserve a direct appology for that. Sorry dude, I need to wait and consider my posts better.


Question for JagerXII to help keep the tread on track.

With PGI revealing how clan PPCs will work, how do you see the arc/splash mechanic effecting the game? Will it make mechs like the dragon, catapult and jenner easier to kill by coring the CT?

How could the clan PPC mechanic be measured against the experience of missile splash damage?

[Eagle Falconhawk]

Disappointed this thread took such an us vs. them turn, as I know Jager's intention is 100% to be a positive resource and influence for the community.  I propose we all have an e-hug, become e-friends, then go back to blowing up each other's mechs.

Question - What clan weapon system are you most concerned has the potential to come out of the gates as ridiculously OP?

A lot of scary candidates - the UAC-20, 15 damage-ERPPCs, boated streak-6s, cockpit shake from chained LRMs within 180M, maybe even the long-range/low-heat pulse lasers if they keep TT-values.  It's probably the UAC-20 that has me the most concerned, and specifically the number of clan heavy/assaults that may be able to carry two.

Edited by Eagle Falconhawk, 10 June 2014 - 10:12 AM.

[Dirus Nigh]

I still have my for shadowed concern over the streak sixes from closed beta. Imagine a streak cat with streak sixes instead of twos.

The other is arcing damage for the clan PPC.

Edited by Dirus Nigh, 10 June 2014 - 09:30 AM.

[Alwrathandabout42ninjas]

Tricepticon, on 09 June 2014 - 04:51 PM, said:

High elo players are high elo because we like winning, how do you win, you use the "meta" which is what is most effective at that time.

Actually it depends. I am a high elo player and I have never followed " the meta ". I actually left my unit Blackstone Knights because they tried to force me into " meta " builds that were inferior to my own builds that I came up with. I refused to move from my dual ppc gauss jump sniper victor dragon slayer to a dual ppc dual ac5 build like everyone and there mother was. Sure I tried it out, but I prefer Gauss for its higher alpha and better range.

I use to play competitively in leagues and run hot or die etc. against all the best teams. You really dont need " the meta " to win. A good pilot is far more important that a mech build, unless the build truly is awful.

Of course when we found out srm's were not registering we stopped using them, because in that case the game is broken and PGI needed to fix it. Well, june 17th hopefully will fix it so the game will be far more balanced and you will see alot more rush brawling tactics from all the good teams out there.

[Dracol]

Alwrath, on 10 June 2014 - 09:29 AM, said:

Of course when we found out srm's were not registering we stopped using them, because in that case the game is broken and PGI needed to fix it. Well, june 17th hopefully will fix it so the game will be far more balanced and you will see alot more rush brawling tactics from all the good teams out there.

This is what I am hoping to see from IS based teams. Clans favoring long range engagement like we currently see, while IS utilizing speed to get into brawling range and negating their range advantage.

[NRP]

Hey JagerXll,
What is the best way for a solo player (who wants to help his random teammates win) to approach random situations in game? Is it best to stick with the largest group, or split off in Lances? Is there any standard "go to" advice for positioning, particularly in an Assault mech?

[Alwrathandabout42ninjas]

Dracol, on 10 June 2014 - 09:43 AM, said:

This is what I am hoping to see from IS based teams. Clans favoring long range engagement like we currently see, while IS utilizing speed to get into brawling range and negating their range advantage.

Me too man. You will see me piloting fast srm mechs on the battlefield, thats for sure = D

[Gyrok]

Alwrath, on 10 June 2014 - 09:29 AM, said:

Actually it depends. I am a high elo player and I have never followed " the meta ". I actually left my unit Blackstone Knights because they tried to force me into " meta " builds that were inferior to my own builds that I came up with. I refused to move from my dual ppc gauss jump sniper victor dragon slayer to a dual ppc dual ac5 build like everyone and there mother was. Sure I tried it out, but I prefer Gauss for its higher alpha and better range.

I use to play competitively in leagues and run hot or die etc. against all the best teams. You really dont need " the meta " to win. A good pilot is far more important that a mech build, unless the build truly is awful.

Of course when we found out srm's were not registering we stopped using them, because in that case the game is broken and PGI needed to fix it. Well, june 17th hopefully will fix it so the game will be far more balanced and you will see alot more rush brawling tactics from all the good teams out there.

LOL...Gauss + PPC is meta...it does not get any more meta than that. That they tried to push you from that to AC5s and PPCs shows their lack of awareness more than your attempt at bucking the meta trend. The bar to entry for that system is just higher with Gauss...same result though. We run that setup quite a bit in our comp teams.

[Glory in the Highest]

Gyrok, on 10 June 2014 - 09:49 AM, said:

LOL...Gauss + PPC is meta...it does not get any more meta than that. That they tried to push you from that to AC5s and PPCs shows their lack of awareness more than your attempt at bucking the meta trend. The bar to entry for that system is just higher with Gauss...same result though. We run that setup quite a bit in our comp teams.

Wait, Gauss is factually superior to AC5s? You use it in your comp teams? S*it. I didn't get the memo ... <digs thru papers on desk> ... man! No wonder I can't keep up. Using dat AC5s.

Edited by Glory, 10 June 2014 - 10:01 AM.

[Alwrathandabout42ninjas]

Gyrok, on 10 June 2014 - 09:49 AM, said:

LOL...Gauss + PPC is meta...it does not get any more meta than that. That they tried to push you from that to AC5s and PPCs shows their lack of awareness more than your attempt at bucking the meta trend. The bar to entry for that system is just higher with Gauss...same result though. We run that setup quite a bit in our comp teams.

It may be a part of your meta but I specifically said I never followed any kind of meta. I enjoy the dual ppc gauss jump sniper build, and once srm's are fixed and jump jet balancing is finished, people will realize theres nothing op about playing a jump sniper. When you get bum rushed by a fast brawling lance and get owned, people will start crying about brawling.

My biggest point is this : there really is no such thing as the meta. The " meta " is nothing more than a group of people's opinion on what they think is best to use. Somone else may have a different opinion, or find that something else works better for them. Find out for yourself what builds work best for you, play around in the mechlab. Figure things out for yourself. Dont always trust what other people claim is " the meta " because more often than not, it may not be true.

Edited by Alwrath, 10 June 2014 - 10:34 AM.

[heimdelight]

Glory, on 10 June 2014 - 10:00 AM, said:

Wait, Gauss is factually superior to AC5s? You use it in your comp teams? S*it. I didn't get the memo ... <digs thru papers on desk> ... man! No wonder I can't keep up. Using dat AC5s.

Having one or two Gauss 'Mechs is extremely useful in drops with 3-8 Assaults. As a long range weapon, if used properly, can out-trade any AC5/PPC 'Mech at a distance. In a team environment this becomes more useful, mostly due to the cohesion between other builds with AC5s.

The AC5/PPC builds are mid-range, have more DPS, and sometimes require more cover than firing time. With a Gauss in the back or on the tail-end of a push, it can still make shots by isolating it's targets while it's teammates are in cover.

That's how things seem to have been working for us, at least.

[TheSteelRhino]

I interpret this to mean that your efforts to push the comp. scene to the detriment of the genuine battletech lovers. And having seen your teams flagrant use of arty and air in PUG matches does not help your case. I am sure you are a great guy, but feel like you perspective is definitely skewed in favor of the comp scene. And your actions to help shape mwo would appear to prove based off your NGNG commentary. Sometimes you just want to play a mech if it is a hunchback 4g vs always bringing the "A" game. Using the same arty/air tactics in PUG matches is just lame.

This opinion is entirely my own and does not reflect the opinion of my unit.

Edited by Rhinehardt Ritter, 10 June 2014 - 05:03 PM.

[YueFei]

Rhinehardt Ritter, on 10 June 2014 - 05:00 PM, said:

I interpret this to mean that your efforts to push the comp. scene to the detriment of the genuine battletech lovers. And having seen your teams flagrant use of arty and air in PUG matches does not help your case. I am sure you are a great guy, but feel like you perspective is definitely skewed in favor of the comp scene. And your actions to help shape mwo would appear to prove based off your NGNG commentary. Sometimes you just want to play a mech if it is a hunchback 4g vs always bringing the "A" game. Using the same arty/air tactics in PUG matches is just lame.

This opinion is entirely my own and does not reflect the opinion of my unit.

You are wrong.

He plays a variety of mechs. He has been seen in Hunchbacks, too. He uses a variety of weapons and is often experimenting.

What he does helps to identify gross imbalances. If the top players in the game cannot make a particular mech or weapon work well, that is a sign that the mech or weapon in question is underpowered. If the top players consistently find themselves gravitating back to a particular mech and a particular loadout to maximize their chances of winning, they have identified something that is stronger than any other combo.

Whether that means that strong combo should be weakened, or the underpowered mechs and weapons should be buffed, is another question, but the key here is that it be identified first!

Sometimes when a player complains that something is OP, it is a Learn-To-Play issue (see majority of LRM complaints). But when the top teams and top players say there is an issue, that is something that carries weight.

And of course, they identified this by using it, and if you happened to feel "victimized" by it and vindictive (as your tone indicates), that is your problem, not theirs. And you misplace your anger anyways. If the game is not balanced, it is the fault of PGI, not the players who are helping to identify these problems.

[TheSteelRhino]

He can play a variety mechs all he wants. Glad to see it. But when we stop seeing steel jags and comp teams pummeling 4 man drops with air/arty, or if they get a misdropped 12 man that admits we dont have arty or air b/c we were trying to sync vs another team then I will believe it. They have no sense of the concept of friendly competition.
This is NOT an ESport. And if they want to make it one keep it out of the 4 man queues and they might want to show some respect to other teams that may not have arty/air etc. they might get in 12 mans.

Again, these opinions are my own and do not reflect those of my unit.

[JagerXII]

AssaultPig, on 10 June 2014 - 04:46 AM, said:

ed: also in general, doing an 'AMA' and then directing people to your stream for actual answers is lame as hell

JagerXII, on 09 June 2014 - 01:43 AM, said:

I will therefore be holding a prepared answer and live Q&A session on my stream on twitch.tv/jagerxii at my normal times (11:00PM Eastern/ 8:00PM Pacific) on Wednesday the 11th. Twitch and YouTube recordings will be made and presented here for people that can not make the live stream times.

The answers will be posted here as well. No one will be left out.

Edited by JagerXII, 10 June 2014 - 06:18 PM.

[n r g]

Can you guys keep the thead on topic and ask questions regarding the game....

...less raging about the meta pl0x.

I'll start,

1) Do you think with all the recent nerfs on Jump jetting/sniping, that mechwarrior online is headed in a positive direction competitively speaking Jager?

[mack sabbath]

So a well respected and skilled pilot who streams 5 nights a week, inviting viewers to play on Mondays, has posted an offer to help to new and struggling pilots.

In response, people troll, flame, insult and rage like rabid gerbils against the meta.

I am convinced, these forums are indeed a cesspool.

Thanks for trying Jager, stay classy forums.

[Dirus Nigh]

You never watch his treams do you? Jager is a pretty friendly guy. He usually runs mechs for fun, until he runs up against meta builds that constantly trash his team. He then has his four mans whip out their meta builds just to take on the increasing population of meta builds in the pug drops.

Same with 12 mans. He will run what is fun, then switch in and out. THe guys he plays with are very good. They really do win more often then lose. Ive seen the 12 mans dry up on his stream because they win.

One night there was only one other 12 man team in the que. They were not very good but they kept on dropping. Jager and the others could stomp them easily but they were impressed that they kept dropping. They actually appreciated their persistence and glad a new team was making an effort.

Despite me shooting my mouth off earlier in the thread most of the competition guys are good natured. They understand if some one is just not as skilled as them. They want other players to do better.