946 replies to this topic

[MischiefSC]

Kjudoon, on 23 August 2014 - 07:58 PM, said:

No, it's about not having to play at a no-fun pro level every match just to have a little success.

Does the fact that you drop solo mean you can't play well with others or utilize teamwork and look beyond your own ends? No... it doesn't.

Quit trying to make conclusions on mendacious thoughts about what others think or do.

Some really nasty thoughts around here masquerading as intellectualism.

It's really simple. Solo queue is for solo playing. That's part of what keeps the environment level and even. Syncdropping has no built-in balancing mechanic, such as more than 1 team per side.

What you are absolutely doing is making an excuse for trying to cheat to get an advantage. 'It's totally okay, because I don't like losing in the group queue but I do like winning, so I'm going to try and get a group advantage in the solo queue since nobody else really is doing it - because it's the SOLO QUEUE.'

You're exploiting for an advantage because you don't like losing, because you lose in the group queue.

Exploiting is exploiting. Even if PGI doesn't ban you for it it's still feeble.

[Kjudoon]

Sandpit, on 23 August 2014 - 06:44 PM, said:

There's a huge difference in

"players who does this are breaking the spirit of the rule"
and
"players who do this are cheating"

As it stands right now, they're breaking the spirit of the rules, they're not cheating.


or give some ideas on how to improve it, which he constantly avoids doing in favor of calling me a liar, tryhard, etc.

Although I agree mostly with this, I wish to point out one small assumption:

"What IS this "spirit of the Solo Queue" thing anyway"?

Sync dropping is not against the rule. Why? You drop at the same time and run the gamble that your elo and timing matches you up in the same match and on the same team. Otherwise you're competing against each other. How is this against the spirit of the solo queue? What if you drop in a match at random and find yourself in a group of 2-4 of your friends who were solo dropping and you accidentally ended up in the same match. How is that different? I've had it happen dozens of times! Should this accidental happenstance force these people to quit match because they're 'violating' the 'spirit of the solo queue'? What kind of asinine thinking is this???

All a sync drop does is increase the chances of it happening. Suddenly this is 'cheating'? Well then every time you see someone you know in match and can use TS or even the chat function to coordinate with, you best drop out because Teamwork is OP and should be banned from the Solo Queue.

If playing completely on your own without any other person is that important to you, pressure PGI to create a solo story game and go off on your own. Otherwise find a game that does fill this need. I would LOVE LOVE LOVE PGI to create a solo story mode like MW4 so I didn't have to multiplayer. No serious. I'd LOVE it. Probably rarely see me on here much at all after that because then I can get mad at the computer and when I don't want any challenge anymore, I'd go to easy mode or play a cheat code and just walk through.

[Sandpit]

MischiefSC, on 23 August 2014 - 08:17 PM, said:

Even if PGI doesn't ban you for it it's still feeble.

Now here's where we disagree a bit. If PGI doesn't ban you, then it's obviously not cheating. You having the opinion of it being feeble is valid because that's your opinion. That doesn't mean it's cheating though and that's all I was pointing out.

[Kjudoon]

MischiefSC, on 23 August 2014 - 08:17 PM, said:

It's really simple. Solo queue is for solo playing. That's part of what keeps the environment level and even. Syncdropping has no built-in balancing mechanic, such as more than 1 team per side.

What you are absolutely doing is making an excuse for trying to cheat to get an advantage. 'It's totally okay, because I don't like losing in the group queue but I do like winning, so I'm going to try and get a group advantage in the solo queue since nobody else really is doing it - because it's the SOLO QUEUE.'

You're exploiting for an advantage because you don't like losing, because you lose in the group queue.

Exploiting is exploiting. Even if PGI doesn't ban you for it it's still feeble.

Absolute mularky! Sync drop doesn't need a 'balance mechanic'. None whatsoever. You think that the sync dropped individuals are hiding good elo among bad creating mismatches?

You know what the real complaint about sync dropping is? Teamwork is OP and I want it banned.

If an accidental sync happens, would you demand them banned from the solo queue? What kind of silliness is this???

You claim it's an advantage? If I drop with 5 other guys and it's 3 on one side, 3 on the other, what's the advantage? We're all the same elo as you. We just are smart enough to use teamwork and we'd be playing in the group queue if PGI didn't always force the matches into the solo queue. So who's the real complaint about here? PGI creating the illusion of a problem which is really just an excuse for why teams lose. You want to say "you can't handle it in the group queue" as a criticism, but God forbid a group of friends get lucky and end up in your match together, you can't handle it. Who's being the bigger hypocrite here? Do we really need to measure urine output on who's unable to hack groups more?

I love the fact we go from Syncdrops are cheating to Sync droppers are bad players. Okay, then you should roflstomp them every time and encourage them in your matches for easy victory. A little logical consistency goes a long way.

The solo queue. I drop alone and end up against my skill peers. If I happen to be in TS with someone else in match on my team, deliberately or not, OR I know how to use the chat function suddenly I'm OP. Sorry, this doesn't hold any credibility.

[MischiefSC]

Teamwork is not OP.

It is an advantage.

The entire point and purpose of having a solo queue - the entire reason for it to exist, the whole crux behind which the solo queue was created separate from the group queue was, indeed, to have an environment where people who are not in a group can play against each other on an even footing.

If there are groups in the solo queue it utterly and completely eliminates the point of having a solo queue. It should be called the 'syncdropping queue' as some sort of appeal to gamblers.

Let's make this perfectly absolutely crystal clear -

PGI has made a queue for people to solo play against each other.

It's called 'the solo queue'.

This is what makes it a different queue from 'the group queue'.

What you are doing is trying to exploit in the solo queue quite literally because you can't hack the group queue to play in groups. Group queues too hard? PLAY PRIVATE MATCHES.

Most people now have 7 days of premium time so premium private matches with your friends is now available.

That's not what you want though. What you want is to play with friends, on coms, against people who are not on coms. What you want is to exploit matchmaking mechanics to get an advantage.

That's exploiting and it's feeble. You can try and make excuses for exploiting and doing something that's feeble but that's all it is.

Sandpit, on 23 August 2014 - 08:32 PM, said:

Now here's where we disagree a bit. If PGI doesn't ban you, then it's obviously not cheating. You having the opinion of it being feeble is valid because that's your opinion. That doesn't mean it's cheating though and that's all I was pointing out.

Open container in public laws. They're still on the books in a few places. You can't have an open bottle of alcoholic beverage outside of a bar or your own home or property. The reality is that so long as it's in a paper bag and not obvious you're not going to get arrested.

That doesn't mean it's legal - it just means that it's *generally* not worth the hassle to bust you for it.

There's a big difference.

[Kjudoon]

BLOOD WOLF, on 23 August 2014 - 06:20 PM, said:

Well, I did jump in a ground and so far I won 4 out of 5 matches. with +7 kills.

yep. streaks like that occur. But just like vegas, gambler's ruin exists. My longest loss streak in groups is around 27 or so. I've also had a 19 game win streak. It's called statistical oscillation.

[Joseph Mallan]

Kjudoon, on 23 August 2014 - 07:58 PM, said:

No, it's about not having to play at a no-fun pro level every match just to have a little success.

Does the fact that you drop solo mean you can't play well with others or utilize teamwork and look beyond your own ends? No... it doesn't.

Quit trying to make conclusions on mendacious thoughts about what others think or do.

Some really nasty thoughts around here masquerading as intellectualism.

New word for me! Thank you!

[Sandpit]

Kjudoon, on 23 August 2014 - 08:25 PM, said:

Although I agree mostly with this, I wish to point out one small assumption:

"What IS this "spirit of the Solo Queue" thing anyway"?

Sync dropping is not against the rule. Why? You drop at the same time and run the gamble that your elo and timing matches you up in the same match and on the same team. Otherwise you're competing against each other. How is this against the spirit of the solo queue? What if you drop in a match at random and find yourself in a group of 2-4 of your friends who were solo dropping and you accidentally ended up in the same match. How is that different? I've had it happen dozens of times! Should this accidental happenstance force these people to quit match because they're 'violating' the 'spirit of the solo queue'? What kind of asinine thinking is this???

All a sync drop does is increase the chances of it happening. Suddenly this is 'cheating'? Well then every time you see someone you know in match and can use TS or even the chat function to coordinate with, you best drop out because Teamwork is OP and should be banned from the Solo Queue.

If playing completely on your own without any other person is that important to you, pressure PGI to create a solo story game and go off on your own. Otherwise find a game that does fill this need. I would LOVE LOVE LOVE PGI to create a solo story mode like MW4 so I didn't have to multiplayer. No serious. I'd LOVE it. Probably rarely see me on here much at all after that because then I can get mad at the computer and when I don't want any challenge anymore, I'd go to easy mode or play a cheat code and just walk through.

personally I have no issue with sync dropping. I drop in both queues. I play in groups, I drop solo (although for the past 3 weeks or so it's been exclusively solo queue simply because I don't have the time and energy to bother with TS because my work schedule has been a PitA , and I enjoy both for what they are. I just wanted to point out that it's not "cheating" regardless of what someone's opinion on it is.

This is one of those things I just don't feel strongly on one way or the other. It's not a big deal and I've never seen a team based game try so hard to make forming and playing with a team so vilified.

What ticks me off about things like the OP are listening to a player's consistent whining for 2 years complaining about how groups and group players are the reason they've got a horrible W/L or KDR.

Do players sync drop? Sure they do.
Do some players do it to "prey" on solo players? I'm sure there are
Is it accurate to try and lump every single player.group into that mentality? Absolutely not

Since the OP wanted to talk about the "evils" of things like Marik Monday Madness, let me explain the REAL mentality behind it (as opposed to an ignorant statement from someone who has absolutely no idea). We enjoy shooting one another. We enjoy talking smack to one another. We enjoy creating our own "challenges". Challenges? Yes, challenges. We set up things like "stock mech" or "lights only" or "phoenix mechs only" or "locusts only" so we can have some fun.

We also did it so we could play against one another and practice and just goof off and have bragging rights within the unit itself. Any other representation of Marik Monday Madness is simply wrong. Period.

Now, ALSO keep in mind this was BEFORE private matches, solo queues, etc. There were no other options if you wanted to play with or against fellow unit members. Sync drops were also used a lot of times to allow for teammates that couldn't team up with everyone else because of the 4 man limit. It was because we had no other choice.

If you agree with sync dropping, great. If you don't agree with sync dropping, great. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

[MischiefSC]

Kjudoon, on 23 August 2014 - 08:33 PM, said:

Absolute mularky! Sync drop doesn't need a 'balance mechanic'. None whatsoever. You think that the sync dropped individuals are hiding good elo among bad creating mismatches?

You know what the real complaint about sync dropping is? Teamwork is OP and I want it banned.

If an accidental sync happens, would you demand them banned from the solo queue? What kind of silliness is this???

You claim it's an advantage? If I drop with 5 other guys and it's 3 on one side, 3 on the other, what's the advantage? We're all the same elo as you. We just are smart enough to use teamwork and we'd be playing in the group queue if PGI didn't always force the matches into the solo queue. So who's the real complaint about here? PGI creating the illusion of a problem which is really just an excuse for why teams lose. You want to say "you can't handle it in the group queue" as a criticism, but God forbid a group of friends get lucky and end up in your match together, you can't handle it. Who's being the bigger hypocrite here? Do we really need to measure urine output on who's unable to hack groups more?

I love the fact we go from Syncdrops are cheating to Sync droppers are bad players. Okay, then you should roflstomp them every time and encourage them in your matches for easy victory. A little logical consistency goes a long way.

The solo queue. I drop alone and end up against my skill peers. If I happen to be in TS with someone else in match on my team, deliberately or not, OR I know how to use the chat function suddenly I'm OP. Sorry, this doesn't hold any credibility.

I play in the group queue all the time, I enjoy it, it's fun to play with my friends.

You're trying to strawman up some justification here and there is none. It's really super simple crystal clear. There's no ambiguity at all.

There are two queues.

One is the solo queue. It's for people to play solo against other people. A pure pug queue where nobody has any additional teamwork to call upon; it's you and whoever you drop with against another team of pugs. About as close as MW:O allows for PvE.

The other is the group queue. You drop with a group against other groups. Everyone has the same potential for grouping up and teamwork. It lets people play in groups of any size they want save 11. It was created, specifically, to let people play in groups without playing at an advantage against those who are not in groups.

You however want to play in groups in the solo queue. You have two reasons for this -

1. The group queue is hard because some groups are very competitive and you're not always in the mood for that.

2. You enjoy winning and it's fun to play with friends and win.

Which, together, boil down to the following:

You can't win in the group queue because it's hard so you want to take the group advantage and apply it to the solo queue so you can win more. Not because you are better but because you are exploiting an advantage that the solo queue exists, exclusively exists, to prevent.

Your justification is... what, PGI didn't try hard enough to keep you from exploiting it so it must be okay? That logic applies exactly as easily to any aimbot or hax. If someone can work it out then clearly PGI supports it, right? Right up until they get banned it's totally legit?

That's not justification it's bad excuses.

You want to group? Go group queue. You want to play solo? Play solo queue.

Trying to syncdrop to get a group advantage in the solo queue is exploiting the matchmaker for an advantage and it's... it's just plain feeble. It's flat out saying you can't handle the challenge of playing by the same rules everyone else plays by, you need an advantage for it to be fun.

There is absolutely no legit reason to syncdrop in the soloqueue. It's attempting to exploit matchmaker mechanics for an advantage. It's doing so when there are MULTIPLE other options (group queue, private matches, premium private matches) for you to take. You're not wanting to just 'play with friends'. You're wanting to play with an advantage with friends.

That is why it's feeble and mock-worthy.

I don't see it coming up very often and have probably barely run into it. I'd say the same about people using hack software for MW:O. That doesn't mean it's not exploiting or inherently weak, just uncommon. It's also not that big a deal - clearly PGI doesn't think so.

Doesn't mean it's not exploiting to get a potential advantage, or that it's not absolutely feeble.

[Sandpit]

MischiefSC, on 23 August 2014 - 08:36 PM, said:

Open container in public laws. They're still on the books in a few places.

that's exactly what makes it illegal. The fact that it's "on the books".

If it weren't on the books, your opinion on it might be that it's "feeble" but that wouldn't make it illegal

MischiefSC, on 23 August 2014 - 08:46 PM, said:

That is why it's feeble and mock-worthy.

but not cheating

[Joseph Mallan]

MischiefSC, on 23 August 2014 - 08:36 PM, said:

Teamwork is not OP.

It is an advantage.

The entire point and purpose of having a solo queue - the entire reason for it to exist, the whole crux behind which the solo queue was created separate from the group queue was, indeed, to have an environment where people who are not in a group can play against each other on an even footing.

If there are groups in the solo queue it utterly and completely eliminates the point of having a solo queue. It should be called the 'syncdropping queue' as some sort of appeal to gamblers.

Let's make this perfectly absolutely crystal clear -

PGI has made a queue for people to solo play against each other.

It's called 'the solo queue'.

This is what makes it a different queue from 'the group queue'.

What you are doing is trying to exploit in the solo queue quite literally because you can't hack the group queue to play in groups. Group queues too hard? PLAY PRIVATE MATCHES.

Most people now have 7 days of premium time so premium private matches with your friends is now available.

That's not what you want though. What you want is to play with friends, on coms, against people who are not on coms. What you want is to exploit matchmaking mechanics to get an advantage.

That's exploiting and it's feeble. You can try and make excuses for exploiting and doing something that's feeble but that's all it is.

The Highlighted is actually a lie. Not that the desire is, but the premise is a fallacy. There is no such thing as an equal footing here. Probably never will be.

Say you and I often drop randomly together, we play together so we learn to read the others intent. You and I have an advantage because of that. Now How can the game stop us from having that advantage anytime we randomly drop together? Familiarity is something that Solo wants to eliminate, But if You, Sandpit and I end up in a lot of matches together, we will gain that same advantage as premades.

[MischiefSC]

Sandpit, on 23 August 2014 - 08:47 PM, said:

that's exactly what makes it illegal. The fact that it's "on the books".

If it weren't on the books, your opinion on it might be that it's "feeble" but that wouldn't make it illegal

So the matchmaker for the solo queue is designed, specifically, to prevent groups in the queue. Is that correct, yes or no?

Syncdropping is an attempt to exploit other mechanics in the matchmaker to get around the purposeful limitation of not having groups in the solo queue, yes or no?

It's not hard to put together Sandpit, don't be obtuse. I already quoted the part of the CoC that talks about intentionally and repeatedly exploiting gaps in mechanics for an advantage.

It is on the books. It was on the books when the solo and group queue were split. Before groups were allowed. Syncdropping was uncool but within the context of the queue. It was bad enough and irksome enough however that PGI intentionally split the queues to create a solo queue. Now it's been made an inherent limitation of the solo queue that it's..... solo. To then continue to syncdrop to bypass that limitation for an advantage is intentionally exploiting the MM for a potential advantage.

Someone wants to group, do it in the group queue or private matches. Leave the solo queue for the solos.

[MischiefSC]

Joseph Mallan, on 23 August 2014 - 08:51 PM, said:

The Highlighted is actually a lie. Not that the desire is, but the premise is a fallacy. There is no such thing as an equal footing here. Probably never will be.

Say you and I often drop randomly together, we play together so we learn to read the others intent. You and I have an advantage because of that. Now How can the game stop us from having that advantage anytime we randomly drop together? Familiarity is something that Solo wants to eliminate, But if You, Sandpit and I end up in a lot of matches together, we will gain that same advantage as premades.

There is a distinct difference between an intentional mechanical advantage an an advantage that's a byproduct of experience, you know that Joe.

Attempting to conflate familiarity with the people you drop with as being identical to intentionally syncdropping to get an advantage via grouping up and using chat while in the pug queue is way disingenuous Joe.

In the context of playing solo the footing is (baring syncdropping) equal. Nobody is exploiting the matchmaker for an advantage. Syncdropping is the process of exploiting the matchmaker to get an additional advantage that is only equaled by.... exploiting the matchmaker.

In which case why not just make the solo queue part of the group queue?

Which it isn't, because the whole purpose of the solo queue is to not have groups in it. That's why they use the words 'solo' and 'group' respectively.

Pedantic attempts to conflate syncdropping with any other normal form of skill are trying to ignore the exact nature of what's going on.

If you learn to be a really, really good shot with a gun you have a skill with a gun.

If you have a bunch of friends who are good shots with sniper rifles, that's not the same thing.

If you enter a shooting contest for individual contestants to compare their shooting skills and you enter the rookie category because you are not that good but you've got a friend on a hill with a scoped rifle using a sabot round to match your caliber and have him plink out 10/10 for you while you put rounds in the dirt near the target....

you're cheating. Not because having a friend who's a good shot is bad but because you're exploiting the situation to get an advantage over the other contestants. Even if the contests rules don't say specifically 'you can't have someone else shoot for you and pass it off as your shots' that doesn't mean you're not cheating.

That's the difference. We're not even talking about you bringing a better rifle or better ammo, we're talking about you totally cheating the premise of a personal test of skill.

[Sandpit]

MischiefSC, on 23 August 2014 - 08:51 PM, said:

So the matchmaker for the solo queue is designed, specifically, to prevent groups in the queue. Is that correct, yes or no?

Syncdropping is an attempt to exploit other mechanics in the matchmaker to get around the purposeful limitation of not having groups in the solo queue, yes or no?

It's not hard to put together Sandpit, don't be obtuse. I already quoted the part of the CoC that talks about intentionally and repeatedly exploiting gaps in mechanics for an advantage.

It is on the books. It was on the books when the solo and group queue were split. Before groups were allowed. Syncdropping was uncool but within the context of the queue. It was bad enough and irksome enough however that PGI intentionally split the queues to create a solo queue. Now it's been made an inherent limitation of the solo queue that it's..... solo. To then continue to syncdrop to bypass that limitation for an advantage is intentionally exploiting the MM for a potential advantage.

Someone wants to group, do it in the group queue or private matches. Leave the solo queue for the solos.

Do you remember the big issue with FoV adjustments?

Many jumped up and down claiming it was cheating. They quoted CoC and ToS, heck even a mod or two said it was cheating.
Then PGI said otherwise.

Same thing here. There is absolutely nowhere in the CoC or ToS that says sync dropping is illegal or an exploit.

The only thing I pointed out is that it's not accurate to label it as "cheating" because it's not breaking any rules. Now if PGI says otherwise or implements a rule change or amendment, THEN it's cheating. Until then it's simply something that you either agree with or don't agree with, but that does not make it cheating.

PGI did NOT implement a group queue because of sync drops. Now that's a rather large misrepresentation and as someone who personally argued for, fought with, and otherwise spent a LOT of time and energy trying to garner support for the group queue, I find that a bit disingenuous. The group queue was implemented because groups and group players put pressure on PGI to do it, NOT because players were sync dropping.

I for one think there never should have been a queue split in the first place but that's neither here nor there. The ONLY advantage a group has over a solo player is VOIP. That's it. Nothing else. That is the ONLY difference. I've played a LOT in the solo queue lately for various reasons. In that time I've learned that the OP's opinion of solo players and the solo queue is not only extremely low, but, that when you're playing at the higher Elo brackets you get a LOT more teamwork and coordination. It's rare I'm not in a game where someone doesn't start offering up a strategy. More importantly players actually implement and execute the strategy.

I've seen some pretty complex tactics employed using text in the game. Entire teams sliding, rotating, focusing fire, etc. ALL without VOIP.

[Kjudoon]

Quote

Teamwork is not OP.

The people need to quit pretending and acting like it is in Derptown.

Quote

It is an advantage.

Absolutely, and a fair one.

Quote

The entire point and purpose of having a solo queue - the entire reason for it to exist, the whole crux behind which the solo queue was created separate from the group queue was, indeed, to have an environment where people who are not in a group can play against each other on an even footing.

Is it? How do you solve accidental syncs? You don't think for one second those haven't been happening constantly throughout the entirety of this queue's existence and will never go away, did you?

Quote

This is what makes it a different queue from 'the group queue'.

Really? What do you think the group queue is? Do you understand what the key difference is between a group and a solo sync?

1. A group will automatically drop same side no matter what.
2. The elo differences are averaged out hiding the good players and the bad players creating major elo mismatches.

1. A solo Sync may or may not have all members drop onto the same map.
2. A solo Sync may or may not end up on the same team.
3. A solo Sync WILL have far better elo matches because there is no group so elo is balanced individually, not by group average

Note the major differences? Still think a sync drop is the same as a group?

Quote

What you are doing is trying to exploit in the solo queue quite literally because you can't hack the group queue to play in groups. Group queues too hard? PLAY PRIVATE MATCHES.

Fine, make Private Matches give CBills and XP. If no, then that is not an option. As I have proven above, a Sync Drop is not the same as a group drop. Your position is insulting and petulant and pushing tantrum level. This is not an exploit. This is not cheating. It is time to cowboy up and accept that

Quote

Most people now have 7 days of premium time so premium private matches with your friends is now available.

The point is I shouldn't have to in a F2P game. There is no rule against Sync Drop. Why don't you play in private matches against your friends then?

Quote

That's exploiting and it's feeble. You can try and make excuses for exploiting and doing something that's feeble but that's all it is.

I think it's more feeble to blame losses and bad play on sync drops. Come on. You should be better than this.

Joseph Mallan, on 23 August 2014 - 08:43 PM, said:

New word for me! Thank you!

I have a Thesaurus... a dinosaur with a very large vocabulary.

[DaZur]

Joseph Mallan, on 23 August 2014 - 08:43 PM, said:

New word for me! Thank you!

SEE!!!

I'm not the only one around here who is able to assemble a sentence...

[Kjudoon]

Quote

You want to group? Go group queue. You want to play solo? Play solo queue.

PGI took away my preferred queue 1-4 traditional. So I have no queue that I like and can play with friends. I would love it if you and others would quit acting like the Solo Queue is some he man private feifdom of your control. It's not and me and my sync dropping buddies will be wandering through your fields picking your daisies as long as we want till either PGI gives us no reason to by giving us a third queue for small groups AND solo players, or they figure a way to ban sync drops... which let's face it unless they start doing IP tracking and TS tracking will never happen, and that will drive people out of the game with the NSA level of overmanagement.

[Sandpit]

MischiefSC, on 23 August 2014 - 08:59 PM, said:

If you enter a shooting contest for individual contestants to compare their shooting skills and you enter the rookie category because you are not that good but you've got a friend on a hill with a scoped rifle using a sabot round to match your caliber and have him plink out 10/10 for you while you put rounds in the dirt near the target....

you're cheating. Not because having a friend who's a good shot is bad but because you're exploiting the situation to get an advantage over the other contestants. Even if the contests rules don't say specifically 'you can't have someone else shoot for you and pass it off as your shots' that doesn't mean you're not cheating.

That's the difference. We're not even talking about you bringing a better rifle or better ammo, we're talking about you totally cheating the premise of a personal test of skill.

no, you're cheating because you've entered a single contestant contest and are letting someone else compete in your place. There is a HUGE difference in that.


here's an example for you.

You join a softball tournament for your work's softball team. Your team is extremely casual and doesn't practice much together. The tournament states that no professional teams are allowed and is for casual teams only. The opposing team practices daily and have played tournaments together for years. They have played together for years and are very good.

Does the opposing team have an advantage? Heck yea they do.
Is it cheating? Not by a longshot.
Should the first team run and complain to the tournament promoters because they aren't a "competitive" team and should only have to play against other "casual" teams?

[DaZur]

Sandpit, on 23 August 2014 - 09:10 PM, said:

Sand... You gotta alert us when your taking your meds and when you're not.

Times like tonight you are a beacon of rational thought and others I'm pretty sure are the result of an unscripted suplex...

Edited by DaZur, 23 August 2014 - 09:20 PM.

[Kjudoon]

DaZur, on 23 August 2014 - 09:16 PM, said:

SEE!!!

I'm not the only one around here who is able to assemble a sentence...

It's your cheeseheady goodness Dazur.