73 replies to this topic

[Vallin Shae]

I was wondering because I'm kind of new to he game. Is the LB 10-X AC a really good weapon or should I take an Ac/10 or maybe even a AC/20 ?

[Xeno Phalcon]

LBX is largely regarded as a sub par weapon, its not terrible but it spreads its damage out resulting in less damage to individual areas. To balance this out supposedly it has a higher chance to crit internals but to do this you need to have removed the armor from a mech anyways so its not terribly useful. Still can do plenty of harm, but between a lbx10 and a AC20 I would take the 20, however 20s are very bulky and some mechs cant equip them, not to mention the weight.

I use a LBX10 on my clan made Warhawk because the machine is absolutely starved for space so using the larger caliber autocannons can get tricky, for example.

(Also thing to keep in mind: Lbx cost more to buy, if you have some already then thats not a problem but if your strapped for cbills standard autocannons are cheaper)

Edited by Xeno Phalcon, 14 July 2014 - 10:46 AM.

[xeromynd]

Think of the LB10 as a shotgun.
-Spread fire weapon.
-10 bullets per fire, each does 1 pt of damage
-Less range, and damage is spread out (not pinpoint)
-Higher chance to hit criticals (when hitting an opponent's internals)
-Takes up less tonnage and (i believe) less slots

Think of the AC10 as a rifle.
-Single shot
-10 pts of damage per 1 bullet
-Higher range
-Greater pinpoint damage (all dmg is delivered to a single location)

Personally, I LOVE the LB10 over the AC10 because of the sound and I think it's an intimidating weapon when you blast it at someone's face. I've also found the thing about crits being true, I tend to blow off a LOT more components with the LBX.

vv Important vv
But the current meta really does NOT favor short range combat, (unless you like doing nothing for the first 5 minutes of a match) so for now I'd stick with an AC10.

Edited by xeromynd, 14 July 2014 - 10:50 AM.

[Skull Leader2]

I think in general its a sub-par ballistic weapon bu does have its place. It is a nice weapon to use on pesky lights that can be very hard to hit with a single shot AC10 or 20 while still providing an ok weapon against larger mechs (unlike SSRMS).

[Modo44]

The LB is pretty bad once you learn to aim. It is guaranteed to spread damage, making it worse than other ACs at anything but hugging range. With the relatively low AC10 range, that one is also underwhelming. You can generally do better with a UAC5, which has faster and straighter-flying projectiles. That being said, you want to try them all. Check your damage/kills ratio to see how much damage is wasted (spread where you were not aiming) or just not delivered (too far) by the lesser guns. If you want something to hit hard in one go, try to upgrade to AC20 for short range or Gauss for long range. Dual (U)AC5 is also very good, but also rather heavy.

Edited by Modo44, 14 July 2014 - 10:58 AM.

[Vallin Shae]

Thanks for the info guys. And I love its sounds and animation as well.

Hmmmm, what If I did something like this ?

JM6-DD

Edited by Vallin Shae, 14 July 2014 - 10:58 AM.

[Skull Leader2]

I think you would be killed long before you could start doing effective damage. Might look better if you dropped the AC/20 for 2 AC/5 or an AC/10 and a couple Pew Pew lasers. AC/5's would give you some faster cycling and longer range weapons.

[xeromynd]

Vallin Shae, on 14 July 2014 - 10:58 AM, said:

Thanks for the info guys. And I love its sounds and animation as well.

Hmmmm, what If I did something like this ?

JM6-DD

Ammunition seems to be overkill there. Ammo explosions will hurt a lot if your components containing ammo are destroyed. That's a very short range mech, and imo, Jagers with XLs are VERY squishy and tend to fall apart fast if you don't torso twist and spread your damage.

I have a feeling with that build you'd be getting scratched by lasers, hit by LRMs and PPCs whilst not being able to return fire because of your range. You're going to go down fast unless you're up close and personal with a few teammates.
-----------------------------

I'd recommend a JM6-DD with 3x AC5 (or UAC if that's your thing) and maybe 3-4 MLas. 4T of ammo. I've had great success with that build (not sure if it's the exact one).
Basically you've got decent range to go with the current meta, and you're dealing 15 pinpoint damage at the AC5's rate of fire.

Edited by xeromynd, 14 July 2014 - 11:05 AM.

[Vallin Shae]

More like these ?

JM6-DD

JM6-DD

Edited by Vallin Shae, 14 July 2014 - 11:14 AM.

[Skull Leader2]

You'll do some dmg for sure from good range. Might want to switch ERLLAS to regular LLAS. I haven't found the extra range to be very helpful when torso mounted but the extra heat is very noticeable. Also, with those UAC-5's barking your heat is going to be hard to control.

You could also use your first configuration but switch the AC/20 or LBX20 to a AC5 and use the tonnage for a torso mounted PPC so you have some extra range and 1 unlimited ammo weapons. I like energy weapons so I'm partial though.

[Xeno Phalcon]

If your going to use a XL I would rely exclusively on the autocannons and use the jagermechs legendary hill humping abilities to the most. That being said im no jag pilot so who knows, killed alot of them though that has to count for something right? <.<

[xeromynd]

Vallin Shae, on 14 July 2014 - 11:06 AM, said:

More like this ?

JM6-DD

Based off of your most recent, a few very small tweaks:
JM6-DD

If you find you're getting too hot, just swap the ERLLs for regular LLs

Edited by xeromynd, 14 July 2014 - 11:20 AM.

[Void Angel]

Vallin Shae, on 14 July 2014 - 10:38 AM, said:

I was wondering because I'm kind of new to he game. Is the LB 10-X AC a really good weapon or should I take an Ac/10 or maybe even a AC/20 ?

The LB-10X AC is an excellent supplementary weapon, but it cannot be your primary source of damage, because it spreads, and does its best work after armor is breached. The LB-10X has (not "supposedly; it does) enhanced damage and critical chance once you've breached your opponent's armor, making it a devastating weapon at close ranges, since the substantially increased damage and chance of destroying equipment makes up for the spread. It also has a very fast projectile speed, equivalent to the (U)AC/5, making it highly accurate when you are close enough to account for the spread. Now, long range? Well, you can get good effects at 500m if he would have died anyway no matter what you shot him with - but really, it's only good for keeping people's heads down and securing assists at ranges outside a few hundred meters.

In essence, if you're going to use the LB-10X, you want to bring heavy support firepower, or a lot of LB-Xs - or both, if you prefer. The shotgun stack D-DC Atlas brawler build makes excellent use of the weapons for close work, coupled with lasers and a battery of SRMs. It's a bit slow because Clan 'Mechs and meta, so it's fallen out of favor - but it is one of the most devastating 'mechs you can get in an old-fashioned brawl. On the other hand, slapping an LB-10X in a Shadowhawk and "brawling" in it is a Bad Idea.

So in general, if you're wanting mid- to long-range combat, go with the UAC/5; if you want those autocannons to be your primary damage, go with AC/20s, or even AC/10s. But if you're looking to supplement your other firepower, the LB-10X is an excellent weapon that should not be ignored.

[Modo44]

Vallin Shae, on 14 July 2014 - 11:06 AM, said:

More like these ?

JM6-DD

JM6-DD

Yes on UAC5s. Try 2xUAC5+2xLL+4xMG one time. The MGs are amazing whenever you find yourself close to anything near the end of the match. MGs have increased damage and crit chance whenever armor is stripped. The guns and lasers alone provide great DPS at good ranges. Just be aware that XL Jagers are glass cannons -- any decent shot will get that side torso. You can downgrade to MLs to take a standard engine.

No on the ERPPC setup. You really need 2 tons of ammo per AC5, so the best you will do, are backup MLs. Only take 1 ton of ammo per AMS. If you need 2, you are dead anyway.

[Vallin Shae]

What if I took it to the other extreme ?

JM6-DD

[Xeno Phalcon]

Vallin Shae, on 14 July 2014 - 11:37 AM, said:

What if I took it to the other extreme ?

JM6-DD

I can tell you three tons of ammo wont be enough for four guns thats for sure, my hawk can plow through seven tons of UAC10 ammo regularly and thats at closer ranges than you can use a AC5 at, I would drop one of the cannons and uses the weight for ammo.

[Modo44]

I do not believe you know the meaning of the word extreme.

The realistic build is 3xAC5+2xML. Less than 2 tons of ammo per AC5 will make you run out awfully quickly, at which point you become useless. If you strip armor around, you can just make it to 3xAC5+PPC.

[Vallin Shae]

Thanks Modo44, I like this one. Its like an oversized Shadow Hawk.

JM6-DD

[0bsidion]

Void Angel, on 14 July 2014 - 11:20 AM, said:

The LB-10X AC is an excellent supplementary weapon, but it cannot be your primary source of damage, because it spreads, and does its best work after armor is breached. The LB-10X has (not "supposedly; it does) enhanced damage and critical chance once you've breached your opponent's armor, making it a devastating weapon at close ranges, since the substantially increased damage and chance of destroying equipment makes up for the spread. It also has a very fast projectile speed, equivalent to the (U)AC/5, making it highly accurate when you are close enough to account for the spread. Now, long range? Well, you can get good effects at 500m if he would have died anyway no matter what you shot him with - but really, it's only good for keeping people's heads down and securing assists at ranges outside a few hundred meters.

In essence, if you're going to use the LB-10X, you want to bring heavy support firepower, or a lot of LB-Xs - or both, if you prefer. The shotgun stack D-DC Atlas brawler build makes excellent use of the weapons for close work, coupled with lasers and a battery of SRMs. It's a bit slow because Clan 'Mechs and meta, so it's fallen out of favor - but it is one of the most devastating 'mechs you can get in an old-fashioned brawl. On the other hand, slapping an LB-10X in a Shadowhawk and "brawling" in it is a Bad Idea.

So in general, if you're wanting mid- to long-range combat, go with the UAC/5; if you want those autocannons to be your primary damage, go with AC/20s, or even AC/10s. But if you're looking to supplement your other firepower, the LB-10X is an excellent weapon that should not be ignored.

Yeah, I love the double barrel shotgun atlas. The over-under barrel is good for concentrating damage at close range. I'd also add that a single LBX10 is good early game mostly for spooking lights that tend to get real nervous once you prove you can hit them with an autocannon. Mid to late game is when it starts to become lethal, when your targets have exposed and battle damaged internals and components. It's also nice because it takes up less space than the AC/10.

[Ovion]

LBX10s are a good weapon.
Nay a great weapon.

They're pretty damn effective at up to 600-800M.
At up to 1600M, they were as a suppression and psychological warfare tool - people move away from the wall of lead hitting the ground around / infront of them, letting you guide them where you want them.
They don't suffer greatly from shell dropping either, so you don't have to account much at distance. (Anything you point at, you'll probably hit)

Additionally, the amount of screen shake they generate is insane (each pellet is equivalent to an AC/5 shell in that regard), which freaks people out immensely, and makes it very hard for them to shoot you back.
Especially seeing it's one of the longest range weapons in the game.

They're a crit-seeker too, which means while you're doing that 10 sand-blasting damage normally, each pellet has a 67% chance of critting once you open your target up.

They're also great earners, putting out high damage and just flaying the enemy to death. (The sheer amount of Component destroyeds I get with my twin 10s is insane).

And to top it all off - 2 LBX10's, runs heat neutral on 6 double heat sinks (or 13 single).
This means that so long as all you fire is the LBX10s you will run out of ammo before you overheat.


This build FIREBRAND can be ran on any Jagermech, and is very effective.

You could drop the BAP and put in an extra 1.5T of ammo, but I've found the faster target locks and sensor range, plus ECM countering is worth it so I can focus my crit-seeking boomsticks.

You basically find a target and just don't stop shooting till its dead.
I've taken this build to 800 damage myself. I've seen others (better pilots than me) break 13-1400 in it.

It's possibly my best performing mech.

I've also ran the twin LBX-10 Atlas, and while a solid performer, not as good as the Jager.
I will be buying twin LBXs for it at some point though so I don't have to keep switching.

I also run a UM-R63 with one which is reasonably effective.