MWO: Forums - The Gauss / Particle Projection Directive - Feedback

Livewyr, on 30 July 2014 - 08:25 AM, said:

Ok? Good on you, but how is this Ironic- or relevant?

You brought up storm crows.

Livewyr, on 30 July 2014 - 08:25 AM, said:

Nice Anecdote.. about using the current convergence system to do it? (Even if you are not using FLD, almost everything in this game is PP to your reticule)

Not using pinpoint builds, that means lasers (usually two at a time) or massed UACs, neither of which would be effected particularly.

Livewyr, on 30 July 2014 - 08:25 AM, said:

Or are you masterfully killing them at range with LBXs and SRMs?

SRMs, range......I think I have two mechs that even have a LBX mounted.....LBX + er-PPC will leg a light just fine I've found.

Livewyr, on 30 July 2014 - 08:25 AM, said:

What if I told you.. I can aim?
Anecdotes aside- quit evading the argument. You KNOW an RNG spread mechanic on weapons convergence would just be a huge buff to lights (and a huge nerf to Assaults) and a drastic reduction in skill.

So you can aim.

.....and lights DON'T need a buff? Really?

Really?

Clear communication is OP. What you meant was "They are basing hitboxes off of a game that used RNG for accuracy."
That is true.

Livewyr, on 30 July 2014 - 08:25 AM, said:

They also changed the profile sizes of the mechs and made everything in real time.

Now, what is your point?

Yeah they screwed that up as well, why the hell is a Treb as tall as a Cataphract?

Livewyr, on 30 July 2014 - 08:25 AM, said:

Every other mainstream shooter has similarly sized characters moving at similar speeds, with similar amounts of "health."

There is nothing I have seen in any shooter where there is a character the size of a Locust or Spider compared to an Atlas.

Yeah so, the one locust I see every 10 games usually goes pretty quickly.

Edited by Yokaiko, 30 July 2014 - 08:31 AM.

Paul, if you want serious feedback, please, consider the following review on all aspects of the game. As mentioned by others before, the PPC/Gauss "PPFLD" is but one of many symptoms to a lot of problems.

-The Fundamentals-

-Convergence-

Arm Lock must be removed entirely. If not possible, the mechanics must be changed so the arms on a Mech are not totally fixated dead center to the Center Torso's cross hairs. This means that the arm cross hair would stray a small distance from CT's cross hair. Basically having a more restricted arm movement. The point to this it to maintain damage spread between the arms and CT.

Another issue is the cross hairs them selves. As a Mech moves, the cross hairs remain dead center in the HUD. This must be changed so that the cross hairs follows the Mech's every bob and weave as it moves. This in turn will spread the damage across a targeted Mech 's chassis. This is what we have now when we enter third-person view but not as elaborated.

-Sized Hard Points-

To maintain a balanced game, this must be implemented. Not only will it bring balance to Mech builds, but it will open up opportunities for un used Mech chassis, a key to make role warfare viable.

Sized Hard Points will allow and disallow the instalment of certain weapons for a Mech depending on it's Chassis.

This also must result in the removal of the current heat penalty system since cramming many large weapons together will be non existent for all Mechs and only those who were built around such weapons will be allowed to do so. Having the penalties will make those specific Mechs unviable (one example being the "Awesome" AWS-8Q).

The Sized Hard Point System:

Class 1- Used only for small weapon systems.

-IS-
Class 1 Weapon Systems:
Energy: TAG, Flamer, Small Laser Family, Medium Laser Family.
Ballistic: Machine Gun, AC 2.
Missile: NARC, SSRM 2, SRM 2, SRM 4, LRM 5

-CLAN-
Class 1 Weapon Systems:
Energy: TAG, Flamer, Small Laser Family, Medium Laser Family.
Ballistic: Machine Gun, AC 2 Family.
Missile: NARC, SSRM 2, SRM 2, SSRM 4, SRM 4, LRM 5

Class 2- Used only for average sized weapons. Can accommodate Class 1 weapons of its respective type.
-IS-
Class 2 Weapon Systems:
Energy: Large laser Family.
Ballistic: AC 5, UAC 5.
Missile: SRM 6, LRM 10

-CLAN-
Class 2 Weapon Systems:
Energy: Large laser Family.
Ballistic: AC 5 Family
Missile: SSRM 6, SRM 6, LRM 10

Class 3- Used only for large and heavy weapon systems. Can accommodate any Class 1 and 2 weapons systems of their respective type.

-IS-
Class 3 Weapon Systems:
Energy: PPC, ER PPC.
Ballistic: AC 10, LB 10-X AC.
Missile: LRM 15

-CLAN-
Class 3 Weapon Systems:
Energy: ER PPC.
Ballistic: AC 10 Family
Missile: LRM 15

Class 4- Reserved for the largest and heaviest weapon systems and can accommodate all other Class sizes.

-IS-
Class 4 Weapon Systems:
Ballistic: Gauss Rifle, AC 20
Missile: LRM 20

-CLAN-
Class 4 Weapon Systems:
Ballistic: Gauss Rifle, AC 20 Family
Missile: LRM 20

-INNER SPHERE Mech List with the Sized Hard Point System-

Spoiler

-CLAN Mech List with the Sized Hard Point System-

Spoiler

-EQUIPMENT-

-ECM Changes-

ECM must be changed from a radar stealth field, information and guided missile denial system to an information denial system and guided missile counter measure.

This means ECM will no longer make the user and those around them incapable of being targeted. Instead ECM will deny those who are targeting the user from transmitting their location information as well as an increase to target information gathering and missile lock-on times. Those within the 180m bubble will still receive the benefits but at reduced effectiveness, specifically target info gathering and missile lock on times.

The systems that denied or bypassed ECM are also to be changed back. UAV, NARC, and Beagle Active Probe will no longer disable and or bypass ECM.
BAP will instead allow the user who has it installed to detect an ECM user. This means that those who do not have BAP installed will not receive the "Low Signal" warning and cannot identify which mech is transmitting the ECM signal.

PPCs and another ECM however will still be capable to disrupting an enemy ECM.

ECM will also change how missiles behave. Instead of denying a lock on to LRMs and SSRMs, ECM will disable LRM and SRM ARTERMIS IV equipped enhancements turning them in to standard LRMS and SRMs. While on the other hand, standard LRMs and SSRMs will remain the same, but the moment they enter the ECM field their flight pattern will be scrambled and become erratic, leading to an increase to missile spread or even a possible miss on some missiles.

-Balance to Weapons-

All weapons must have an increase to their reload times. In turn most of the weapons values must change in order to reflect this change.

-The problem with "Pinpoint Frontloaded Damage"-

This flawed weapon mechanic that defines both Clan and IS Gauss Rifles, and IS PPCs is something that must be dealt with. This feature not only invalidated Lights and Medium mechs when pitted against larger mechs, but also reduces the kill times for larger mechs considerably.

A recent mechanic found only on the Clan ER-PPC makes it's damage spread across three sections of a targeted enemy mech. While it indeed reduced the total front loaded damage it is still quite considerable, and this feature is not found on the IS PPC. One way to remove the "FLD" property of the PPC family is by converting the weapon to function similarly to either a laser or a pulse laser. If the properties are made, it can be made to have a short beam duration equal to a pulse laser. This will allow the pilot who is being fired upon to have a chance to spread the damage across other sections.

Gauss Rifles are a different story. Even with the proposed Sized Hard Point system, there would still be mechs capable of loading up to two of these. The latest limitation of having a mech fire only two at a time was a step in the right direction, yet it would still mean that a targeted opponent would receive a whopping 30 points of damage.

In order to spread this massive damage the weapon needs to fire in bursts as well. It wouldn't be far fetched if the weapon could fire multiple slugs out of it, this would give reason to having to charge the weapon. This would mean that both IS and Clan Gauss Rifles would fire four slugs in .75s, each one dealing 3.75 pts. of damage.

An increase to the cool down of these weapons to seven seconds should make it less of a hassle in addition to limiting a mech to firing only one of each (PPC/Gauss Rifle) at a time instead of two.

Autocannons:

The addition of Clan weapons introduced a much needed balance feature of burst fire auto cannons. While it was a step in the right direction, the Inner Sphere Autocannons must have this feature implemented to them.

As to make both factions AC weaponry feel different, the general rule of having Clan weapons having extended damage over time should be in effect.

Standard Burst Fire mode models for Inner Sphere:

AC 2: Fires a burst of four rounds dealing 0.5 damage in 0.25 seconds each.
AC 5: Fires a burst of four rounds dealing 1.5 damage in 0.25 seconds each.
AC 10: Fires a burst of four rounds dealing 2.5 damage in 0.25 seconds each.
AC 20: Fires a burst of four rounds dealing 5 damage in 0.25 seconds each.

Standard Burst Fire mode models for Clans:

AC 2: Fires a burst of eight rounds dealing 0.25 damage in 0.19 seconds each.
AC 5: Fires a burst of eight rounds dealing 0.625 damage in 0.19 seconds each.
AC 10: Fires a burst of eight rounds dealing 1.25 damage in 0.19 seconds each.
AC 20: Fires a burst of eight rounds dealing 2.5 damage in 0.19 seconds each.

If and when manufacturers are added, more types of burst fire models could exist.

Ballistic Arcing:

Current ballistic arcing barely exists for auto cannons. To further define auto cannons from other weapons, an increase to the ballistic arcing on them must be added.

To make this feature user friendly, auto cannons would begin their ballistic arc once they reach their maximum range and then begin to drop to the ground for every meter on their path to the maximum effective range.

-Missile Weapons-

New launching mechanic:

With the addition of Clan LRMs, staggered fire is now possible. Although only the C-LRMS have this feature, it should be a feature on all missile based weapons (SRM and SSRM).

To maintain a difference between both IS and Clans, Inner Sphere launchers should fire in salvos:

LRMs will fire in sets of Fives.

SRM and SSRMs will fire in sets of Two.

All Clan missiles should fire in a stream.

Further LRM changes:

The way the LRMs pick their targets must change to the same way SSRMs pick their target but not as randomized. Meaning each missile will have a designated target upon successful lock on.

This should apply to both Clan and IS.

LRM Damage Spread:

Standard:
LRM 5: 1 L. Arm, 1 R. Arm, 1 L. Torso, 1 R. Torso, 1 C. Torso.

LRM 10: 1 L. Arm, 1 R. Arm, 1 L. Leg, 1 R leg, 2 L. Torso, 2 R. Torso, 2 C. Torso.

LRM 15: 2 L. Arm, 2 R. Arm, 1 L. Leg, 1 R leg, 3 L. Torso, 3 R. Torso, 3 C. Torso.

LRM 20: 3 L. Arm, 3 R. Arm, 2 L. Leg, 2 R leg, 3 L. Torso, 3 R. Torso, 4 C. Torso.

With ARTERMIS IV FCS:
LRM 5: 2 L. Torso, 2 R. Torso, 1 C. Torso.

LRM 10: 1 L. Arm, 1 R. Arm, 3 L. Torso, 3 R. Torso, 2 C. Torso.

LRM 15: 2 L. Arm, 2 R. Arm, 4 L. Torso, 4 R. Torso, 3 C. Torso.

LRM 20: 3 L. Arm, 3 R. Arm, 5 L. Torso, 5 R. Torso, 4 C. Torso.

There would be 1% chance for each missile to be assigned a lock on to the Head when lock on is achieved, with our without ARTERMIS IV.

Dumb fired LRMs will follow their arcing and straight flight pattern corresponding to their launcher.

-New Weapon Values based on the proposed changes-

-INNER SPHERE-

Energy Weapon Values:

WEAPON	DAMAGE	HEAT	RANGE	MAXIMUM RANGE	COOLDOWN	DURATION
SMALL LASER	3	1	100	200	2	1
SMALL PULSE LASER	3.5	2	100	200	1.5	0.5
MEDIUM LASER	5	4	270	550	3	1
MEDIUM PULSE LASER	6	5	200	400	2.5	0.5
LARGE LASER	8	8	450	900	4	1
ER LARGE LASER	8	12	675	1,350	4	1
LARGE PULSE LASER	10	10	350	700	3	0.5
PPC	10	10	90-540	1,080	7	-
ER PPC	10	15	810	1,500	7	-
FLAMER*	0.70	3*	90	90	-	∞

*Flamer's lack of reload keeps it where it stands now with the exception that it will produce 1 heat units per 0.5 seconds on the target and 3 heat units per 0.5 seconds on the user

(regardless if the weapon is hitting a target or not). This should prevent stun locks.

Standard Burst Fire Auto Cannons:

WEAPON	DAMAGE	HEAT	RANGE	MAXIMUM RANGE	COOLDOWN	DURATION
AC/2	0.5	1	720	1,440	2	1
AC/5	1.5	1	620	1,240	3	1
ULTRA AC/5	1.5	1	600	1,200	3	1
AC/10	2.5	3	450	900	3	1
AC/20	5	7	270	540	4	1

LB-X (Damage per pellet):

WEAPON	DAMAGE	HEAT	RANGE	MAXIMUM RANGE	COOLDOWN
LB10-X	1 X 10	2	540	1,620	3

Missile Weapon Values:

WEAPON	DAMAGE	HEAT	RANGE	MAXIMUM RANGE	COOLDOWN
SSRM 2	2 PER MISSILE	2	270	270	2
SRM 2	2 PER MISSILE	2	270	270	2
SRM 4	2 PER MISSILE	3	270	270	2
SRM 6	2 PER MISSILE	6	270	270	3
LRM 5	1 PER MISSILE	2	180-1,000	1,000	3
LRM 10	1 PER MISSILE	4	180-1,000	1,000	3.5
LRM 15	1 PER MISSILE	5	180-1,000	1,000	4
LRM 20	1 PER MISSILE	6	180-1,000	1,000	5

-CLANS-

Energy Weapon Values:

WEAPON	DAMAGE	HEAT	RANGE	MAXIMUM RANGE	COOLDOWN	DURATION
ER-SMALL LASER	5	2	180	360	2	1.75
SMALL PULSE LASER	4	2	180	360	1.5	1
ER-MEDIUM LASER	7	5	450	900	3	1.75
MEDIUM PULSE LASER	7	5	400	800	2.5	1
ER-LARGE LASER	10	12	890	1,780	4	1.75
LARGE PULSE LASER	10	12	600	1,200	3	1
ER-PPC	15	15	810	1,620	7	-
FLAMER*	0.70	3*	90	90	-	∞

Standard Burst Fire Auto Cannons:

WEAPON	DAMAGE	HEAT	RANGE	MAXIMUM RANGE	COOLDOWN	DURATION
AC/2	0.25	1	900	1,800	2	1.52
ULTRA AC/2	0.25	1	810	1,620	2	1.52
AC/5	0.625	1	720	1,440	3	1.52
ULTRA AC/5	0.625	1	630	1,260	3	1.52
AC/10	1.25	3	540	1,080	3	1.52
ULTRA AC/10	1.25	3	540	1,080	3	1.52
AC/20	2.5	7	360	720	4	1.52
ULTRA AC/20	2.5	7	360	720	4	1.52

LB-X (damage per pellet. All will fire 10 pellets. LB20-X will fire 20 pellets):

WEAPON	DAMAGE	HEAT	RANGE	MAXIMUM RANGE	COOLDOWN
LB-2X	0.2 x 10	1	900	1,800	2
LB-5X	0.5x 10	1	720	1,440	3
LB-10X	1 x 10	2	540	1,080	3
LB-20X	1 x 20	6	360	720	4

Missile Weapon Values:

WEAPON	DAMAGE	HEAT	RANGE	MAXIMUM RANGE	COOLDOWN
SSRM 2	2 PER MISSILE	2	360	360	3.5
SSRM 4	2 PER MISSILE	3	360	360	5.25
SSRM 6	2 PER MISSILE	4	360	360	7
SRM 2	2 PER MISSILE	2	270	270	2
SRM 4	2 PER MISSILE	3	270	270	3
SRM 6	2 PER MISSILE	4	270	270	4
LRM 5	1 PER MISSILE	2	180-1,000	1,000	3.25
LRM 10	1 PER MISSILE	4	180-1,000	1,000	3.75
LRM 15	1 PER MISSILE	5	180-1,000	1,000	4.25
LRM 20	1 PER MISSILE	6	180-1,000	1,000	5

-THE HEAT SYSTEM-

- Heat Management-

Currently, the only penalties to heat is an instant shutdown when going beyond the, some what forgiving, heat threshold and damage over to the internal structure of a mech when shut down due to overheating. This needs to be addressed. As it apparently stands, the heat threshold increases with every added heat sink. This has to be changed so that the threshold is static.

As demonstrated in this graph based on in game numbers there is one essential component missing from the Heat System:

Posted Image

Heat penalties are key in avoiding constant alpha striking currently plaguing the game. Following the chart, one can take in to account the following penalties:

Fixed modifiers on speed. Increasing with heat generated.

Fixed modifiers on torso and arm movement/convergence. Increasing with heat generated.

Chance of ammunition explosion upon reaching: 65% heat on single heat sinks, 87% heat on double heat sinks.

-New Numbers for Heat Sinks-

For heat sinks to work properly under the new system the numbers must reflect it.

As it stands now, Single Heat Sinks dissipate 1 heat over the course of 10 seconds, resulting in a heat dissipation of 0.10 heats per second. This is fundamentally flawed, both for the current game and this proposed system.

For the heat sinks to work the numbers must be raised to reflect the re-fire rate of weapons. The new numbers are as follow:

Single Heat Sinks:
1 heat over 5 seconds. A 0.20 heat dissipation per second value.

Double Heat Sinks:
2 heat over 5 seconds. A 0.40 heat dissipation per second value. An alternative to Double heat sinks following the current model that can also work could be 1.75 heat over 5 seconds, a 0.35 heat dissipation per second value.

The values are the same weather the heat sinks are part of the engine or not.

-Comments-

This feedback arose from hours of game play experience in MW:O since closed beta, current and past user feedback and the hope to fix the balance problems on the only modern Mech Warrior simulator game.

These changes were made to complement one another. One can't work without the other. So in order for this proposal to work, most, if not all of these must come out together.

Sources:

Mech and weapon stats:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne.../#module_normal

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Main_Page

Heat Sink info:

http://mwomercs.com/...eat-management/

Discussion of Heat System:
http://mwomercs.com/...os-heat-system/

The Gauss / Particle Projection Directive - Feedback

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