65 replies to this topic

[Lightfoot]

Most of the LRMs I fire hit nothing or lose the lock before they reach the target, so I am assuming a total miss. Since I have TAG, Artemis and Adv. Target Decay on my mech and they blink out 1 or 2 seconds after dropping behind an object, they are almost all mounting Radar Deprivation modules.

It's changed the game alot. Some games I only get a few hits with LRMs even though I fire 1100-1200 on targets that were just locked-on, but the lock breaks in mid-flight, so lock-ons of about 3 seconds unless I can get Line of Sight on them, (LoS). In these games my team will lose usually.

To get Line of Sight on a mech you usually get LoS on 3 to 5 mechs and they all shoot back at you, so you have to retreat and lose the lock due to Radar Dep. Or maybe you do get a hit, but your mech is all shot up by direct fire.

I became so convinced of the OP'ness of Radar Dep that I replaced AMS with it on all my mechs and so far no missiles have hit except for once, but only minor damage.

So a few suggestions to restore some competitive balance:

TAGed mechs lose Radar Dep for 5 seconds.

PPC hits shut Radar Dep down for 5 seconds like ECM. This would be Battletech's counter if Radar Deprivation modules existed in Battletech.

-or-

Since Radar Dep forces LRMs to be used with Line of Sight and so have the playermech stand for 4-7 seconds in direct-fire, LRMs should do a good deal more damage with LoS than they do now. This is reasonable because ever since LRMs were introduced they were balanced to be used with weak indirect damage being a major source of total damage, and this is now greatly diminished (in some matches 70-90% misses from indirect targeting). This would be the most competitive balance adjustment as well.

At any rate Radar Deprivation module should not be undefeatable.

Edited by Lightfoot, 22 June 2014 - 04:51 PM.

[Vassago Rain]

I run AMS, BAP, ECM, master seismic, master radar derp, master artillery, and master large coolant flush on my DDC.



Get on my level.

[fluffypinkbunny]

I spot for my missile boats, none of them complain about radar dep. Please more players remove ams for this mod.

[Vanguard319]

This is more a failure of your team mates not spotting for their LRM support than the module being op. If your team is spotting targets, then the target is in someone's LoS, and the module isn't active. Radar deprivation makes it more difficult to use indirect fire without a spotter, so it is working as intended. It also doesn't do anything if the target is NARC'd.

Edited by Vanguard319, 22 June 2014 - 05:54 PM.

[Claviger]

Lightfoot, on 22 June 2014 - 04:48 PM, said:

Crying about having to actually get a LOS on your target.

Your argument is absolutely ridiculous, let us examine the ways.

1) LRMs are the ONLY weapon that allow you to fire from under cover without LOS. If you get that advantage, you should have to depend on team mates for locks. With a team mate holding a lock, the module is useless.

2) If you have this happen: "To get Line of Sight on a mech you usually get LoS on 3 to 5 mechs" , and haven't learned to adapt, that is a piloting issue, not a module issue.

3) If you can fit a module to extend lock after loss of LOS, a module to reduce lock after loss of LOS is the logical evolution. If you don't like it, I propose remove both modules.[/color]

4) LRMs have a ridiculous cockpit impact and if you dont know how to avoid getting demolished while your rocking someones cockpit like a cat 5 hurricane, that is another piloting issue. Learn to play.

Other than that, fit a real weapon and do damage that actually kills....

Edited by Claviger, 22 June 2014 - 07:45 PM.

[ShinVector]

Don't mind me..... Enjoying the QQ.. *The dude carries Advanced Target Decay Module but QQs about Radar DERP Module.

Edited by ShinVector, 22 June 2014 - 07:53 PM.

[Bartholomew bartholomew]

I have not found radar dep to be a real hinderance.

However, my main lrm machine also has an ERLarge laser and a medium laser.

And I find that ripping them up with the ERLarge while raining missles down works wonders. So I almost always have LOS.

Edited by Bartholomew bartholomew, 22 June 2014 - 07:51 PM.

[Ironwithin]

So I was doing this no-skill easy-mode for about two months but now stuff changed and I have to play in normal-mode. That is unacceptable! I don't wanna change or get better ! Take it back, TAKE IT BACK, I SAY!

[Mr. Bitterness]

The only issue I see is that Dep should only reduce the lock time by 3 seconds so that people that have paid for and are using the slot for their target decay don't get totall shafted.

[wanderer]

I just find it interesting that radar dep can cut any amount of decay- even enhanced -to nothing. I expected it'd originally be a mirror to advanced decay, but it not only cancels it out- it even kills normal decay on top of that.

My Orion no longer fears counterbattery fire. Launch, dodge behind corner, my adv. decay module guides the shot in, radar dep instant-breaks lock, watch missiles splash harmlessly, repeat. Other LRM boats don't tend to take it, at least not yet.

Edited by wanderer, 22 June 2014 - 10:37 PM.

[ShinVector]

wanderer, on 22 June 2014 - 10:36 PM, said:

I just find it interesting that radar dep can cut any amount of decay- even enhanced -to nothing. I expected it'd originally be a mirror to advanced decay, but it not only cancels it out- it even kills normal decay on top of that.

My Orion no longer fears counterbattery fire. Launch, dodge behind corner, my adv. decay module guides the shot in, radar dep instant-breaks lock, watch missiles splash harmlessly, repeat. Other LRM boats don't tend to take it, at least not yet.

Alternatively I was in a match where there was clan light with ecm.. narcing anything he could... He did it properly and by properly, I mean not die in the process.

LRM Storm for the enemy team...

The more complaints we see... It just goes to show there was less 'skill' involved in LRM spamming.. Rather 'skill replacement decay module'.

People gotta learn to build more balanced builds.

Edited by ShinVector, 22 June 2014 - 10:56 PM.

[Latorque]

So... does this RDM alleviate the static LRM-farting campfest MWO had become? If so; i really might give it another try...

[ImperialKnight]

what is OP talking about. there's no way LRM mechs can lose. LRM is OP! nerf LRM!

/sarcasm for those who don't recognise it.

Back on topic, Radar Dep is not undefeatable. It doesn't not break NARC or UAV and also, if you pack Advanced Target Decay, you get back the normal target decay

[johntherussian]

Oh no! OP now has to actually expose himself and work for his kills.

[LongJohnSilver]

Yeah I don't quite get this topic. LRM's require you to not have LOS on someone and you whine that you have to come out of hiding behind you're entire team to launch 60 missiles at someone. In reality Radar deprivation is a good thing, it stops people literally hiding behind 11 'mechs the entire game and getting ridiculous amounts of kills and damage without having to receive any damage in return. Can't stand people that whine about something being OP when they themselves are using something just as BS.

[Levon K]

L2P.

Stop boating LRMs.

Bring a variety of weapons.

Any combination of PPC + LRMs + TAG + Large/Medium Lasers usually works well.

You can throw them off balance by using both direct fire + missiles at the same time. It messes up their
rhythm because they think they can pop off a shot or two before ducking back under cover.

[PhoenixFire55]

The RD module actually turns LRMs into what they are supposed to be. You (or smb on your team) have LoS, you have lock. You (or smb else) don't have LoS, you don't have lock. Its as simple as that, 'decay' should have never exsited in the first place.

However, introducing a module that cancells another module you introduced before is kinda ... dumb? How long before we get 'Radar Antideprivation' module? Or 'Lurmer Antidepression' module?

[Thorqemada]

It should not hard counter the Target Decay Module but increase the chance to get missed each second by 30% and that would be ok (that could be made with the Missiles spread that widens when the Missiles lose the hard lock and go into movement prediction mode and spread outto cover the area the targetted Mech could have moved to).

[Magna Canus]

I simply love this module, it is a game changer for sure. Need a lock and dont want to be in the open, then you are at the mercy of your team and have to use teamwork to make it happen. Cant/Wont rely on your team? Well then, get your own locks.

It is nice to have an element in the game that allows people to counter the half a dozen LRM stalkers sitting behind cover 1000m away as they Lurm from safety.

Bravo PGI, bravo.

[Lightfoot]

I am not saying remove Radar Dep. I am just saying it should have a weakness itself like everything else in MWO. It shouldn't have total immunity from everything.

You see in Battletech LRMs are fire-and-forget. The targeting system is carried on the missile not the Mech, so once locked-on they should never lose that lock. The addition of Radar Dep with no counter measure is over-powered.

A good example of Radar Dep's OP'ness and immunity comes to mind. You can lock a jump-jetting poptart mech with TAG, BAP, Artemis, and Advanced Target Decay and before the LRMs arrive the missile lock is lost and the LRMs wasted. Not only is that not balanced, but it removes the best counter-attack teams had to fight jump-jet snipers. So expect even more poptarts.