117 replies to this topic

[Jman5]

I think we've all seen this before. You spawn on River City Skirmish and begin rotating to catch the lone spawn at either the airport or by the boat. It's a race to catch them before they can escape. Meanwhile you notice on the radar some direwolf at your tail that's standing still or even moving in the opposite direction.

You catch one or two of the enemy's mechs and then see your own direwolf blip disappear on the map as he is overrun.

Then he loudly complains in all chat: "OMG MY TEAM LEFT ME TO DIE!"

No idiot, you let yourself die by not understanding the map spawns and standing around by yourself. You have the time to get out of there at 53 kph, but you have to move with a purpose and cut corners when necessary. Worst case scenario, you should be running and gunning to discourage anyone from pushing your position.

Your team then has to keep moving, cutting corners to catch their slow tail.

This is how Skirmish plays. You can cry all day about the injustices of it, but it plays this way because being aggressive from the start works. If you can't handle moving ASAP when the match starts, and you hate constantly moving all game, UNCHECK SKIRMISH.

On almost every map skirmish has spread out spawn points. In fact many maps isolate one spawn point from the rest which can create an 8v4 situation if you let it happen.

• Assault is perfect for players who like immobile game modes because the turrets hinder mobility and pushes. You also all spawn closer together on every map.

• Conquest has similarly close starting spawns. So it's perfect for people who want to start close together, but still like moving around later in the match.

If you insist on playing Skirmish in your slow mech, then I beg you to learn to keep up, and cut more corners when you feel you're getting left behind. If we're on caustic and the team is rotating around the caldera to catch their slow lrm boats, CUT THROUGH THE CALDERA. Use your superior firepower to keep the enemy team from shooting you. Above all, pay attention to the map and the position of your team.

Edited by Jman5, 28 July 2014 - 08:47 AM.

[DONTOR]

Its true.. its true. Playing assult in super slow fatties is the way to go.

[GoManGo]

This is the condescending type of rubbish the belongs in K-Town. When I play assault I flank with my unit and team and lay down crippling fire so the heavy's mediums and lights can get the cherry kills.I still get many assists and a few kills plus 200-800 damage averaged per battle.So you can have your point of view but I think your just a crybaby wannabe that is mad you cannot win battles because you might have low skills.

[Brizna]

In river city they should change the drop points. One team should be droped in uper city (all of it), and the other in the oposite corner. Sure the battle would end up being the same thing again, but that's the map being way too small and that silly river in the middle but at least we wouldn't have the problem we have now, specially for newbies that don't realize the immediate danger they are in if they don't mofe FAST.

[divinedisclaimer]

You shouldn't abandon that Dire Wolf, Atlas, Highlander, or Banshee because it's going to contribute greatly to the fight even in a worst case scenario by taking forever to kill. If the pilot is competent, they'll probably kill at least one enemy, too.

If you're faster and you see a slow mech out alone, you should automatically pull towards it, and generally so should the other players on your team. Leaving that mech alone is a waste.

Brizna, on 28 July 2014 - 08:50 AM, said:

In river city they should change the drop points. One team should be droped in uper city (all of it), and the other in the oposite corner. Sure the battle would end up being the same thing again, but that's the map being way too small and that silly river in the middle but at least we wouldn't have the problem we have now, specially for newbies that don't realize the immediate danger they are in if they don't mofe FAST.

The other day myself in an Atlas D and a friend in a Direwolf held the choke point at the base of the plateau against over six mechs (including at least one Warhawk and another Atlas) long enough for our team to respond. We spawned opposite, the enemy rotated to upper and we crossed the water.

We were so slow the enemy wrapped all the way back around be the time we crossed. The key to what won us this game was having teammates who were willing to abort their rotation and flip directions to stage a fight in lower city, where our assaults were.

Assault is my least favorite class personally.

I strongly recommend using UAV's and possibly upgrading them. Radar helps a lot of players with awareness. There are situations where you can't talk (always) and you don't have time to type-talk; or typing would otherwise be ignored- but a UAV call for help will garner a response from unorganized players.

Edited by divinedisclaimer, 28 July 2014 - 08:59 AM.

[Adiuvo]

GoManGo, on 28 July 2014 - 08:48 AM, said:

This is the condescending type of rubbish the belongs in K-Town. When I play assault I flank with my unit and team and lay down crippling fire so the heavy's mediums and lights can get the cherry kills.I still get many assists and a few kills plus 200-800 damage averaged per battle.So you can have your point of view but I think your just a crybaby wannabe that is mad you cannot win battles because you might have low skills.

If you think his post was condescending rather than true, I have a mirror to sell you.

Point is that if you're bringing a slow mech to skirmish you need to know the basic opening movements of every map. On River City, you're either going citadel or upper base. Alpine, you're always pushing for I9 hill. Frozen City, you're pushing dropship. In a slow mech like a Daishi you can't just sit around waiting then whine when you get picked off because the rest of your team knows what they're doing.

[Jman5]

divinedisclaimer, on 28 July 2014 - 08:52 AM, said:

You shouldn't abandon that Dire Wolf, Atlas, Highlander, or Banshee because it's going to contribute greatly to the fight even in a worst case scenario by taking forever to kill.

If you're faster and you see a slow mech out alone, you should automatically pull towards it, and generally so should the other players on your team. Leaving that mech alone is a waste.

If you stop at the beginning of every match and wait for some mech who's walking in a zig zag and stopping every 10 seconds to look around, you will always miss out on getting an easy kill or two at the start. Skirmish rewards aggression not playing passively and slow.

I know a lot of people don't want to hear it and will react negatively to this thread, but Skirmish rewards aggressive and mobile play from the get-go. If you move quickly enough and take advantage of map spawn locations, you can ensure your team an easy win in the first two minutes. Conversely if you sit around at the start or go the wrong way, you can ensure your team the loss.

All I'm saying is that if you find yourself on the receiving end of these early deaths, you need to either learn to keep up better or uncheck skirmish. Because it's not the team's fault, it's yours.

[AlmightyAeng]

GoManGo, on 28 July 2014 - 08:48 AM, said:

This is the condescending type of rubbish the belongs in K-Town. When I play assault I flank with my unit and team and lay down crippling fire so the heavy's mediums and lights can get the cherry kills.I still get many assists and a few kills plus 200-800 damage averaged per battle.So you can have your point of view but I think your just a crybaby wannabe that is mad you cannot win battles because you might have low skills.

Read his whole post. His point isn't "don't play assaults in skirmish!!!" His point is "Don't play assaults like an idiot and rely on your team to surround your slower mech."

[Roadkill]

Jman5, on 28 July 2014 - 09:00 AM, said:

I know a lot of people don't want to hear it and will react negatively to this thread, but Skirmish rewards aggressive and mobile play from the get-go. If you move quickly enough and take advantage of map spawn locations, you can ensure your team an easy win in the first two minutes. Conversely if you sit around at the start or go the wrong way, you can ensure your team the loss.

Conversely, if you blindly run off and abandon your assaults you can also ensure your team the loss.

Or if you stop with the NASCAR and instead move to support Charlie Lance from the beginning, you can meet the enemy's blind rush head on and crush it, thus ensuring your team an easy win.

Stop blaming the assaults for being assaults. The more mobile Mechs are just as responsible for the bad play as the assaults, because instead of abandoning their assaults they should have adjusted their tactics to support them.

Just because a couple of idiots dash off doesn't mean you should follow them. Everyone should be assessing the team composition while waiting for the game to start, and if Charlie Lance contains assaults then everyone should re-assess the NASCAR strategy.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Move early or die. End of story.

[Felio]

Great post, and I would add that if you're in an IS mech and can't keep up, get a bigger engine. Less pew pew, more vroom vroom.

[GoManGo]

GHOSTBADGER={Read his whole post. His point isn't "don't play assaults in skirmish!!!" His point is "Don't play assaults like an idiot and rely on your team to surround your slower mech." }


Your joking right? I read his post and he is wrong dead wrong first off most players that are left playing MWO are not new players. Secondly its the Heavies not assaults that are running off charging in getting killed mostly timberwolf pilots that think there so LEET33 there head is enormous.

So lets get the record straight here most assault pilots are left behind to die 2-5 v1 because there faster teammates left them .I rarely see a experienced assault pilot run off by himself and like I said I have not seen to many new players lately so who is the OP referring to? Assault pilots on there own island or playing a different game than he is?

I still think the OP is just crying because he is not whining battles or he is just having a bad hair day.

[Jman5]

Roadkill, on 28 July 2014 - 09:18 AM, said:

Conversely, if you blindly run off and abandon your assaults you can also ensure your team the loss.

Or if you stop with the NASCAR and instead move to support Charlie Lance from the beginning, you can meet the enemy's blind rush head on and crush it, thus ensuring your team an easy win.

Stop blaming the assaults for being assaults. The more mobile Mechs are just as responsible for the bad play as the assaults, because instead of abandoning their assaults they should have adjusted their tactics to support them.

Just because a couple of idiots dash off doesn't mean you should follow them. Everyone should be assessing the team composition while waiting for the game to start, and if Charlie Lance contains assaults then everyone should re-assess the NASCAR strategy.

You're not blindly running off. You're moving with a purpose to take advantage of any opportunities the enemy team gave you with a mismatch in force strength (8v4). You're then continuing the movement to put pressure on any players who got tunnel vision.

It's a pretty simple philosophy. You can play passive, and reactive. Hope that the enemy comes to you. Or you can play aggressive and pro-active. Create your own opportunities. In skirmish mode, playing aggressive and pro-active rewards you best. If you spend all your time waiting for that one guy zig-zagging around to finally group up with you before you do anything, you will never have an opportunity to actually do anything.

Assault mode tends to reward the passive/reactive approach more because you have turrets supplementing your position. Both Conquest and Assault have close spawning locations so you more or less start grouped up by default.

Skirmish is a different beast and you need to treat it as such. Adapt to the mobility or play a different game mode. Because whining that you got left behind is not going to change how its played.

Edited by Jman5, 28 July 2014 - 09:40 AM.

[Davers]

GoManGo, on 28 July 2014 - 09:26 AM, said:

GHOSTBADGER={Read his whole post. His point isn't "don't play assaults in skirmish!!!" His point is "Don't play assaults like an idiot and rely on your team to surround your slower mech." }


Your joking right? I read his post and he is wrong dead wrong first off most players that are left playing MWO are not new players. Secondly its the Heavies not assaults that are running off charging in getting killed mostly timberwolf pilots that think there so LEET33 there head is enormous.

So lets get the record straight here most assault pilots are left behind to die 2-5 v1 because there faster teammates left them .I rarely see a experienced assault pilot run off by himself and like I said I have not seen to many new players lately so who is the OP referring to? Assault pilots on there own island or playing a different game than he is?

I still think the OP is just crying because he is not whining battles or he is just having a bad hair day.

The OP is specifically talking about River City Skirmish, and about slow mechs that spawn near the ship and stand around instead of moving with their team. He is not making sweeping generalizations about all assault mech pilots in every match, mode, or map.

I would also like to add that if a lance decides they are going to make a stand of it at the airstrip they should really tell the rest of their team, not wait until everyone has pushed past the park and starts seeing the kill announcements.

[WarHippy]

There is some truth in what the OP said, however the blame often falls on both parties. The Assault mechs should do what they can to keep up with the team, but this is a team game and your team shouldn't be running off so they can pad their stats in their lust for a free kill. Being a team game you need to be working together to accomplish your goals, and sometimes that means forgoing the free kills to support your stragglers so they don't end up as the free kills for the other team.

[Bulletsponge0]

I read "I won't support the assault mechs, because that might hurt my KDR"

[Odins Fist]

Jman5, on 28 July 2014 - 08:43 AM, said:

"Dear Assaults: If You Can't Handle Mobility Uncheck Skirmish"

I'm seeing a trend, but it doesn't exactly involve ASSAULT pilots attempting to hide in the backfield.

Particularly in Atlas pilots...
They seem to be doing the reverse of what was happening a few months ago, I will explain.

Lately I have seen more Atlas assault mechs moving slower, and ditching the bigger engines so they can mount as much firepower as possible to compensate for the Clan Mech Boogyman. I see a lot of 48 and 52KPH Atlases struggling to keep up, and I have even seen slower Victors.

Now with the Victor, it's one advantage (non previous poptarting), is it's speed.
The Victor handles a XL enging very well, 81 KPH is not uncommon, the Victor is an escort destroyer/flanker, and it does that job well, BUT the Atlas can be TOPS between 62 and 64KPH with a downgrade in the amount of heavy firepower it can take.

So what we have in that example is a slower assault (Atlas) lagging behind much faster Heavies like the TimberWolf and others.

IF the Atlas pilot lingers even for 30 seconds to watch a Flank, or to take a couple of pot-shots, or whatever, then they are WAY behind the team, especially if the Terrain has hills and or inclines.

A while back people got smart with the gameplay at the time, and ran biiger engines in the Atlas (not XL engines), and they saw that mobility/speed was something that gave the Atlas a little more survivability in certain situations.

Now with Clan Heavies and Assaults living rent free in their minds, I see a lot more pilots attempting to compensate by dropping engine sizes and mounting as much firepower as possible.

This is only one example, and I do not think it represents the answer to every assault pilot not being more aggressive in a match, but it certainly has been part of it from what I have seen.

I took my Atlas out recently, and everytime there was another Atlas on my team, I was outpacing them, and thinking "Why is that guy so slow?".
Then I started to look at those Mechs at Top speed while the team was trying to position at beginning of match, and I noticed 52 and 48KPH top speeds on those Mechs.

It seems like every other Mech on the field these days (especially Clan Mechs) are running in the 80KPH range that some assaults I.E, The Stalker, The Atlas just cannot match.

I think this is just part of your issue.

Edited by Odins Fist, 28 July 2014 - 10:38 AM.

[Vandul]

Dont buy into this. Its a light or a medium pilot whos moaning because he ran out, got his face pushed in, and the waddlers finally made it to the fight all fresh and stuff and took all of the widdle biddy kills.

Skirmish is made for all mechs.

[Maver0ick]

OP, I agree. Slow assaults must start moving to the team or cover immediately when the game starts. If you stay at the spawn point to finish reading some internet article or to configure your weapons' group, then it is not your team's fault that you die. If you stop moving and turn around to find the enemy that shot ER large lasers at you from over 1200m, then it is not your team's fault that you die. I pilot Atlases and Direwolves and I don't have any problem getting to the team or safety without at least 99% health still intact.

In river city, it is suicide to re-cross the river to help the assault that refused to move from the spawn point.

If your assaults are moving smart, you shouldn't let them die though.

GoManGo, on 28 July 2014 - 08:48 AM, said:

This is the condescending type of rubbish the belongs in K-Town. When I play assault I flank with my unit and team and lay down crippling fire so the heavy's mediums and lights can get the cherry kills.I still get many assists and a few kills plus 200-800 damage averaged per battle.So you can have your point of view but I think your just a crybaby wannabe that is mad you cannot win battles because you might have low skills.

Nobody is saying that assaults don't contribute a lot in a fight. The OP is saying that if you bring an assault to skirmish, don't loiter around the spawn point.

[Goose]

As interesting as this thread is, I fail to see how "stick with the blob" counts as aggressive …