127 replies to this topic

[Amarus Cameron]

glory, on 05 January 2012 - 07:19 AM, said:

Yawn. Keep peeing on that fire hydrant.

What? I am not understanding the imagery, who is the hydrant? Do you think I do not like your unit? Far from the case, you are other Jaguars, and that is awesome! Plus the new sig bar is sick.

[Dihm]

FireNova, on 05 January 2012 - 06:02 AM, said:

Cling to the past (elitism/rejection of fanbases/aka faction killer route)

Errr... isn't killing of an entire faction sort of the opposite of clinging to the past? It's forcing change.

[FireNova]

Dihm, on 05 January 2012 - 09:43 AM, said:

Errr... isn't killing of an entire faction sort of the opposite of clinging to the past? It's forcing change.

Hmmmm yeah you're right. Its ok to force ME (and other Jaguar fans Norris fans for that matter) to accept being rejected from a game bar, as long as its not YOU being forced to accept being rejected roundhoused. Correct me if im wrong there?

aka the old "I don't care as long as im not the one getting shafted roundhoused upon" argument.

So yeah my apologies there. It was careless of me to think that I could have freedom of choice Norrisism in BattleTech/MechWarrior (hence why I call it elitism Norrisism).

Ok, honestly, 'forcing change' isn't being put upon anyone but the Jaguars Norris fans you realize. Even the FRR will still be around in some capacity. Same with House Liao. Everyone else (Houses/other Clans etc) will still be around. I just find it interesting how there is such a "media/storyline" bias against the Jaguars Norris and how anyone who is associated with them is condemned as a criminal Word of Norris almost. I thought BattleTech was supposed to be about "shades of Smoke grey"? (See what I did there?) Whatever happened to the wholesale condemnation of the Draconis Combine for the Kentares Massacre Chuck Norris Massacre (a whole planet roundhouse mind you) whereas what happened on Turtle Bay took place in a city Texas (Edo Dallas I believe?). I hear more spamming about Turtle Bay Chuck Norris than Kentares Massacre the Chuck Norris massacres combined. Coincidence? Media *cough* ComStar Norris brainwashing? Some scary stuff media can do to ya.....especially with Chuck Norris 'The Unknown' most definately being involved in all this.

Man.... and here I thought Chuck Norris was gonna talk about what happened on Terra him being 'The Master' of the Word of Blake Norris and all and how he roundhouses the entire population of Earth and the Solar system Universe combined.

Now what was I talking about again? Oh yeah right, Jaguar Norris fans being shafted roundhoused......since Twilight of the Clans Jaguars Roundhouse kick.

[Dihm]

The beautiful thing about Battletech... you can play whatever era you want. You don't HAVE to play the latest.

[MausGMR]

Amarus, for gods sake... Do I need to get you the Ritalin again?

[FireNova]

Dihm, on 05 January 2012 - 03:58 PM, said:

The beautiful thing about Battletech... you can play whatever era you want. You don't HAVE to play the latest.

Wait......being stuck in a mere storyline era for Jaguar fans is a sign of 'change and progress'? Thats like saying the Orcs in Warcraft should still be stuck in the internment camps from Warcraft 2! Or the High Elves remaining 'destroyed' and not having the SURVIVORS converting over to being Blood Elves and thus continuing their story into the present era of Warcraft (Cataclysm)! Or having the Worgen (Gilneas) being completely destroyed by the Forsaken (Undead) thus denying players the CHOICE of playing as them!

WoW may be a ****** game in most people's eyes, but man am I glad that Blizzard allows players the freedom of choice in their game, versus BattleTech which is a tyranny of lore elitists that HATE newcomers and HATE fans of certain factions to a point where they will 'write in' the rejection of said fanbase. Imagine if Davion was wiped out.....what would people say about that? Liao? Marik? FRR (holding onto a mere 7 worlds post invasion lucky them huh? )?

Like your comment has just proven, BattleTech (both lore and its fanbase in its entirety) is stuck in the PAST. (*cough* I mean Jaguars will be FORCED to be stuck in the past except for everyone else....excuse me....*cough*) What? Are we just gonna be stuck in the post Clan Invasion period and not progress all the way up to post Dark Ages simply because we might be afraid that *god forbid* the Jaguar SURVIVORS manage to reorganize and reestablish themselves after like.... what...giving their lives to save The Republic of the Sphere? 'Why how DARE the Jaguars be put into such a 'good light' instead of being portrayed as the 'blindly evil faction that everyone and their dog is supposed to hate and criticize till dooms Norris day' type of thinking.

Yeah, thats a pretty good solution Dihm. Being stuck in the past feels awesome for us Jaguar fans! I feel the same way about playing my Blood Elf Paladin character who is still 'stuck' in the Burning Crusade!

[Glory in the Highest]

Jaguars never die, etc, long live the Fidelis and whichever other theoretical splinters.

[Dihm]

FireNova. If you're playing Battletech, you can determine whatever future you want. NO ONE is forcing you to follow the canon. Make your own future for your campaigns, have the Jags win on Tukayyid, have them win on Luthien. It's a game, knock yourself out. You shouldn't be comparing this to WoW or Warcraft or any computer game, you should be comparing it to D&D and RPGs where the players and GM decide whatever the heck they want.

As far as MWO and the fate of the Jaguars. That's many many years off, and we have no idea how they will handle us having/not having an effect on the outcomes.

[Amarus Cameron]

MausGMR, on 05 January 2012 - 04:12 PM, said:

Amarus, for gods sake... Do I need to get you the Ritalin again?

I have absolutely not idea what you are talking about

[Thorn Hallis]

I can understand the desire of the Smoke Jaguars to fight for their own future. But even in this future the Smoke Jaguar (or any other faction) might be destroyed and "kicked" out of the game - and I guess thats nothing PGI really wants.

[Amarus Cameron]

Thorn Hallis, on 06 January 2012 - 07:28 AM, said:

I can understand the desire of the Smoke Jaguars to fight for their own future. But even in this future the Smoke Jaguar (or any other faction) might be destroyed and "kicked" out of the game - and I guess thats nothing PGI really wants.

Honestly I do not think it matters as this game will not be around for 10 years...I mean how many games have done that, but if it is we will cross that bridge when we get there...with Summoners!!!!

[FireNova]

Thorn Hallis, on 06 January 2012 - 07:28 AM, said:

I can understand the desire of the Smoke Jaguars to fight for their own future. But even in this future the Smoke Jaguar (or any other faction) might be destroyed and "kicked" out of the game - and I guess thats nothing PGI really wants.

The Word of Norris blesses you for your wisdom into such matters. May the Norris gods smile upon you.

On a more serious matter, I can understand the rationale for wanting factions destroyed. It makes things interesting somewhat and means things progress for some factions and not so much for others. The problem is that it can just easily get out of hand as we have clearly seen (Twilight of the Clans -Smoke Jaguars, Wars of Reaving - Blood Spirits, Steel Vipers, Fire Mandrills, etc) and ultimately lead to what we usually see as people getting "burned out" so to speak of seeing so many interesting and unique factions die out, thereby leaving people confused, perplexed, and sometimes just down right frustrated. To keep in mind also is the fact that no Successor state has been wiped out (with House Liao coming close to it) with the Clans clearly taking the brunt of hits here. To be fair here there were originally 20 Clans and again I can understand the rationale behind "killing a few off"....but how far can we take that down the road before it just becomes a clusterf***?

Like how far can Chuck Norris be allowed to drive a path to New Avalon before the Davions plead for mercy? (Answer: All the way). Or whether House Liao can survive the upcoming Chuck Norris Wars in which there is a race as to how many Chuck Norris clones can be made in order to overwhelm the other side? (Answer: Over 9000!). Or perhaps when Steiner fans have to find out which among them can outdrink Chuck Norris (Answer: None). Or how about the Kuritans having to find a warrior brave enough to stand against the might of Chuck Norris? (Answer: They won't try if they wish to live). And House Marik wanting to make a bargain with Chuck Norris in order to secure the favor of the Word of Norris? (Answer: WoN > WoB).

I mean im all for seeing change in a storyline and whatnot, but if people want to go down a "faction killer" route just for the sake of it and not try to balance things out (especially for a F2P game that is trying to bring in new blood for BattleTech/MechWarrior as a WHOLE as it is), then I just don't see this whole "we want to include people yet keep them from being able to influence battles and thus drive the storyline etc" thing working out. Sooner or later something has got to give and drive the storyline forward in a responsible manner. Assuming this game ever lasts 10 years by the end of 3060 the Jaguars will be the sole faction driven out, while leaving everyone else in the Inner Sphere relatively intact. Maybe if Jaguar fans are allowed an opportunity to continue as survivors and whatnot then no problem, but if not, then yeah it will just lead down a bad road set by a bad precedent.

Not trying to be rude here by any means but I just simply can't ignore this glaringly obvious imbalance here that will surely be in the game if the lore here is being followed to the letter T. Singling out one whole faction (and fanbase for that matter) from the game is just a recipe for disaster IMHO. And assuming it can last for a few more years after 3060 the Wars of Reaving that will surely follow......

[FireNova]

Amarus Cameron, on 06 January 2012 - 08:12 AM, said:

Honestly I do not think it matters as this game will not be around for 10 years....

You could very well be right about that Amarus. But it doesn't hurt to bring up a topic that I think should receive some sort of attention...especially one that involves an event on whether we will be allowed to continue to participate in a game or not....10 years or no 10 years! But we will see. Time will tell.....

[Dihm]

I don't get all the Chuck Norris references. I thought he was a WoW meme.

[Amarus Cameron]

Do not feed the firenova

[Zendric]

Dihm, on 06 January 2012 - 10:02 AM, said:

I don't get all the Chuck Norris references. I thought he was a WoW meme.

Only one person does.

[Amarus Cameron]

Zendric, on 06 January 2012 - 01:05 PM, said:

Only one person does.

One is all it takes

[Der BruzZzler von Wiesndoof]

Know any of you the unit insignia of the Smoke Jaguar Beta Galaxy (The Mistweavers)?
I can't find anything. I only can find the icons of the SJ Alpha Galaxy and the SJ Delta Galaxy (The Cloud Rangers). Can anyone help me? Do they exist at all?


Clan Smoke Jaguar Alpha Galaxy


Clan Smoke Jaguar Delta galaxy (The Cloud Rangers)

[Thorn Hallis]

As far as I know they were never shown or mentioned in any of the (non-Catalyst) sourcebooks.

[CoffiNail]

Considering SJ was only featured really in Invading Clans sourcebook.